Forgot to number...
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Elder User
Joined: Apr 2010
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From: Mount pleasant, michigan
Forgot to number...
Newbie engine builder mistake...forgot to mark the rod caps what number they were..and also which way the arrows point on my pistons, this is my 79 400 motor im building to go in my 78 F150 4x4 that has a dead 351m in it. Thanks for any input guys!
Posting Guru
Joined: Nov 2009
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From: Norton, MA
Are you wondering how to tell which caps go with which rods, or which rod/cap assemblies go in which order on the crank?
You can match up rods and caps by look and feel pretty effectively on a well worn engine, which rods where on the crank though is a different story. You can tell which sides of rods were up against the sides of counterweights and which sides were up against other rod sides.
You can match up rods and caps by look and feel pretty effectively on a well worn engine, which rods where on the crank though is a different story. You can tell which sides of rods were up against the sides of counterweights and which sides were up against other rod sides.
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Elder User
Joined: Apr 2010
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From: Mount pleasant, michigan
No, i have mismatched rods and caps, and i was wondering if there anyway to tell which cap goes to with rod? I have the numbers off each rod and each cap written down, and theres no direct number corralation between them.
Then, each of the pistons, has a arrow stamped on the top. I was wondering if that arrow is supposed to point towards the front of the motor like the main caps or point towards the back?
Then, each of the pistons, has a arrow stamped on the top. I was wondering if that arrow is supposed to point towards the front of the motor like the main caps or point towards the back?
Senior User
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 379
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From: Delavan, IL
IIRC, the arrows always go to the front. As far as matching the caps to rods, you'll have to look and match. Often times the forgings have different notches, grind marks, etc. that will leave a print or mark on their mating surface. Good luck!
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Elder User
Joined: Apr 2010
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From: Mount pleasant, michigan
This is what i have for numbers off the caps and rods, all the caps and rods have "D1AE-AA" stamped into them on one side, and here goes the rest;
R1:A818-XV
R2:B805-XV
R3:B815-YB
R4:B811-XX
R5:B321-YB
R6:A797-XN
R7:A819-XV
R8:B778-XB
Then this is what the caps say;
C1:12 (I cant see anything else on it)
C2:60-S
C3:59-S
C4:60-S
C5:58-S
C6:60-S
C7:F16
C8:60-S
^^^the S to those numbers (i.e. 60,58,59) are cast under the numbers like this i.e.
"60"
S
I have the caps numbered just to tell them apart from the others and they arent the correct numbers.
R1:A818-XV
R2:B805-XV
R3:B815-YB
R4:B811-XX
R5:B321-YB
R6:A797-XN
R7:A819-XV
R8:B778-XB
Then this is what the caps say;
C1:12 (I cant see anything else on it)
C2:60-S
C3:59-S
C4:60-S
C5:58-S
C6:60-S
C7:F16
C8:60-S
^^^the S to those numbers (i.e. 60,58,59) are cast under the numbers like this i.e.
"60"
S
I have the caps numbered just to tell them apart from the others and they arent the correct numbers.
Posting Guru
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 1,219
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From: Norton, MA
In my experience, the numbers on them don't mean much of anything, and I made the same mistake of not numbering when I tore down my old 400 (thought I could just keep the order in my head till I got my hands clean). But, like Samick said, and I hinted at earlier, you can match them up visually and by feel. Look for wear patterns to continue from cap to rod on every face, outside there will be grind marks as was mentioned, inside there will likely be some heat marks and possibly even cuts if you had bearing issues, on the sides there will be wear from other rods and from the crank. You won't get them all right on the first look, but there are only 8 of each, it's not so bad, and you'll know when you have it. If a cap does not mesh with a rod absolutely seamlessly to the touch on the inside, take it off and out it in the unknown pile, and try another.
Goodluck, Alex
Goodluck, Alex
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From: Mount pleasant, michigan
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Posting Guru
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,735
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From: Wingo, Ky
Cranked up my buddies 78 400 in his Bronco today for the first time. Rebuilt it in 2 days so it would be ready for a mud bog Saturday. Now we gotta drive it around some and try to get er loosened up a little before Saturday. To my amazement when we took it apart somebody had been in it before and correctly numbered everything so we didn't have to fiddle with marking out numbers and stamping new ones.
The engine had to be rebuilt b/c last Sunday my buddy went through to big of a water hole filled the engine full of water and drove it back to the trailer with no oil pressure. Main and rod bearings looked horrible, crank had to be turned.
The engine had to be rebuilt b/c last Sunday my buddy went through to big of a water hole filled the engine full of water and drove it back to the trailer with no oil pressure. Main and rod bearings looked horrible, crank had to be turned.
Posting Guru
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 1,219
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From: Norton, MA
Ranger: Haha, ooooo...... Well, wellllllll. I'm gunna say, if you get them sanded so smooth that there is no difference between them (not enough to tell them apart), then you might be OK.
Talk to someone who knows more than me for a definitive on that though.
Talk to someone who knows more than me for a definitive on that though.
Fleet Mechanic
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,326
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From: Middle TN
What you need to do is take your rods and caps to an engine builder or machine shop that has a "rod conditioner". They can quickly match them up when the conditioner measures the bore on them.
If you make a mistake on match you could seize an engine or have a loose rod.
If you make a mistake on match you could seize an engine or have a loose rod.
Posting Guru
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,305
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From: Montgomery, IL
I think the word you are looking for right now is screwed. The best advice I can give you is to take the rods and caps to your local engine builder and have him resize them to make them true.
Also, invest in a number punch set for the future.
Good luck,
Mark
Also, invest in a number punch set for the future.
Good luck,
Mark
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Elder User
Joined: Apr 2010
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From: Mount pleasant, michigan
Well im pretty sure i figured them all out, i just had a pile of rod caps, and all my rods lined up, and tried to see which ouit of 8 rod caps slipped onto the rod the easiest, and i figured that was the one that was mated to it. I did this for all of them and they all seemed to slip on pretty good.