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1980 - 1986 Bullnose F100, F150 & Larger F-Series Trucks Discuss the Early Eighties Bullnose Ford Truck

missing-backfire after overheating

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Old Apr 2, 2011 | 02:43 PM
  #31  
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My problem started when the bolt that holds the damper/pulley actually fell out and and I ended up with severe overheat. The woodruff key and the slot it inserts into on the crank had a nice tight fit when I replaced the damper/pulley. Novice at this but wouldn't the pulley/damper just spin on the crank if the key was broken?
Removed #1 plug and cranked engine until the notch on the pulley/damper was aligned with TDC that's stamped/moulded on the timing cover. #1 is not at TDC dist rotor is pointing at #4 cylinder. With #1 at TDC the notch is positioned not quite 180 degrees away. If the notch is the mark on the pulley/damper that should line with up the TDC mark on timing cover and not the fine mark on the surface of the pulley/damper that would align with the missing timing mark on pass or left side facing engine. I have rotated the engine numerous time looking for the finer mark on the pulley and cannot find one. I'am glad you cleared up my earlier quote on timing marks. At least now I have one reference point when before I had none.
Keeping in mind that my current problem is a steady miss in #1 & 2 and lack of power.
 
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Old Apr 2, 2011 | 03:05 PM
  #32  
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Originally Posted by gordo2
My problem started when the bolt that holds the damper/pulley actually fell out and and I ended up with severe overheat. The woodruff key and the slot it inserts into on the crank had a nice tight fit when I replaced the damper/pulley. Novice at this but wouldn't the pulley/damper just spin on the crank if the key was broken?
Removed #1 plug and cranked engine until the notch on the pulley/damper was aligned with TDC that's stamped/moulded on the timing cover. #1 is not at TDC dist rotor is pointing at #4 cylinder. With #1 at TDC the notch is positioned not quite 180 degrees away. If the notch is the mark on the pulley/damper that should line with up the TDC mark on timing cover and not the fine mark on the surface of the pulley/damper that would align with the missing timing mark on pass or left side facing engine. I have rotated the engine numerous time looking for the finer mark on the pulley and cannot find one. I'am glad you cleared up my earlier quote on timing marks. At least now I have one reference point when before I had none.
Keeping in mind that my current problem is a steady miss in #1 & 2 and lack of power.
In order to get #1 at top dead center on compression stroke, you need to pull the #1 spark plug, hold your finger over it til you can hear/feel air coming out. Don't go buy the timing marks, because they are obviously off. The rotor should be pointing at the #1 tower on the dist. at this time, if not you'll need to pull the dist and reinstall it with the tower pointing to #1. You should also torque the damper bolt to its proper spec of 130 to 150 ft lbs.
 
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Old Apr 2, 2011 | 04:06 PM
  #33  
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From: rocky mountains colorado
Question

Finger in the plug hole on #1 is how I found TDC. rotor is pointing at #1. Torqued damper bolt to 150 when I replaced pulley.
I guess I'am back to either lifters, valve springs or blown head gasket between cylinders 1 & 2?? Next step I guess is to redo leak down and compression checks. I would appreciate any-all other suggestions comments. Still would like not to have to pull head, dam thing weighs 80 lbs plus all the work. If I have I have to but would like to make sure it's necessary.
 
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Old Apr 2, 2011 | 04:09 PM
  #34  
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pull your distributor and check the gear on it to see if the pin is sheared before you take the head off. I checked for the timing mark that bolts to your timing cover and Its not where I put it.
 
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Old Apr 2, 2011 | 05:00 PM
  #35  
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Thanks, I appreciate your efforts. I can always set up my own timing marks on the damper and use the timing cover for reference. This is a new dist and I have had it in and out number of times and have made sure gear pin is in place. Appreciate you help.
 
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Old Apr 3, 2011 | 02:02 PM
  #36  
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Originally Posted by gordo2
Thanks, I appreciate your efforts. I can always set up my own timing marks on the damper and use the timing cover for reference. This is a new dist and I have had it in and out number of times and have made sure gear pin is in place. Appreciate you help.

If your pully only has the one mark, some aftermarket ones do not have both... then you can add the second mark yourself, only if you are absolutely sure that the timing is at TDC on the number 1 cylinder.

I agree check the compression again wouldn't hurt, keeping your mind about #1 and #2, then go from there.

It does sound like you are going to have to remove the head unfortunately and see what's going on underneath.

With the other possiblities you mentioned, look for the possibility of gaulled rings as well due to the overheat. #1 and #2 cylinders are right at the front where the thermostat housing is, so they got the most heat when things got hot.
 
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Old Apr 4, 2011 | 05:55 PM
  #37  
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I decided to start tests over again and do the basics. Only had time to do vacuum test today, but this time when doing the test I sprayed starter fluid directly into the intake manifold gasket and rpms raised on cylinders #1 & #2. This probably accounts for low vac reading of 13 inches. Could this also be part or all my problems on 1 & 2? Still alot of work to change manifold gaskets but easier than the head gasket.
 
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Old Apr 4, 2011 | 08:01 PM
  #38  
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When you did the leak down test, were you listening for air escaping from the carb and
exhaust and oil filler cap, and looking for bubbles in the radiator? If not, I would go do that
test again and not be worried so much about percentage of loss but more about from where
the air is escaping.
 
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Old Apr 5, 2011 | 01:47 PM
  #39  
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Originally Posted by gordo2
I decided to start tests over again and do the basics. Only had time to do vacuum test today, but this time when doing the test I sprayed starter fluid directly into the intake manifold gasket and rpms raised on cylinders #1 & #2. This probably accounts for low vac reading of 13 inches. Could this also be part or all my problems on 1 & 2? Still alot of work to change manifold gaskets but easier than the head gasket.
A blown or warped intake manifold or gasket, should not lower the compression of the #1 or #2 cylinders during a compression test. Air is still being "sucked" into the cylinder to be compressed etc... Via the leak or via the carb air horn. Still do a compression test again and see if the readings are significantly lower for #1 and #2 than the rest. Also do what CTUBUTIS describes. That should also help to narrow it down some.

However, it will lower the vacuum reading, because the engine is sucking air through the potential intake leak. This can also cause a miss if it's too severe. Dilutes the fuel mixture. The stock intake manifold is of a LOG design. So if you have an intake leak on one end, the whole of the engine cylinders is affected as they are all connected together by passages. It will be more affected the closer it is to the leak though.

The odds of just having an intake manifold leak severe enough to kill cylinders, without an exaust manifold leak are remote as they share the same hold down bolts. Unless of course the intake manifold is cracked or warped. Check for a cracked or warped intake manifold etc...
 
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Old Apr 11, 2011 | 05:26 PM
  #40  
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Replaced the manifold gasket, pretty badly shot, probably from the over heating. Now have good idle, no miss, with vac guage reading on the low side but still 17-18 inches. Have not redone compression test but will. Happy with where I am at this point. I would have never guessed a two cylinder misfire from a bad gasket, but as you said "if bad enough it can cause a misfire". I appreciate all your help. Great group, good helpful information.
 
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Old Apr 11, 2011 | 06:34 PM
  #41  
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Originally Posted by gordo2
...vac guage reading on the low side but still 17-18 inches.
You need to remember that you're at 5,000 feet and your readings will therefore
necessarily be lower, i guess the "standard rule of thumb" is to expect "approximately 1
inch of mercury (lower) for every 1,000 feet of altitude gain."

This means your 17-18 where you live will be 22-23 down at sea level.

Tips on Reading Gauges: Vacuum Gauges
 
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