I thought these things went into limp mode at 250 or so oil temp.

 

It depends on how the situation unfolds. It's possible to find yourself on the side of the road with steam and smoke everywhere, thousands in repairs, and not a single warning from the instrument panel. It usuially happens to "not mechanical savvy" owners when things go bad very fast. There have been several posters here who have experienced that type of failure and came here to complain about the POS 6.0. That's why it's important to run a monitor of some type even if you're not a mechanic.

 

About the standpipe--could you get a pic of the oil filter housing looking at the inside? I'm curious to see what the standpipe looks like--if it's even still there.

 

A monitor with a programmable alarm like the Edge, not sure if any others have it.

 

As Anthony put it, the only way to ensure a quality repair is to replace with a long block. Sure, you might get lucky replacing a few components here and there, but ultimately if you want to do right by this customer he needs a full long block replacement along with the usual that doesn't come with the block from Ford. I'd almost even suggest an engine from a wrecked truck, provided it was certified as running.

Regardless, if it were me, I'd replace the block since I don't want to be married to customers or them to me.

 

I still want to understand WHY the engine got too hot. One of our contacts at Ford, spoke to a tech and at my end of the telephone-game I heard mention of bad EGR cooler and/or oil cooler. My point is, why throw a longblock at it if you haven't addressed the root cause of failure?! We got quoted around $10,000 for longblock and around $13,000 for "dressed" engine with new turbo (and whatver else. I forgot, and the guy didn't sound too confident about his definition either.)




Here is another pic below. My brain didn't have the scale correct looking at pictures, but with the piece of plastic in my hand today, it didn't look like it was a complete standpipe. I can't tell. Not enough experience on these.


Can I not just fish out the plastic? I need to look at oil circuit again, but wouldn't it just fall into the highpop rez screen in the valley and go no further?

I know what lack of oil does to engines, but what warrants a long block? Please explain to me what has exactly failed now that a plastic standpipe has melted. The fact that the truck died isn't good, but it still cranks. Engine isn't seized. The way it makes sense in my head, whether I am wrong or not, would be that possibly it lost low oil pressure, at which point it looses high oil pressure and dies. Are you suggesting the pistons have burned up, or bearings, or what?

 

The reason it got hot was lack of cooling whether from boiled coolant, masisve leak, clogged oil cooler, bad water pump, bad fan, etc, etc. Also the egr cooler mostly goes when the oil cooler is clogged. As far as flushing you can't. Once that plastic melted and cooled it is where it is for the duration. On that pic if that is ALL that is left of the stand pipe (the thing the oil filter slides over in the housing) you really don't need to go any further. Were not trying to be combative but there really is only one solution for this problem with what information you've given us. As well since it seems the owner didn't monitor so it really is hard to say the exact root cause without some data from before and during the meltdown (as well as could have prevented to meltdown possibly) but we do know that the temp got to 350 or better--that's about all the data we have to go on.

 

That is literally not even a quarter of the standpipes actual size. Like the rest have suggested, you need a new block and any external component that oil circulates through.

 

The only way to clear the plastic out of the block is to reheat the engine to the 300-350 deg needed to remelt the plastic,, but then you are melting orings and seals at the same time. It's not possible. Also this customer had warnings and was prob desperate to get to their stopping point and ran it overheated. I've seen these before,, and it isn't something that just happens without warning. The last one I had the customer kept shutting off the engine while overheating to reset the defueling.

 

All I saw was a cellphone pic of a very dark-black looking abyss of an oil filter housing. Can't say for sure if Tech B recovered anything out of it other than that one piece. I think that was it....



Oil coolers clog routinely? Or I guess MORE routinely with lack of oil changes? This truck was a semi-recent purchase for the guy from what I hear so it's history is completely unknown.

I took another look at oil circuit. I guess it could have gone towards the cam bearings, crank bearings, and the turbo. I would have to spend more time looking at one in person to understand where the plastic most likely ended up.

I just do whatever solution bossman and customer come up with. I get paid either way. Just trying to teach myself. If it were my truck, I would start with the free/labor only stuff and see if I could repair the thing.

 

I gotcha. Can't miss the standpipe so it's gone. All 12 inches melted and resting comfortably in the block., hpop, injectors, you name it. That engine is toast. The owner made a bad purchase and didn't do his due diligence beforehand (not being mean just stating a fact). And if you want to learn about the 6.0..... listen to run6.0run. He is the best around and does these for a living (Super Duty Service is his company)

So the oil coolers clog on the coolant side (sediment from the block and fallout from coolant) the oil coolers on these make great filters lol.

It would be good for you to take a look at the tech folder---has most of everything you need to know about the 6.0

 

I may never see said truck. Not gonna lose any sleep over it, but I just try to learn from each scenario. The faster/better I get, it will be beneficial for the sake of every party involved.

I have poured thru all the articles and manuals I could get my hands on. All downloaded, saved, read, printed, etc. If you have files to share, please do, thanks! PM.

 

KDAVID1 gave you the most common situation - plugged oil coolers on the coolant side, but your specific situation could have been from anything that was mentioned in his earlier post (#22).

Many people switch to ELC coolant (must be properly rated coolant, the CAT EC-1 rating is the most common one to look for). It will be more robust than the Ford Gold coolant (ie holds up to higher temperatures and can have longer maintenance intervals), but IMO there is still a root cause that is probably there. Many people have great success with the Ford Gold coolant, but it can not hold up to excess heat, poor maintenance practices (ie it should be changed every 40k miles or so), exposure to combustion gasses, etc. So - a root cause could have been poor coolant maintenance, exposure of the coolant to excessive heat, exposure to combustion gasses (leaking head gaskets can cause this), using the wrong coolant, poor choice of additives, water pump failure, a coolant system leak that caused insufficient circulation of coolant, etc. Impossible for anyone on the forum to help you with what specifically caused the problem with this specific truck - other than to list possibilities.

There have been some reported cases of oil coolers clogging on the oil side - due to poor oil maintenance practices, poor choice of aftermarket additives, etc. These seem to be uncommon. Some aftermarket oil coolers themselves have caused issues by using cheap gasket material. Again, as stated in post #22, the coolant flows to other important engine areas after it exits the oil cooler - one is the EGR cooler. If an oil cooler plugs on the coolant side, the EGR cooler will be exposed to excessive heat and will most surely fail in the 05-07 model years (unless an aftermarket EGR cooler has been installed or the EGR cooler has been properly deleted). EGR cooler failures then have consequences as well - allowing coolant into the intake, etc.

Perhaps the biggest issue needing to be addressed is that the dash gauges do not tell you what is going on (posted earlier). The owner can easily limit damage to a more "manageable" amount by using an aftermarket gauge system that provides actual operating temperatures for the oil and coolant. IMO it is very important for every 6.0L owner to have an electronic gauge system. Perhaps the most cost effective one is the use of an Android device along with an ELM adapter and the TorquePro app. The scangaugeII is also effective for a modest cost (around $130).

All of the above is just to add some detail to what has been already discussed and to respond to your desire to know more about the root causes. One other FYI - the oil in the oil filter is after it flows through the oil cooler, and is typically one of the coolest points for the oil. Since the oil heated up to over 350 degrees there, the rest of the engine saw even higher oil temperatures.

 

One other item that most people miss unless they have the crank and pistons out are the piston
cooling jets. They have a very small hole and a bit of plastic in it and you screwed with no oil squirting
on the piston skirt to help cool the piston.

There are so many places where that crap can hide once the meltdown has happened.

If it were me I would do a full drop in engine. But I understand that you have to keep
bossman happy and he has to keep the truck's owner happy.

If you cat the job please post some photos of the mess if you can.




Merry Christmas


Sean


6.0L Tech Folder

 

Very good approach. You may want to show the bossman this thread so he can make an informed decision. Far as files---I get everything from the guys here on FTE they are the brain trust!!!