OPPY: Posts here are inherently opinion, very, very few of the posts here say: "This is my opinion . . .". They state their belief and others are free to accept it or not. I have done no different.

I also continue to believe I have passed on good information. If I find out different, I will be just as quick to post a retraction.

 

Sorry, I just have to respond to this.

You can imagine having GEAR oils last over 100K miles, in transmissions and differentials, but not motor oils.

Thermal breakdown is just one reason why oil needs to be changed in an engine. There are three other very important reasons:

• An engine has very soft sliding bearings and piston rings designed to scrape cylinder walls. This creates fine steel, molybdenum, or carbon fiber particles in the oil. The oil itself IS NOT the source of this "dirt." The oil filter will filter them to a point, but NO ENGINE has 100% filtering efficiency. All engines have oil filter bypasses that kick in at high RPM, to keep the oil filter from exploding. It's always better to lubricate the engine with dirty oil than with no oil. But this will embed the particles in the bearings and get them inside hydraulic lifters. Magnets can only help the steel, and only partially.
  
• Consumption of additive package. Some 20% of the volume of oil consists of various additives. Synthetic or conventional. Most important are the anti-frothing additives that prevent air pockets from getting into the bearings and lifters; without this, the crankshaft will beat the oil into whipped cream, especially at high RPM, and the phosphate anti-scuff additives that keep the camshaft lobes from flattening. These get used up with time and heat, just because the engine is running.
  
• Combustion fouling. ALL ENGINES USE OIL. If your engine appears not to, that is because the volume is getting replaced with combustion products, especially water. If your engine isn't using oil with that caveat, it isn't running. End of story. Engine oil is directly in contact with combustion products through normal piston ring blow-by. And combustion producst are always poorer lubricants than even the worst motor oil. How you could possibly claim that SynLube or any other oil can reduce this variable with a straight face is beyond me. Piston rings have gaps in them from the day they are installed, or they destroy the engine on the first warm up.
  

Now, there are a few advantages to synthetic oil, but they haven't even been mentioned. Most important if you live in an emissions controlled area is that it will not burn, and will not raise hydrocarbons even if the valve seals leak like a water faucet. They also do not form sludge, and have a much greater temperature tolerance (though if your engine is cooking conventional oil, it is having a problem that is not related to the oil).

And, frankly, why on EARTH would I spend $200 on an oil change when I can do it with Mobil 1 for $30 or so? $40 if I want to put in a magnetic oil plug.

 

Very good post Michael!

I couldnt agree more!


BTW Welcome to FTE!

 

ROFL haven't we been through all this before?

My argument was that the PTFE (teflon) would burn causing acid, dropping the TBN like a rock, and that the Molybdenum Disulfide (MoS2) in it would gum up the lifters. After a while the filter gets plugged up, either with the teflon or the graphite which it contains, or the combustion byproducts (soot). Just because the oil has good soot handling capabilities does not mean it's not gonna get stuck in the filter. I dont care how good the filter is, it's going to get plugged up eventually.

They say that because it's a colloidal solution, these problems somehow dont appear. I'd like more scientific information about it. When something as radical as this comes to market, they better have some good proof that it does what it says it can.

Well, the quick definition of a colloid is "Solids suspended in a liquid." So yes, it is a colloid. And yes, it proves nothing.

See here for more information about it.

My advice: Use a CI-4 / SL rated dino, change it and the filter every 3000 miles, and be happy.

 

Seems like it's every few days, eh? Good post, rusty.

If you really take some time and dig into the Synlube website, there's not much there other than supposition and seemingly unbelieveable claims without much in the line of hard data to support it. I think I'd be more inclined to seriously consider the product if there was more objective analytical data to support the claims.

 

Houckster


I notice that you seem to think this stuff is the greatest thing since sliced bread. I've got a question for you. What is your connection to this company? Do you work for them? Own the company? I find it hard to believe anybody would post as much as you do on this subject unless you have a stake in it. Any info would be appreciated. Thanks

James.

 

Hi Mike, welcome to FTE!

Thanks for taking the time to post. I tend to agree with your comments, as well.

Regarding your point about additive packages, I would suspect that the SynLube oil is probably comprised of an even greater percentage of additives than most oils ...its weight "span" (5w-50) and it's VI would seem to indicate a super heavy dose of polymers, for starters. And extended drain intervals to the degree claimed (i.e., never) must require, I have to think, a very heavy dose of additives in general if the oil has any chance whatsoever of holding up for that long.

 

I keep getting asked about whether I make any money for talking about SynLube.

In 2002, I made $14,000,000,067, my take in 2003 was $24,724,000,000. Other than that, I just talk about SynLube out of the goodness of my heart. IN TRUTH, I am a customer only and derive absolutely no income from this company either in commission, payroll, or referral fees. I have used this product and my experiences with this product have been excellent, better than with any dino or conventional synthetic I've ever used. That is the only reason I use and talk about the product. It is my hope that others here will enjoy their trucks more and save money by using this product.

I know just how Custer must have felt.

I have heard some whopping theories before but some of the ones above simply have me agape. When people don't want to hear the truth, they can make up any excuse to deny the value of a product. The idea that I didn't show any oil burning with SynLube because contaminants were filling up the void has to be a new low. The concept of colloids (PTFE, graphite and synthetic moly) continues to be completely misunderstood even though there's a very cogent explanation of the principle should anyone care to really read it. Then again, there's the classic fallback: I want more scientific information.

It seems to make no difference that the oil meets every performance specification of the OEMs (including heavy truck manufacturers) and the military nor does it matter that the formula has not been modified since 1996 because it has been meeting the latest automotive engine requirements for years. It's got to be snakeoil! Try and find SynLube on the FTC website. Though SynLube is a tiny company, in this litigious society they would have been hauled up before the FTC long before now if their product wasn't all they say it is.

The fact of the matter is that people here are happy with dino oil (or sometimes conventional synthetics) and don't want to hear about anything better. For reasons I don't totally understand, it's almost patriotic to stand up for dino oil. The cynical side of me suggests that maybe the reason is that if it were admitted that SynLube was a valid product, that its detractors would have to admit they'd been duped by the dino oil companies all along.

If I detected any serious desire to really understand SynLube, it would be different. I can be very patient with serious inquiries even if in the end, that person decides to continue using what they have used in the past. Here, there seems to be no real desire to understand, just to detract.

With regard to the speculations about the percent of additives in the SynLube formula which is about the only serious comment here, I would simply state that the formula is proprietary so one guess is about as good as another. I would point out though that every component of the SynLube formula is a synthetic and inert so that many of the additives that are in dino oil are not required in SynLube since there is minimal blowby with SynLube's superior sealing and because the lubricant itself does not require the protective additives petroleum does. I am told by SynLube that the additive package is substantial but that does not necessarily pertain to the percentage of the volume since the higher quality additives SynLube does use are very concentrated. This is important since many additives have no lubricating function in themselves. My guess is that the percentage of additives in the formula is probably considerably less than with dino oil. Additionally, SynLube has told me that oil analysis of their formula at the end of its service life shows that the oil continues to retain most of its capabilities. The 150K mile/3K engine hour replacement interval is very conservative.

As my signature indicates, I installed SynLube at 784 miles. I'll be using this oil next year and the year after that and the engine won't fall apart as some of you suppose. Of course, by that time there won't be anything in the crankcase except contaminants, right?

I will be glad to respond to serious inquiries but the kind of responses I've seen here will simply be ignored. If someone here has submitted what they consider to be a serious question and I have misinterpreted it, than I apologize. Post again and I will answer.

 

Read the original question. I seriously wanted to know the facts so I can take them into my own consideration.

 

Hey, i think people like dino better cause the HAVE to change it every 3,000 miles, what fun would owning a truck be if it was maintenince free? Otherwise we'd have to start breaking things so we could have somthing to work on. Here's a serious question. What makes synlube seal better than regular synthetics? Does it just create a thicker "film" between the cylinder walls and the rings, how does it work?

 

Lone_Ranger01: I did not include you in my previous post's comments. The posts I referred to seemed to purposely be unfair. Yours is a really good question and I'm glad to spend the time to answer it, even if you never use the product.

With regard to sealing at the piston rings, first consider that SynLube includes 5 liquid (PAO, polyol esters etc.) and 3 solid lubricants (PTFE, synthetic moly, graphite) that are designed to complement each other's properties. The solid lubricants are very important and they perform the function of filling the microscopic pores in the cylinder wall providing lubrication as well as minimizing gaps between the rings and the wall. This is something a liquid lubricant can't do well and because the solid lubricants are in the form of colloids (0.3-1.3 microns) that are permanently suspended in the liquid lubricant (lyophilic sol), when they are not embossed in the cylinder wall, this protection is constantly renewed as the engine functions. SynLube informs me that because of their properties, they actually do more of the protective work than the liquid lubricants do. SOHC and DOHC engines are especially well protected by SynLube since the critical cam lobe surfaces have to wait a while for the oil system to start delivering oil.

Even in the coldest weather startups, I have never heard the first indication of the engine running dry. I believe most of us know what that sounds like. It may only last a second or two but a very expensive second or two.

Note too that because the colloids are embossed in the cylinder walls, they will not drain off in time like dino oil will. Like other synthetic lubricants, the liquid lubes also have a polar attraction to metal parts and don't drain off quickly. I had some indication of this when I had my Focus SVT. A couple hours after shutting the engine down, I checked the oil level and it was down more than I expected. I was puzzled by this but let it ride since it was well above the "add" mark. Two days later, I checked it again. It had not been run since that the first oil check but now the level was right at the "full" mark.

Because the components of SynLube are inert, they are extremely durable in the presence of heat and the issue of blowby in a healthy engine is reduced to a minute level. Consequently, SynLube never has to deal with the level of contaminants that will eventually contaminate dino oil and therefore the oil retains its full capabilities for years, not months.

In contrast to conventional oils, dry lubrication conditions that cause much wear at startup are eliminated. I have noticed that my engine is particularly quick to start and rev immediately to about 2K. Everytime this happens, I'm glad I've used SynLube.

All this stuff sounds good, indeed the experience I've had has been excellent but the thing that really impressed me was Miro Kefurt, his background and his willingness to share information. Everything he's ever told me has worked out. He know's his stuff. When I placed my order he called to ask about how I used my vehicle and made service recommendations accordingly. That impressed me and help me get over the fears I had using this product. Getting away from the 3K oil change interval was not easy for me.

If you decide to give SynLube a try, and I am not assuming you will, but if you decide to and if you have a lot of miles on your engine with dino oil, I would suggest that you run Mobil 1 for around 3K miles or so to dislodge any dino oil buildup. After that, SynLube can provide its maximum quality of service.

If I have not answered all of your question. Please advise.

 

Houckster, if you don't mind emailing me, I would like to here more of your experiences with this product and ask a couple of questions. I assume that no one else on this thread cares to hear more about it, so that's why I ask that you email me.

 

I really know nothing about this product but am a firm believer of synthetics. I'm also a firm believer that Detroit is in the pockets of the large oil companies. I also believe in planned obselencies(sp) and have seen it in action on more than a few occasions.

I think what really needs to be done to prove or disprove products like this, is an independent testing firm that can compare various products. The only problem is finding a company that can be truely independent. Many times a product can be better in ever way but it gets drowned out by the larger companies and there false counter claims. Anyone remember Tucker cars?

I'll tell you one thing though if a product like this can be proven to work as advertised I'll be the first one to sign up.

 

Because the edit time ran out on my first post, here's the full text of my response. It's a long post but these questions warranted the time. I truly hope it's helpful.

Lone_Ranger01: I did not include you in my previous post's comments. The posts I referred to seemed to purposely be unfair. Yours is a really good question and I'm glad to spend the time to answer it, even if you never use the product.

The following will answer why I believe that SynLube is worth the high initial expense. I'll use Peter94's question to do that.

With regard to sealing at the piston rings, first consider that SynLube includes 5 liquid (PAO, polyol esters etc.) and 3 solid lubricants (PTFE, synthetic moly, graphite) that are designed to complement each other's properties. The solid lubricants are very important and they perform the function of filling the microscopic pores in the cylinder wall providing lubrication as well as minimizing gaps between the rings and the wall. This is something a liquid lubricant can't do well and because the solid lubricants are in the form of colloids (0.3-1.3 microns) that are permanently suspended in the liquid lubricant (lyophilic sol), when they are not embossed in the cylinder wall, this protection is constantly renewed as the engine functions. SynLube informs me that because of their properties, they actually do more of the protective work than the liquid lubricants do. SOHC and DOHC engines are especially well protected by SynLube since the critical cam lobe surfaces have to wait a while for the oil system to start delivering oil.

Even in the coldest weather startups, I have never heard the first indication of the engine running dry. I believe most of us know what that sounds like. It may only last a second or two but a very expensive second or two.

Note too that because the colloids are embossed in the cylinder walls, they will not drain off in time like dino oil will. Like other synthetic lubricants, the liquid lubes also have a polar attraction to metal parts and don't drain off quickly. I had some indication of this when I had my Focus SVT. A couple hours after shutting the engine down, I checked the oil level and it was down more than I expected. I was puzzled by this but let it ride since it was well above the "add" mark. Two days later, I checked it again. It had not been run since that the first oil check but now the level was right at the "full" mark.

Because the components of SynLube are inert, they are extremely durable in the presence of heat and the issue of blowby in a healthy engine is reduced to a minute level. Consequently, SynLube never has to deal with the level of contaminants that will eventually contaminate dino oil and therefore the oil retains its full capabilities for years, not months.

In contrast to conventional oils, dry lubrication conditions that cause much wear at startup are eliminated. I have noticed that my engine is particularly quick to start and rev immediately to about 2K. Everytime this happens, I'm glad I've used SynLube.

All this stuff sounds good, indeed the experience I've had has been excellent but the thing that really impressed me was Miro Kefurt, his background and his willingness to share information. Everything he's ever told me has worked out. He know's his stuff. When I placed my order he called to ask about how I used my vehicle and made service recommendations accordingly. That impressed me and helped me get over the fears I had using this product. Getting away from the 3K oil change interval was not easy for me.

SynLube isn't just better because it lubricates better.

Now in a response to Oppy, I also talked about the time savings involved with avoiding about 32 oil changes. I cannot imagine that this is an unsubtantial advantage. I don't know how much you pay to change your oil but I would make three points: First) If you change your oil, as I have done in the past, I am not sorry to avoid getting dirty changing it along with the inevitable cleanup involving small spills and the disposal of the old oil, filter and new bottles. Secondly, from an environmental standpoint, this practice is a disaster. Over 100K miles were talking about 150 quarts of toxic waste and lots of room taken up at the landfill with the bottles for which no recycle program exists. Third, even if you change your oil personally, it will be hard to beat the per miles cost of SynLube. I have done several simulations on a spreadsheet plugging in different assumptions. There was usually a $200-300 advantage to using SynLube.

SynLube also provides better gas mileage. True, the vast majority of my experience with SynLube is in 2 Ford Focus cars but I cannot imagine it will be different with my Ranger.

Peter94, LoneRanger_01: If you decide to give SynLube a try, and I am not assuming you will, but if you decide to and if you have a lot of miles on your engine with dino oil, I would suggest that you run Mobil 1 for around 3K miles or so to dislodge any dino oil buildup. After that, SynLube can provide its maximum quality of service.

If I have not answered all of your question. Please advise.

 

Lone_Ranger01: I would be glad to answer some private questions but I'm having trouble finding out how to e-mail you. I think there must be some kind of switch you have to set so there's a link on your posts that can be used to send the e-mail.

Wait, I just found out how.