I just discovered that I am missing the Rating Plate on My 54 F100. The truck is sitting in South Dakota and I am in Minnesota where the truck is licensed and titled and the guy I bought it from is in Texas. I have read the posts and know I will have to find the serial number on the frame. I am wondering has anyone on this board from Minnesota got a new Rating Plate? I am also curious about the cost. Based on what I have read the hassel factor is pretty bad. Another thing that has me worried is the title I have states the truck should be a 239 but the grill has the star emblem. All advice is appreciated.

 

You may be making a mountain out of a molehill. Replacement Rating Plates are available as are the original rivets, and the source can stamp the VIN and all the codes on it.

Rating Plates on these trucks are located on the inside of the glovebox door.

But the DMV and polizei do not go by the VIN and codes on Rating Plates, they go by the hidden frame VIN when vehicles are inspected.

You cannot go by an emblem to ID if the original engine was a 6 or 8, because...Who knows if the grille and/or emblem are original to the truck after 48 years have passed by?

I just called and spoke with a gal at martiauto.com (located just north of Phoenix AZ). She said you have to submit all the info in writing to get a new Rating Plate and to have the VIN and codes stamped on it.

I didn't ask her "how much" and the info for 1953/56's is not on their website yet.

Us members can probably figure out all the codes, so don't worry about it.

Find the hidden VIN (sorry don't know where it is on these trucks, but other will) then run it thru the TX DMV to verify clear title.

 

The vin plates are available from midfifty.com for $125. You have to provide proof of ownership.

 

Thanks. I read a post on here that said the only real serial number is the one on the frame. Hope that is true. There are currently four screw holes where the Rating Plate should be. The cab has been repainted. My quess is it was removed for painting and then lost. Are you stating the rating plate would not legally be considered a VIN? If this is the case I am curious why the the places that do reproduction plates would ask for proof of ownership.

 

Rating Plate: VIN stamped on it is not what police/DMV go by. Example:

1963/80 Ford Trucks: Warranty Plate located (riveted) on left door face below the latch, has the VIN, codes stamped on it.

People replaced damaged left doors with junkyard doors. 99.9% of the time, they failed to install the original Warranty Plate on the replaced door.

What does this have to do with the police and DMV? Nothing, they go by the hidden frame VIN.

btw: Sources that sell Rating Plates and then stamp the codes on them ask for proof of ownership because it is not their job to inspect vehicles to prove ownership, it's yours.

You can buy a gazillion Rating Plates, and AFAIK, as long as you don't want the codes stamped, all the sources will ask you for is money.

I have several plates layin' around here for Packards, bought them so I could stamp the selling dealers name on them. Paid the 20 bucks each, and that was it. Wasn't asked for anything else.

These plates varied in design from one vehicle to another as did the VIN's. Some were only 5 or 6 digits long, while others had 7 or more digit's. 1965 Ford of Canada: VIN 15 digits.

VIN's and Certification Labels (replaced whatever they were called before) became standarized throughout the autobiz when the US Gov't mandated 17 digit VIN's. First implemented: 1980 Passenger Cars, 1981 Trucks.

I've decoded over 800 VIN's for FTE members using Ford parts catalogs. So, it you'd like an example from 1948 thru today, I'll gladly type it for you.

 

I don't really know, but my guess would be to protect themselves legally for making the plate.

 

My question is what are you supposed to do if you buy a no limit aftermarket frame? It doesnt have any numbers on it, so now is the tag good enough?

Heck here in the rust belt you cant even read the frame numbers anymore. And what about the guys who have trucks with a frame graft from another vehicle say a crown vic? The frame section is long gone where the numbers used to be.

 

Those are all great questions. I think the only people that can answer them are your state DMV. And even then, I think the answers will vary depending on the state. Maybe even vary depending on the person you talk to.

I'd say you safest bet is to have a legal title and something on the truck that matches the vin on the title.

 

I really don't think the numbers on the frame are the critical ones it's the ones that are most visual like the vin plate. most of these rigs are junkyard dogs anyway and the dmv know that. The main thing is to get it registered in your name before you start sinking money into it. If it's going to be a project that is going to take years as most of them do register it as an unfit vehicle until it's ready for the road at which time you'll have to have it certified as fit by your friendly mechanic and march down to the dmv

 

Your right, it does depend on the state and the DMV. But what if in Ohio I build a truck and it has been subframed, now the vin is gone from the frame and I sell it to someone in FLorida and that isnt OK in that state.

Note: I dont sub frame, but people do, and I think this is important for the builders to think about it.

 

So I know it is not legal to remove or alter a VIN tag. So if I put a reproduction Rating plate am I doing something illegal?

 

I never looked for it, but I hear there is a second hidden ID# stamped on the frame between the cab mounts.
What is it about "the rating plate inside the glove box or on the door post is not the LEGAL ID for the vehicle" that people will not accept? You can argue about it and give what ifs? until you are blue in the face and it won't change that fact! It is a federally mandated law! The rating plate is just there for convenience, just like the VIN plate on your dashboard on a late model vehicle. Yes, some lazy law enforcement and/or DMV officials will not verify if the # on the plate matches the stamping on the frame, but that still doesn't change the fact that it won't stand up in court.
There was a recent episode of the Texas Car Wars "reality" show where one of the shops purchased a Mustang at auction with a title that matched the VIN# on the dash plate and on the chassis under the hood. When they started stripping it they noticed the area of the chassis with the number under the hood looked like it had been cut out and replaced. A state trooper came to the shop and inspected the car and found one of the several hidden ID #s stamped on the rear of the chassis and it did not match the paper work or the other 2 numbers. When the trooper ran the hidden # it came up as stolen. The police then came in and confiscated the vehicle!!!
The late Boyd Coddington was fined over $1M by the state of CA for buying titles from destroyed vehicles and applying their ID # to vehicles built in his shop.
Since then most states have tightened up their restrictions on re-issuing lost or old titles, and going after title mills. That's the reason the businesses that offer repro rating plates require proof of ownership before stamping the ID# on one of their plates. If the don't they can be charged with several statutes, including title laundering and aiding in the trafficing of stolen vehicles. A major public official here in NC was recently charged with and pleaded guilty to tax evasion for using title mill documents to register his collection of replica kit cars as the original year manufactured antique vehicles. A very high ranking official in the DMV was fired for aiding his friend to obtain new state titles based on what he knew to be bogus documents by walking them thru the process.
Most states have a process for registering a titleless vehicle without a legal ID stamp on the frame such as kit cars or handmade chassis under "homebuilt" or "hobby" vehicle procedures that vary by state, but usually involve producing notarized bills of sale for the major components (chassis, body, engine, transmission, rear axle etc) or the materials used in construction if totally hand built, putting up a large surity bond, having the DMV issue a new VIN # and having that # stamped into the new chassis by a designated inspector/official. This can be an easy process of just filling out the proper paper work in some states or very difficult in others like CA. There was an article in one of the magazines a couple years back after Boyd's fiasco that went thru the basic statutes and various state's registration/titling regulations.
Best course of action is to find out your state's regulations BEFORE you buy a vehicle, and then comply with them. Obtain a new title in your name as soon as possible, preferably before investing any work or money into it, or risk losing it all or building a permanent lawn ornament that can never put a tire onto a public highway.

 

Depends. First, the rating plate is not a VIN tag. VIN tags first issued in 1980 as Number Dummy stated.
If you buy and apply a repro rating plate with a serial # that matches your frame's stamped number you have done nothing wrong.
If you apply a rating plate with a serial # that does not match your frame's serial # and then try to obtain a title or registration based on that rating plate, then yes you are guilty of title laundering.

 

Axracer's reply about the hidden VINS is inrteresting. You would think that with the number of people doing frame off restorations that the hidden locations would be known to alot of people. I am wondering if people have located them on the 53-56's in other places besides the passenger side cross member area.

 

I watched that episode...twice. These people are idiots, pay waaay too much for vehicles. How many of y'all watched the episode where they bought a chopped/channeled 3 window Deuce coupe for 28 grand, that they soon discovered was a POS with a butchered frame, worn out engine/trans?

1965/66 Mustang: The Warranty Plate is riveted at an angle on the left door face below the latch. Has the VIN, codes for the body, color, trim, production date, DSO, axle, trans reversed embossed on it.

Raise the hood, look where the left (drivers) side fender meets the inner fender apron. The VIN is stamped on the leading edge of the apron, the fender has a cut out where VIN is stamped.

Many of these cars were involved in fender benders. FoMoCo supplied the R/L aprons complete, the front sections were also available.

So...some/many (pick one) of these cars have no VIN located here, because the aprons were replaced decades ago.

Some people assume the apron and the Warranty Plate are the only places where the VIN is located. Not so.

All Mustangs are unit bodies, there is no frame. The chassis/body is a one piece welded assembly.

Hidden VIN's located in engine compartment and on reinforcement member located at rear below trunk floor, in front of the upper/lower rear body panels.

And...this is where the trooper located it, which I found amazing, because when these cars were rear ended, this member, both upper/lower panels were replaced.

There's another hidden VIN, but I can't recall exactly where it is and wouldn't say if I could.