I'm just a blue collar worker and can only build a little at a time, so, my upgrade build is a slow and steady progression.

I am aiming for around 500hp (Ca. Smog compliant), and, I am planning on having a stout towing machine since the family likes to go camping in the mountains. I'll be towing doubles with my fishing boat behind the 5er. The set-up is just under 65' and under 10,000 lbs (maybe heavier in the future with bigger trailers).

Truck already has Boost & Pyro gauges(still need to add tranny temp); has Turbo back 4" Exhaust; and, has TS 6pos chip (stock, Drive-thru, 40hp Tow, 65hp Tow, 80hp Tow, 140race);

I'm going to be spending some money soon on a John Woods Tranny. With that, I was thinking IH Bellowed Up-pipes, 38r Turbo, Head Studs, 238/80 Sticks, Frx.

Eventually, I will be getting, HPOP, Sway-bar, air-bags, brakes & rotors, exhaust brake.

There's so many parts that I could just spend money on and not have the right combination. I'd like to build the truck up so that the performance of the truck will not be built unbalanced as it progresses.

What have I missed? I'd imagine that there are supporting mods that I will need.

How would you, or, how did you get to 500hp?

 

Those sticks won't get it done, you can't get the fuel out fast enough with 80% nozzles. Valve springs, ladder bars, bellowed ups with T4 and a better turbo, bigger (or twin OEM) fuel pump with regulated return, bigger fuel lines from the tank to the regulator, and whole number of things that drain the wallet and kink up the CARB compliance. You'd be lucky to reach 400 HP and be CARB compliant.

That being said, more power makes more heat when towing. You will be limited by EGTs more than you will by torque or HP. 500 HP is over the top for a tow machine, are you looking to race when not towing? If you want to tow big in the mountains, those plain ol' IH AC 160s deliver the torque, then it's a matter of cooling, cooling, cooling.

 

I didn't see a mention on what is installed for intake or planned for install for intake.....maybe I missed something......but as Tugly always says.....Air Air Air......if you haven't already done an intake and planning on burning that much fuel (238s) you will probably want to look at something like the S&B vs. even an AIS.

That new turbo and your EGTs will thank you I believe

But I could be 100% wrong

 

His sig shows an AFE-2, so I figured that was covered. Loud sucker, though.

 

He probably can't get to 500hp with that turbo and those sticks, but for the sake of discussion if he were to. He could definitely tow with it with the right person tuning. Now I say that with this caveat- he won't be towing with 500hp, he will be towing in a detuned 350hp-ish tune.

If you are looking for mods to add to that list to get closer to 500, you need fuel system work big time. I would think the T4 mount would be the way to go and I would call a diesel shop that has a lot of experience like Swamps or Brian at BTS. These guys have lots of experience with those kinds of trucks and what you want to do is very doable. It just takes money and a lot of it.

 

That's what I've been reading as well. Others have said 350 is the limit for fuel/EGT's, other say that and the driveline can't sustain towing above 350 for an extended time. And 350 at the wheels.....that's about 150hp more than stock.

And it's likely going to need a pretty built trans, even not towing....with 500hp. So throw another $5k at that. (I see he's talking JW for trans)

 

Fuel pressure gauge. I didn't see the importance of having one when i first starting throwing parts at my truck. But as i keep reading i see more and more how much of a role it plays in troubleshooting engine problems and knowing whether or not your fuel system is keeping pace with your injectors.

 

Missed those three little letters early morning......

350 rwhp is a significant amount of power, granted people love big numbers, but to put it in perspective that is about 25-40rwhp more than a stock 6.7 will put out from what I've seen and those things are great tow pigs, when you aren't replacing DEF heaters, fuel components, radiators etc. (don't ge me started on how much $ my buddy has in broken parts in his 2011). Heck half the 16 and 18 wheelers doing daily commercial duty are in that range I believe right?

Seems like Air, fuel and a way to keep it all cool are the name of the game assuming the trans is up to snuff, right?

 

My dog trainer runs a FL-60 with a CAT 3126E....it's like 300/800....stock. And that truck is a far cry from a Class 8 truck. I think the 3126 is 7.2 liters.

 

Some of our urban delivery rigs are FL60s from what I remember and they run the 5.9 Cummins with 250hp or so......nice rigs overall I guess. Again, puts things in perspective a little bit on the numbers game though.

The newer Detroits in class 8 rigs start at about 370/1200 or so from what I remember the logistics guys yapping about a while back.

 

A true class 8 truck is 855ci(typical cummins) and it might have only 500 hp, but the torque is way over what these little motors will do just lugging along with a load at a typical 1500 rpm. They still have to watch EGT's.

Friend had a FL120 toter with 44ft stacker with 300 Cummins/10spd autoshift. It would run as fast as you wanted to go loaded with 3 cars without breaking a sweat. Can't recall, but think it is 10 liter? Never pushed it hard, but I know it would bury 100mph without issue.

 

Not gonna happen. Not without a breakthrough in the laws of physics, or the laws of the State. Or by a smog tech breaking the law by looking the other way.

Unless you have a Class A license, California law permits only a "single" trailer to be towed, no doubles. Other states may be more lenient.

https://apps.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/dl648/dl648.pdf

This is step #1, and is the answer to the Dilemna of Upgrades Progression. The very next dollar spent on upgrading the truck is best spent finding a way to see the transmission temp while towing, either though an independently wired gauge, or through a device that is able to read the TFT PID through the OBDII data port.

THIS is one area where your truck may or may not be CARB Compliant as it sits today. The law permits almost any type of muffler system from CAT BACK. If your 2000 had a CAT (most didn't.. but some built in 1999 and 2001 did, so it might depend on the build date, the transmission, and the emissions RPO, but I forget the details), and if you have a 4" turbo back, where's the CAT? If your 2000 was not originally equipped with a CAT (mine wasn't) then your 4" turbo back is compliant.

THIS is one reason why your truck is definitely not CARB compliant, even as it sits today. Computer calibration changes are not allowed without certification. There are very few aftermarket companies who have spent the money to have their tunes tested with the CARB, and who have received Executive Orders certifying the same. Even Gale Banks, who has more Executive Orders on file for his products than any other aftermarket performance company on the planet for this vehicle application, doesn't have Executive Orders for his hottest chips. I forget what the Banks marketing names for the racing oriented tunes are ...something similar to "Big Hoss"... but these are not certified. By contrast, the more towing oriented Banks Power Pack Ottomind modules were one of the first, if not the first, aftermarket tunes to be certified for the 99 up 7.3L. Scanning through the list of valid Executive Orders, I did not see any TS chip.

That's a fantastic list of upgrades planned. And most of them, like head studs, bellowed up pipes, HPOP, sticks, and tranny will not be visible to a smog inspector on a visual... except for these three:

1. The FRX. This device modifies the fuel system, which is not allowed, It also doesn't have CARB Executive Order, which means that it is not exempt.
This doesn't mean that a truck would pollute any more with an FRx than without one. But it does mean that it isn't CARB compliant, which means that the presence of it can cause a failed visual on a biannual smog inspection.

A friend of mine has one, and he covers it up completely with plastic split wire loom. He has, along with others, thus far managed to pass one or two smog tests by doing so. Still, it certainly doesn't help one bit that Clay has the RiffRaff logo etched into the header in the most prominent possible location on the device, making it look like something is riff raff on the engine.

Wrapping over the logo with electrical tape is what folks have to resorted to, but why have the logo there at all? If one has the part in hand, the money has already been sent, which means that the word of mouth (forum) advertising already did the job. With the hood closed most of the time, the only person who is going to see the advertising on the part itself is the one person the owner would least like to have to explain it to.. the smog inspector.

It would be much stealthier (and less expensive to manufacture I imagine) if the FRx was machined without the logo and without the black annodization. A clear annodization to protect the natural aluminum finish, without a logo, would blend better into the fuel bowl housing return port boss, making it look OEM without calling attention to itself. Whew, I digressed.


2. The exhaust brake. Unless reusing the factory back pressure warm up valve as a brake, any other exhaust brake on the market for the 7.3 (the big three are BD Engine Brake, Pac Brake, and Banks Brake) are all going to stick out like a sore thumb in the "forbidden to modify" region in between the turbo outlet and the cat converter, if originally equipped. If not equipped with a CAT originally, then Exhaust Brakes fall under the "Not required to verify E.O. status" on visual inspection, so you would be in the clear.

Reference: State and Consumer Services Agency, Department of Consumer Affairs, Bureau of Automotive Repair Appendix G: Aftermarket Parts for Diesel Powered Vehicles. Bureau of Automotive Repair, State of California, Dept. of Consumer Affairs

For those who DO have a 1999 or a 2001 or later truck with a CAT, there is a little known downline exhaust brake from BD Engine Brake (not listed on their website for the 7.3L model) that you can mount after the CAT (although BD recommends that the optimal position for an exhaust brake is as close to the engine as practical). This downline, tail pipe mounted exhaust brake part number is 1027144. It just so happens to be 4" in and out, but BD ships it with adapters to connect to stock exhaust tubing.

Something else: There is a link buried somewhere on FTE that has a pdf file with something to the effect of "Products In Progress" included in the title. This document lists companies and products in the middle of an application process for exemption by Executive Order. BD has three products on that list that are described as "engine brakes", called TowLoc. This is in error. The Towloc is not an engine brake, and besides, the Towloc has been long since discontinued anyway. The Towloc WAS an automatic transmission logic controller, that determined when the torque converter would lock and unlock, and going far beyond BD's older, similar, and still available Autoloc and Torqueloc logic controller's, the now shuttered Towloc could downshift the transmission as well. But in any event, it is not an exhaust brake as the referenced document indicated. I digress. Again.


3. The aftermarket turbo. Even though the 38R looks stockish (a lot more than a T4 mount turbo would), this Garrett Turbo has the tell-tale larger inlet snorkel that says Garrett in big red letters on it. Unfortunately, the stock inlet snorkle is not large enough to fit the much larger 88mm wheel size of the ported 38R compressor. As diesel smog inspectors now have 4 test years of experience under their belts, they no doubt recognize the difference in these turbos. Unfortunately, the 38R does not have a CARB Executive Order exemption.

Here is an article by dieselpower magazine that discusses the experience of the article's authors during the first or second year of diesel pick up truck smog inspections:

How To Pass A Smog Test - Diesel Power Magazine

That was then. As was the case during introductory years of smog checks in the 1970's for gasoline cars, smog checking diesels is still in the rapidly evolving stage, now in it's 4th year. Fortunately, instead of ALL aftermarket parts being OUTLAWED out of hand, we have an Executive Order system, where aftermarket parts suppliers can verify, just like the OEMs must do, the emissions impact of their products, so that we we can buy and use them lawfully.

Here are four examples of CARB Executive Orders exempting Banks performance modifications for 1999 - 2002 Ford light trucks with the 7.3L:

http://arb.ca.gov/msprog/aftermkt/de...o/D-161-61.pdf

http://arb.ca.gov/msprog/aftermkt/de...o/D-161-64.pdf

http://arb.ca.gov/msprog/aftermkt/de...o/D-161-63.pdf

http://arb.ca.gov/msprog/aftermkt/de...o/D-161-69.pdf


It took the rule of law, and then the enforcement of the law with hefty fines, to get other aftermarket companies to think about the consequences of not being compliant. The EPA had to slap Edge products with a half million dollar fine, and the court upheld it. Californians who hopped up their formerly smog exempt diesel pickups are now struggling to keep their trucks registered. These recent changes finally forced the aftermarket industry to face the fact that emissions compliance for diesels has become a serious matter that is not going away.

Relatively recently, in the spring of 2012, BD applied for and was issued an Executive Order for their Thruster II turbo.

http://arb.ca.gov/msprog/aftermkt/de...eo/D-553-2.pdf

The issue with the BD Thruster II turbo is that the Executive Order is limited to the turbine housing A/R remaining at 0.84, and maximum boost limited to 22 lbs. How is this any different than the bone stock turbo's capabilities with a similar thrust bearing, a similar .84 A/R turbine housing, a non ported compressor housing, and boost limited to 22 lbs? What also remains unclear in the Executive Order is the engine tuning calibration that this replacement turbo is certified with.

The EO for the Banks turbo modifications (with a 1.0 housing, modified wheel, modified waste gate control, larger downpipe etc) are all indexed in writing to specific Ford PCM calibrations with the Banks add on chip modules to those calibrations. So there is a clearly articulated provision for the vehicle owner to point to his Big Head, point to his downpipe (which is in the forbidden zone between the turbo and the CAT), point to his turbo, point to his TechniCooler, point to his PCM tear tag, as well as point to the numbers on his Banks Chip module, to say "See? ALL of this is EXEMPT. Here it is, every single piece identified, in writing, in the Executive Order. So put your little flashlight away and pass my truck, thank you."

With the BD Thruster II Executive Order, there is some ambiguity about what tuning is permitted to be used with the turbo kit, if any, since no tuning ships with the kit. This lack of clarity could be by intent, or could be by oversight. This could be a good thing, or could be a bad thing. It might depend on the interpretation and mood swing of the smog referee who gets to decide.

Separately and much earlier, back in 2003, BD Engine Brake obtained an Executive Order for their BD X-Power Performance Chip for 1999-2002 F-250-350s, as shown here:

http://arb.ca.gov/msprog/aftermkt/de...eo/D-553-1.pdf

Is this 500HP tuning? Not even close. Yet it is among the extremely rare, few, and very far between choices of CARB compliant chips for this application. Therefore, neither the tunes nor the turbos of BD or Banks that have CARB compliant E.O.s can deliver what you are seeking. And it doesn't matter anyway, because the other part of the power pursuit is fuel, and there isn't a stick or a fuel delivery system out there capable of making 500HP on a 7.3L... that is CARB compliant.


This is an excellent point very much worth a lot of consideration... about having the "right combination" and not being "built unbalanced." Case in point:

Tugly is one of the most helpful members on this forum, posting "Rich-ly" detailed deductions and diatribes on his adventures with his truck Stinky. One of the photos he often posts are of the 40 feet of burnt rubber tracks his truck layed down on the asphalt. That is in no small part due to tuning, because he said it happened when he "accidently" hit the wrong setting on his Hydra. That "permagrin" is on one end of the balance sheet.

However, at the other end of the balance is Tugly's report on his most recent 400 mile vacation/trip with his truck. He recounted the drive as a horrible experience, being barely able to keep his truck running through in town driving. That's tuning also.

From my interpretation of his post, he felt badly on behalf of his passengers who had to suffer through that drive, and a bit embarrassed by the fact that it was his truck that he had worked endlessly on for two years, going through two sets of injectors, two tuners, and two dozen VC pops. And of this last trip, two times he said "Never Again."

So on balance.. which is more important to you? 40 feet of skid marks? Or 400 miles of trip towing trouble free? I think that is the balance we all are trying to find, including the OEMs, which also have to balance legal issues like CARB compliance. When you say you want 500HP as well as CARB compliance, you might be forever seeking a mutually exclusive holy grail. Ford has spent a few billion dollars on the same goal, and has yet to get there. Even the forthcoming 2015 falls 60 HP short of the mark.

Yes. After the transmission temperature gauge, add a larger Oil to Air transmission cooler. The one from the 6.0L is a popular and effective choice. I didn't see any indication of upgraded transmission cooling in your signature. The MagHytec pans "front and rear" seemed to apply to the differentials only, and would not be the best money spent for transmission cooling anyway, for reasons that engulf entire threads of discussion.

How would I get to 500HP? Since we are dreaming, I would either get a Shelby Cobra GT500 Mustang, or a Peterbilt 579 optioned with the Cummins ISX15, depending on what I needed all that HP for. In stock form, both can make 600HP, and both are certified CARB compliant. Sadly, neither is as well balanced as a good old F-350 pickup, so I think I'll take a pass on the 500HP.

 

Something to remember about some of these parts and why they aren't compliant is that many companies want nothing to do with the communist state of California or their extortionist tactics of generating income.

I would rather choose a company the produces the best engineered parts for the application, not one that cuts corners to try and subvert the law.

 

Reps for the informative writeup Y2KW57!

Not all counties require smog checks. Click this link for the CA DMV page where you can check your ZIP to see your locations' status and view the county map. OPs avatar pic reminds me of Lassen county so maybe he's in luck. Very generally, if you are in the sticks you're ok.

The 38R is similar enough that they pass routinely, from what I hear from multiple sources. Just obscure the red letters on the intake tube. The BD TT 2 turbo just isn't much better than OEM. I plan on the 38R eventually. Back to the OPs topic from our hijack, but I like the build up plan. X3 on the attention to trans temps. I am no expert but I see lots of claims for 400-425 hp with mods like that.

I am in an "enhanced" smog check area, and have the few no-no's in my sig under the hood, but I passed twice now. First tech a few years ago saw the 6637 and flipped, even tho perfectly legal. So I left. And later got an AIS. Second tech same day, same 6637 went thru all the motions, filled out the papers and took my money. No idea if he saw anything. The smog tech I used most recently was savvy enough to start spotting things in a few minutes, and savvy enough to suddenly realize it was, well gosh, a heavy duty diesel, so it was $100 and no worries. Lots of stupid laws in CA, but most of the people are just like people everywhere else.

I do try to keep the truck as OEM looking as possible to avoid issues. For smog day I put the Powerstroke codpiece back on, hide the DP switch. For the FRx I took a black felt tip pen to the logo and fitted some split loom. Nobody ever notices the IC. Smog checks are not the end of the world, just another nanny state dream come true, with additional hassle and expense and fewer choices.

 

Reading through all the responses, I think I should re-do my wording.

I would like to make my truck a higher hp, stout towing machine. What progressive steps would you take for a build-up, since funds are limited?

I understand that to pass smog the truck needs to act and look as close to stock as possible. I did have a smog check done near the end of last year. The chip was in stock setting (hidden), and the smog technician did ask about the AFE intake and the catch-can. He looked into them. The truck passed.

Rich, I found mention of the 238 injectors from 2 other forums a while ago, and found from a diesel magazine mentioning in an article and a Top Tech Q&A, that that would be the perfect injector for towing in the 400-500hp range. That's why I mention the 238's. I'm not discrediting any of the other injectors, I'm still a newbie trying to learn. Appreciate the info on parts liked valve springs, ladder bars, 6.0 IC, etc. Thank you for the 160 recommendation, as I know that you are very educated on these trucks, and, I tune-in when your sharing info. I will give the 160's much consideration.

Don't plan on racing normally, but, talking with co-workers who have tuned-up Fords, Dodges and Chevys, we'd go to the local track for some friendly competition runs.

River19, I forgot to write it in the thread, but, yes I do have the AFE-2 cold air intake. Thanks for responding.



Jason, When and if it gets to the fueling point, I will check into pros. In regards to the lots of money, I can only build a little at a time. In stages. Thanks for chiming in.


Dan V, Thanks for the 350 limit and driveline info. Noted. I prepared my wife for the JW transmission purchase, so I'm lucky in that way.

greg_8507, Since you post knowing how the fuel system is doing, I can see the importance. I will put that on the build list. Thanks for the fuel pressure gauge idea.

I should have used passable rather than compliant.


I've got this one covered.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Y2KW57

This is step #1, and is the answer to the Dilemna of Upgrades Progression. The very next dollar spent on upgrading the truck is best spent finding a way to see the transmission temp while towing, either though an independently wired gauge, or through a device that is able to read the TFT PID through the OBDII data port.

It will be the next purchase, before the tranny. Thanks for mentioning the obvious. So many different parts, my thoughts get to going different ways with what I can do next. No wait, I can do this. No wait, I can do that......




My truck didn't come with a Cat and already had the 4" turbo back on.




Yes, trucks not compliant here, but, chip switch is hidden.





Split loom and tape noted, thanks.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Y2KW57

2. The exhaust brake.

If the EBPV will suffice, then I will gladly bypass the Banks Brake. I found threads on the EBPV being used, but, I haven't found any on long-term use. Probably just not looking in the right locations for the threads.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Y2KW57

3. The aftermarket turbo.

Thank you for the links. Great info to ponder.






I would choose the trouble-free 400 miles over skidmarks.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Y2KW57

Yes. After the transmission temperature gauge, add a larger Oil to Air transmission cooler.

Spoke with John Wood. He said that he does the cooler with the tranny. I figure I'd wait until the tranny gets done and do the cooler at the same time. He did make a mention of the MagHytec pan where he suggested not necessary, but, will do it if I wanted.





Yes, the Mustang, Peterbilt, and others is legit, but, I've bought into the Ford 7.3l ideals and want to get the most I can get, realistically.



Nick, I can understand the idea of Companies want nothing to do with this state. Very strict.



David, good guess. Pictures of Lake Amanor in Plumas Co. I live in Sac County, so I am required to smog the truck.

Thanks for posting the info.