crazy truck! need help
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Joined: Sep 2007
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crazy truck! need help
Ok folks got one for you..
culprit..1988 E-350 w/460 fuel injected
Problem...starts right up! But as it warms up it will just shut right down.
New parts recently
new frame pump, new tank pump, new computer, new distributor and module, new relays,
Like i say you crank her over first thing in the morning she will fire right up, appx after 4 minutes of idle it just dies and will not refire. I walked away from it and came back 4 hours later reached in and cranked the key over and she fired right back up then as soon as it started to warm up it shut right off. I didnt rev it or put in gear or turn anything on actually i was standing behind the truck talking to my employee.
when i turn the key on the pumps are cycling. a few people at work threw some ideas around. like maybe fuel filter, etc.. any ideas ??
culprit..1988 E-350 w/460 fuel injected
Problem...starts right up! But as it warms up it will just shut right down.
New parts recently
new frame pump, new tank pump, new computer, new distributor and module, new relays,
Like i say you crank her over first thing in the morning she will fire right up, appx after 4 minutes of idle it just dies and will not refire. I walked away from it and came back 4 hours later reached in and cranked the key over and she fired right back up then as soon as it started to warm up it shut right off. I didnt rev it or put in gear or turn anything on actually i was standing behind the truck talking to my employee.
when i turn the key on the pumps are cycling. a few people at work threw some ideas around. like maybe fuel filter, etc.. any ideas ??
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ok i didnt go back far enough in my description.. yes the filter (frame filter was changed several weeks ago..by previous owner. see i bought the van not running. he chased his tail for a while and got sick and tired throwing money at it. He did the reman dizzy, and filters. I did the foward the pump, rear pump, puter, relays, plugs and finally with help from this forum i found it to be a missing ground on the battery ground that grounds the puter.. ran fine after that about 100 miles ago. now this is a new problem that has cropped up. someone suggested it may be the stator in the reman dizzy as they are known to be a problem. funny thing is it fires up cold fine then as it warms up it just dies. then you have to wait awhile maybe the next day she will fire up again then just die out like you shut the key off.. now i have not yet even looked to see if there is spark or used a noid light at the injectors. I suspect electrical (spark related) just thought maybe someone had a similar occurence and fixed theirs.
Posting Guru
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 1,208
Likes: 2
From: North Reading Mass
The coil or ICM can fail after they warm up. Over the years I had several GM, Mopar, and Ford DS2 modules exhibit the same pattern before complete failure. All were over 10 years old and in most of the cases I replaced the coil too if it was original. I used a hair dryer to bring the component up to 120 deg for testing.
regards
rikard
regards
rikard
Cargo Master
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 3,118
Likes: 149
From: South Dakota
I was going to mention the coil, but rikard just did. And yes the stator in the reman dizzy as you mentioned, rebuilt distributors have a terrible reputation. I suggest changing the coil if you haven't already. Followed by another rebuilt dizzy or having the stator replaced in the one you have.
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thanks guys, they sound like excellent starting points, question is the stator hard to change out, i am familiar with removal of dizzy and timing issues that go along with removal. i was just thinking too. i do have the original dizzy that apparently may be still good as that change didnt get the engine running. heck i might as well drop that one in and see.. now i would have to pick a coil up at advance. i will keep you all posted. thanks again..
Cargo Master
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 3,118
Likes: 149
From: South Dakota
Yes, it can be difficult. You have to remove the distributor first. Then with a small puller pull off the drive gear and disassemble the dizzy. I have never done this myself. I had the Ford garage change the stator in my '88 after it finally died completely.
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Logistics Pro
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 4,698
Likes: 47
From: Mexico, Missouri
Just a quick ?
Is the TFI on this vehicle located on the driver side of the frame under the hood or is it located on the dizzy itself? There were known issues with the TFI module being located near the engine block since heat would make it fail after prolong periods of heat. that is why Ford introduced the "Remote Mounted" version. I would try and check the TFI it if is indeed located near the block and if it was ever changed, be sure it was "Replaced" with the correct one.
If you can find a known good one, I would just the TFI to be sure it is not the culprit either. Murphy's law applies.
Definately interested in what's causing your problem. Post back with any updates.
Is the TFI on this vehicle located on the driver side of the frame under the hood or is it located on the dizzy itself? There were known issues with the TFI module being located near the engine block since heat would make it fail after prolong periods of heat. that is why Ford introduced the "Remote Mounted" version. I would try and check the TFI it if is indeed located near the block and if it was ever changed, be sure it was "Replaced" with the correct one.
If you can find a known good one, I would just the TFI to be sure it is not the culprit either. Murphy's law applies.
Definately interested in what's causing your problem. Post back with any updates.
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Joined: Sep 2007
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yes tfi is mounted on the dizzy. now that was replaced at the same time previous owner put in new/reman dizzy. I am assuming that it should be ok. my previous experience with the tfi problems were usually eratic missing etc.. i wont know till monday when i get back to the jobsite. i will let everyone know how i made out. apparently this is pretty frequent problem with the later 80's 460s (shutting off after warming up) i do really want to get her running proper as it is one of my main work trucks at the site. I know when she is running right it is smooth and powerful. thanks all
Elder User
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 690
Likes: 1
From: Madison Ohio
I had almost the same problem with my 76 390 years back. Reman dizzy, would run for X amount of time and just die. Let it sit and it would fire back up .. run and die. Pickup coil magnet was broken in to like 3 or 4 pieces. Changed it and was fine.
Logistics Pro
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 4,698
Likes: 47
From: Mexico, Missouri
Looks like the P.O. was doing his homework.
Just on the basis of "one size fiits all", did the P.O. replace the TFI module with the correct one? I don't mean to sound repetitous Boots. I just know that to many times people replace "A part" with "B part/or Similar". My advice may in turn have nothing to do with the mentioned problem. I just looked at 3 different brands so could be a brand problem. Here is the rundown for a 88, 460, Econoline
Motorcraft:Ignition Control Module
7.5L 460 CID 8 Cylinders; Color: Gray, E7TE-12127-BC
Also boots, did the P.O. apply some Artic silver or similar thermal compund to the back side of the TFI? On both the Dizzy and Remote mounted TFI systems, the back of the unit must be clean and thermal compound applied to the back to ensure it continues to perform cool and correctly.
Just thought I would throw that into the equation.
Look forward to your updates on this.
Just on the basis of "one size fiits all", did the P.O. replace the TFI module with the correct one? I don't mean to sound repetitous Boots. I just know that to many times people replace "A part" with "B part/or Similar". My advice may in turn have nothing to do with the mentioned problem. I just looked at 3 different brands so could be a brand problem. Here is the rundown for a 88, 460, Econoline
Motorcraft:Ignition Control Module
7.5L 460 CID 8 Cylinders; Color: Gray, E7TE-12127-BC
Also boots, did the P.O. apply some Artic silver or similar thermal compund to the back side of the TFI? On both the Dizzy and Remote mounted TFI systems, the back of the unit must be clean and thermal compound applied to the back to ensure it continues to perform cool and correctly.
Just thought I would throw that into the equation.
Look forward to your updates on this.
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Timber.. they are good questions, I hadnt thought of making sure the tfi was right for the application..hmm yeah i know a lot of the tfi look the same and fit the same. heck my 88 302 tfi will swap over to my 86 ranger 2.9 will they do the same job?? I doubt it too. I will check that out for sure. and I cannot say for sure if the PO applied the "stuff" to the backing plate or not. You all have givin me lots of ideas to go on with this problem thats why i enjoy this forum so much. I have saved countless $$$$ checking out problems before running to the auto stores with wadds of cash. seems like most of you are definately thinking either coil or stator problem, or tfi. Thanks all
Elder User
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 797
Likes: 1
From: ohio
Why wont it restart? No spark? No fuel? I would check the coil first. But i would also get it running and when it dies check spark at coil wire, Try a lil starting fluid ect. I would also try checking or changing the coolant sensor by the dist, even checking the connections to it. Aftermarket tfi modules are poop! Maybe its crappin out! I always keep a spare in my glove box just in case.
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Deez.. was very hecktic at work friday and after she shut off me and the crew 5 guys messed around about 5 minutes of course everybody had a diffrent idea and meanwhile running the battery down. I went out and got some gas for her (at my paps request) and of course that was no help. so i just canned the idea and got the fellas back to work. about 4 hours i was walking past the old girl and just thought what the hey,, and she fired up. so no i didnt really get down and dirty with it and check for spark and such. although i did hear the foward pump relaying.