For you guys who have done "modern" engine swaps with Edelbrock or Holley 4 Barrel carbs this seems to be worth a look. Very slick and if I had a 4 barrel would definitely give it a try. Interested to hear other's thoughts and if anyone has used one. Wring seems to be super simple with only 2 wires to the battery and 2 to the coil if you are not running an MSD box and a little more complicated but still simple if you do use an MSD box.

https://thecarbcheater.com/

 

Interesting
I've never heard of it before. hopefully you'll get some feedback

 

There's a thread over on a Toyota forum I'm on about this. (IH8MUD Forum) Also on Classic Bronco Forum if you want to visit those sites for a read.

 

Looking at it from a tuning standpoint, I can definitely see the appeal. My understanding is it’s basically set up so you tune slightly rich across the board, then the “Carb Cheater” introduces a controlled air bleed/air leak to lean the AFR out when activated. That could save a ton of time versus constantly pulling bowls and swapping jets trying to chase perfect cruise AFR.

For the Holley 59 or 7RT stuff, there really isn’t a huge tuning catalog like modern Holleys. Main jets are about the biggest easy adjustment, so using a wideband AFR gauge to establish a safe baseline and then trimming with the Carb Cheater idea is pretty interesting.

What really caught my attention is how useful it could be on a dual carb setup. Getting two carbs perfectly happy together can turn into a lot of trial and error, especially trying to balance cruise mixtures versus transition and power enrichment. If you could jet slightly rich for safety and drivability, then fine tune cruise AFR externally, that could simplify things quite a bit.

I’d still want to see what happens during transition and light acceleration, because sometimes those controlled air bleed systems can mask another issue instead of truly fixing it. But for dialing in steady-state cruising on old carburetors with limited tuning parts available, it honestly seems like a clever approach.

 

It sounds interesting. I was hoping to get more information on how it's set up and how it works from the video. It was lacking in detail for me, but I'm more of an 'in the weeds' kind of guy and prefer the minutiae that others might not get. If it does what they claim, and the reviews offered, and I could gain 3mpg on my 460, which would be a 30% improvement, it wouldn't take too many trips to Home Depot to pay for itself.

 

The install instructions give the best information as you can see how it is set up. I agree the video is a bit weak.

 

I don't know if the data graph shown in the instructions is supposed to represent a tuned car or if it's a "before" shot, but honestly it isn't that impressive (below). I have run with a wide-band AFR monitor for 10 yrs on my truck, with both Holley 94's and Rochester 2G's, and the graph doesn't look noticeably better than what I get with simple jet changes and idle mix adjustments. On a more modern OHV engine there could be more of a benefit, but I'm not seeing it.



Red line is 14.7 AFR "ideal ratio". Rochester 2G carb, 5500' altitude

 

Wealthier folks in our hobby are what makes the hobby go round. All the fancy parts and kits available today for semi affordable prices would never have come along like they have if they weren't financed initially by much wealthier hobbyists who could afford the items when they were in their early phases.

I don't like to hound wealthy people for making these things possible.

Does carb cheater unlock things that were unachievable before? No.
You can easily live with and enjoy a fully reliable carb car without it and all those other "modern aftermarket EFI"


But I'm glad that someone took the time and money to put it on the market so I could buy it if I wanted. I truly am thankful, not being sarcastic.


HOWEVER, I find that these "carb cheater" "aftermarket EFI Sniper Killer FAST" things are nothing but cute placebo toys for wealthy folks: They aren't necessary, it's debatable if engines that have them are better off than an engine without them that has been tuned by a knowledgeable experienced person.

Sinking $500-1,200 into a placebo toy is not for your average blue collar hobbyist. I'm thankful they exist as an option, but I would never buy one. Cliff Ruggles and dudes like him have been begging people on the internet for 25 years: read a book, do some wrenching, drive your car....you will figure it out, it's not rocket science.

 

I definitely agree with your perspective. However, the challenge out there today is this is one of the rare places where you can get real help and genuinely knowledgeable people. Garage Journal, HAMB, and other various enthusiast sites are also helpful.

In this exampl, finding someone local to help is a REAL challenge. First, you need to find someone willing to come to your house and help and secondly they actually need to know what they are doing. If you need to take it to a professional shop that's $150-$200/hr. That starts to make a kit like this an "affordable" alternative.

Yes you can read books and watch videos and I do think that is the place to start. You can also try and get help from people online but have you ever seen a typical thread on troubleshooting a Holley. The number of know it alls talking out their a$$ is staggering. Literally 10 different opinions on how to solve a problem and you can end up chasing ghosts or making the problem worse. Too many people think they are experts but are *****. You don't find that here due to the maturity and actual experience people who use this site have, but it's the norm most everywhere else.

I had a Holley Avenger on my Camaro and I spent hours and hours trying to tune it. I got advice online in the Camaro forum like this, I bought 2 books, I watched videos and I just couldn't get it to run right. Every time I wanted to drive it it became a production and another day of tuning, climbing into the engine bay and spilling and getting covered in gasoline. On several sites I have seen people who bought new Holley carbs only to figure out after tons of troubleshooting that the machining was bad from the factory. It takes real experience to successfully troubleshoot something like that.

I tried an edelbrock carb and a Rochester Quadrajet and had a terrible time. I feel like I am just too stupid to get it without someone teaching me hands on.

25 years ago you could find someone who knew what a carb was and how to tune it and was willing to help. Today those people have dwindled to near zero. Even taking it to a "professional" shop or a speed shop is very little guarantee that they can sort it out. Usually those people have limited experience compared to those in the past. They don't have 50, 60 or 70 year old guys with years of hands on experience working there. The shops that actually know what they are doing charge huge premiums.

Having a product like this (assuming it actually does what it claims) helps solve that problem. If all I need is a good baseline on a set of jets and getting the mixture right with the aid of the tool and everything else gets adjusted automatically, that is for me a potential miracle and major cost saver. For $350 that is something I can save up for overtime. Spending many weekends trying to get something set up instead of driving and enjoying it becomes an opportunity cost discussion. For me, after spending years putting a project back together being kept from driving and enjoying it because I am constantly trouble shooting a carb issue really stinks.

Even on this site troubleshooting a "simple" 70 year old single barrel carb and potentially rebuilding it people find a challenge. Often the advice and recommendation is to send it out to Cowboy John or someone else which seems to be the only reliable alternative for many, including some very experienced people.

You learn from others hands on. Someone who knows what they are doing can get a carb dialed in in an afternoon or faster and you can learn from their experience how to do those things yourself. They are a dying, or I hate to say it a near dead breed. I don't think these solutions are only for rich people, but for people who need a solution to a problem they can't affordably get help with somewhere else. A book just can't beat hands on experience. Again, at current rates from a "professional " shop you can wind up into $1000 pretty quickly. The alternative is spending a driving season or longer troubleshooting a set of seemingly simple but often complex problems. Keep in mind that $100 in 1985 is about $310 today so when you compare affordable solutions to the past keeping inflation in perspective is important.

Short story, and this post is not intended to be contentious or to minimize or devalue your opinion, just another perspective on the topic, I agree people should learn everything they can through books and online, but when you run into a dead end an automated solution can often be a whole lot cheaper than paying for help since finding someone to learn from is often not an option. I don't think that makes it strictly a rich person's game these days. Additionally, there are a growing number of people familiar with modern fuel injection and electronic solutions Ike this you can get local or online help from than old time carb people. Changing settings on a computer and sharing the data output from the results is a really efficient way to get hands on help without actually being physically together. You just can't do that with a carb.

 

I didn't see it posted but this was invented by a YouTuber named Luke thunderhead 289. He is a very smart young man who can tune a ford into a sewing machine. I have watched every video he put out. He is so knowledgeable! You really need to watch it videos especially anything about setting up you distributor. Anyway after all his years of messing with carburetors he decided to put a lawnmower carb on his Falcon. And he came up with controlled air leak when trying to get that idea to run.

Anyway, I don't have one yet but to me it seems like a grear idea and a way to smooth out the AF ration on a carbureted engine. It needs to be used as a tuning device or on a well tuned engine not as a bandaid. It also can data log which again can help someone tune their carburetor for optimal performance.

On a side note.

It also scares me as it seems those who do know carburetors and how to properly tune them are not very forthcoming with their knowledge and folks always seem to belittle or criticize someone trying to clean. Eventually there won't be any good knowledge out there for carburetor set up.

 

Haven't tried one yet, but that looks pretty interesting Definitely curious if it actually makes tuning any easier in real-world use, especially on swapped setups.

 

I have found several older guys i my car club can tune carbs. It makes a big difference in me being able to enjoy my old vehicles. Some of mine have dual carbs which are even more fun to get balanced and dialed in. Most of the younger mechanics are more familiar with fuel injection. They can get those set very well, but the carb adjusting is becoming a lost art. Then you also throw in the complication of modern fuels too.

 

Cleanliness is of upmost importance and often found to be overlooked. I don't find many (non-commercial entities) to guard information, but I do find and abundance of wives tales, myths, and similar that make it difficult for the uninitiated to distill real information. Best advice is get a copy of the specific carburetor service manual, have good, clean, and appropriate tools and workspace, and then clean clean clean clean, and go for it! Be methodical and don't hesitate to ask questions Also, it should be noted that sometimes people jump right on into carburetor when attempting to addressing symptoms, but often, the issue lies elsewhere such as ignition or a vacuum leak. Then there are those who have a frankenstein carburetor that is made up of incompatible components from several different variants that all complicate or prevent effective tuning.

 

I see no option on their site for 2-barrel carbs. Or am i missing something? (??)

 

I don't believe they have an offering appropriate for our stock 2 barrels like the 94.