Gelling issues.Simple solution.
#1
Gelling issues.Simple solution.
You can add RUG (regular unleaded gasoline) to help control gelling, and it might be the best "anti-gel" additive available.
I have done this off and on for years. These trucks handle 20% RUG easily.
Me, I only use debit card pumps. Put 8 gallons of diesel, then 2 gallons of RUG, done. ( If you need more fuel--do the numbers.)
Disclaimer. Do this at your own risk.
I have done this off and on for years. These trucks handle 20% RUG easily.
Me, I only use debit card pumps. Put 8 gallons of diesel, then 2 gallons of RUG, done. ( If you need more fuel--do the numbers.)
Disclaimer. Do this at your own risk.
#2
Respectfully...NO NO NO NO...NO NO NO NO...DO NOT DO IT...unless you want to have to put new injectors in your truck.
Mixing Gasoline And Diesel
Gasoline and alcohols hit diesel fuel right where it hurts the most. Those light thin fuels will lower the cetane number and lubricity. To explain how octane and cetane DO NOT work together, I�ll have to review more crude oil and fuel fundamentals.
The light distillates that gasolines are made from have a natural high-octane index. The middle distillates that diesel fuels come from have a high cetane index. The octane and cetane indexes are INVERSE scales. A fuel that has a high octane number has a low cetane number, and a high cetane fuel has a low octane number. Anything with a high octane rating will retard diesel fuel�s ability to ignite. That�s why each fuel has developed along with different types of engine designs and fuel delivery systems. Gasoline mixed in diesel fuel will inhibit combustion in a diesel engine and diesel fuel mixed in gasoline will ignite too soon in a gasoline engine.
Gasoline will raise the combustion temperature. This might or might not reduce carbon deposits in the cylinder. This also might or might not overheat the injector nozzle enough to cause coking on the nozzle. That�s a clogged injector tip in layman�s terms. The fuel being injected is the only thing that cools the nozzle. Diesel fuel has a lower combustion temperature than gasoline. The fuel injectors depend on the fuel burning at the correct rate and temperature for a long life. If the combustion temperature is raised long enough, the gums and varnishes in gasoline will start to cook right in the fuel injector and turn into carbon. These microscopic carbon particles will abrade the nozzle. High combustion temperatures alone will shorten fuel injector life, gasoline makes the problem worse.
Gasoline and alcohols do have an anti-gel effect on diesel fuel, but these fuels are too thin and will hurt the lubricity. Alcohols work as a water dispersant in small amounts, but also attract water in large amounts. Diesel fuel is already hydrophilic (attracts water) so why add to the problem. The old timers got away with this because high sulfur diesel fuel had enough lubricity to take some thinning. Today�s low sulfur diesel fuels have adequate lubricity, but I wouldn�t put anything in the tank that would thin out the fuel, reduce lubricity, or attract water.
Mixing Gasoline And Diesel
Gasoline and alcohols hit diesel fuel right where it hurts the most. Those light thin fuels will lower the cetane number and lubricity. To explain how octane and cetane DO NOT work together, I�ll have to review more crude oil and fuel fundamentals.
The light distillates that gasolines are made from have a natural high-octane index. The middle distillates that diesel fuels come from have a high cetane index. The octane and cetane indexes are INVERSE scales. A fuel that has a high octane number has a low cetane number, and a high cetane fuel has a low octane number. Anything with a high octane rating will retard diesel fuel�s ability to ignite. That�s why each fuel has developed along with different types of engine designs and fuel delivery systems. Gasoline mixed in diesel fuel will inhibit combustion in a diesel engine and diesel fuel mixed in gasoline will ignite too soon in a gasoline engine.
Gasoline will raise the combustion temperature. This might or might not reduce carbon deposits in the cylinder. This also might or might not overheat the injector nozzle enough to cause coking on the nozzle. That�s a clogged injector tip in layman�s terms. The fuel being injected is the only thing that cools the nozzle. Diesel fuel has a lower combustion temperature than gasoline. The fuel injectors depend on the fuel burning at the correct rate and temperature for a long life. If the combustion temperature is raised long enough, the gums and varnishes in gasoline will start to cook right in the fuel injector and turn into carbon. These microscopic carbon particles will abrade the nozzle. High combustion temperatures alone will shorten fuel injector life, gasoline makes the problem worse.
Gasoline and alcohols do have an anti-gel effect on diesel fuel, but these fuels are too thin and will hurt the lubricity. Alcohols work as a water dispersant in small amounts, but also attract water in large amounts. Diesel fuel is already hydrophilic (attracts water) so why add to the problem. The old timers got away with this because high sulfur diesel fuel had enough lubricity to take some thinning. Today�s low sulfur diesel fuels have adequate lubricity, but I wouldn�t put anything in the tank that would thin out the fuel, reduce lubricity, or attract water.
#3
Someone needs to rep Jason for his post above (I can't right now). Excellent response! Clear and to the point!!
David, I suspect you've gotten away with what you've been doing because the ULSD fuel has not been around long enough yet for you to see injector damage, but it WILL come, and will come EARLIER than it should. Your use of VO is also in your favor, but still, "the check is in the mail".
David, I suspect you've gotten away with what you've been doing because the ULSD fuel has not been around long enough yet for you to see injector damage, but it WILL come, and will come EARLIER than it should. Your use of VO is also in your favor, but still, "the check is in the mail".
#4
-Why not just get a proper anti-get agent that is made for use in Diesel engines and add before any chance of gelling happens.
4 years ago it was in the mid-teens in Ocala, Florida for many hours between 2 days at a car show I regularly attend up there and I added anti gel agent to my fuel when I filled up before leaving temps in the 70s headed there.
People that put any type of gasoline, transmission fluid, and even the 2 cycle oil into a Diesel engine are strictly asking for trouble down the road.
Sorry Guys.
4 years ago it was in the mid-teens in Ocala, Florida for many hours between 2 days at a car show I regularly attend up there and I added anti gel agent to my fuel when I filled up before leaving temps in the 70s headed there.
People that put any type of gasoline, transmission fluid, and even the 2 cycle oil into a Diesel engine are strictly asking for trouble down the road.
Sorry Guys.
#7
We all know that the reps aren't necessary, Jason, but just like you, we like to show public appreciation for good help in a way that it also reflects well on you to those members who may not know you as well some of us do.
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#8
I appreciate it Pete, and I want David to know, I am certainly not trying to troll him or be disrespectful in any way. Just trying to get accurate information out there, that's all. I'd hate to see someone damage their injectors and cost themselves thousands of dollars.
#9
Join Date: Mar 2005
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this was true 35 years ago when diesels were mechanical and the tolerances were not as tight as things are with todays engines.
way back when i used to mix 25% gas to diesel in my detriot diesels in the winter.
even with my 1988 7.3 diesel, i would not worry if the juice jockey put the gas nozzle in my tank as long as i caught it rite away.
3-4 gallons of gas mixed with 15 -16 gallons of diesel i would just run it with no problems.
but i would never ever do it with a powerstroke. if they put gas in the tank, they are draining the tanks and refilling with diesel before i turn the key to start it.
way back when i used to mix 25% gas to diesel in my detriot diesels in the winter.
even with my 1988 7.3 diesel, i would not worry if the juice jockey put the gas nozzle in my tank as long as i caught it rite away.
3-4 gallons of gas mixed with 15 -16 gallons of diesel i would just run it with no problems.
but i would never ever do it with a powerstroke. if they put gas in the tank, they are draining the tanks and refilling with diesel before i turn the key to start it.
#12
Mixing Gasoline And Diesel
... Gasoline and alcohols do have an anti-gel effect on diesel fuel, but these fuels are too thin and will hurt the lubricity. Alcohols work as a water dispersant in small amounts, but also attract water in large amounts...
Do what you want. I am aware of lots of info, pro and con.
I am like a turtle, i am not afraid to stick my neck out to see what will work and what will not.
As for the injectors, i am on my originals and running great. How many of you can say that after driving it for going on 13 years?
I am not upset with anyone. We just may not agree.
#13
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#14
...David, I suspect you've gotten away with what you've been doing because the ULSD fuel has not been around long enough yet for you to see injector damage, but it WILL come, and will come EARLIER than it should. Your use of VO is also in your favor, but still, "the check is in the mail".
#15
I appreciate your clarification about not being upset, and applaud you for that. There have been many before you who were provoked by a lot less.
I am neither stupid nor arrogant enough to predict your injector life in either years or miles... it would be absurd. My comments are from an engineering perspective and are based on comparison information and a bit of time spent reviewing research studies related to diesel fuel lubricity pre- and post-ULSD availability. Like I said earlier, your use of VO will certainly help delay injector damage. Regardless, when you look at your use of VO either with or without the use of RUG as a winter additive, your injectors will live longer without the RUG. How long?... no one can really say.