Well, here is my attempt at explaining what I learned from calling Powerservice (Diesel Kleen) in Texas yesterday (1/3/06).

Spoke with their Techincal Engineer about DFA's in general and how develop and compare their products to other brands... (This post is not intended to flame or start a war)... just to communicate what I was told on the phone.

Powerservice is privately held and the largest producer/refiner/mixer of diesel fuel additives. The next 3 largest combined do not equal them. They are the only company to have their own engineering, R&D, "tank farm" and mixing plant. All other companies source out the mixing and manufacturing to someone else (made to their specs of course).

Their products have been tested by the EPA as the governement challanged them on their claim of "less emissions" and were allowed to keep it as it does reduce them. Also tested by a "clean city" in Tennessee (can call PowerService for their name).

PowerService (PS) has the most lubrcity and injector cleaners of all brands. To use 16oz per 50 gallons is good and 32oz (double treatment) is better. There is no real benefit above this point as the cost is greater than the benefit.

I asked about Standyne and he said it was a good product, but does not contain the same levels of lubricty and cleaners of PowerService. I asked about why does Ford mention them by name.... and he answered that they use to make fuel pumps for Ford, but yet Ford allows the purchase and use of PowerService thorugh their Blue Diamond program. International ONLY USES Powerservice, Mack, Cummins, Detroit Diesel and all major motor manufactures all buy directly from PowerService.

I asked about the Standyne website comparsion and he said what is misleading is that they compare the PowerService "Diesel-lube" product which is a crankcase additive and not a fuel addtive!!!!

At no time did he say their product was bad, but just that theirs is proven to be better and purchased by all the major diesel motor companies.

He explained that with EGR valves, the regular use of DFA's is imparitive. Using at the normal rate is good, but double treatment is better due to the low sulfur fuel and lower Sulfur fuels due out in 2007. Additives due reduce soot and make for a cleaner burn and reduced EGR valve fouling. He explained that since I amusing 32oz per 44 gallons of fuel (double treatment) is the reason I have had zero problems so far (man, I hope he is right)!!!!

Cetane ratings in the US are at 40 (50 is high). PowerService will raise from 4 - 6 numbers and will help to a point (50 is max). The higher the number (whether purchasing premium diesel or adding additives) is always good and will increase performance in any diesel motor. There is talk of the government mandating a higher cetane number for all diesel fuel to help with EPA requirements and less fuel consumption, but refiners are balking at it due to the increased costs.

PowerService said they encourage people to call and love to hear from users of the products and enjoy the opportunity to speak to anyone that wants to learn more.

Again, this post is not started to make a "flamming war" but to post what I learned from calling PowerService directly. Guess I will now need to call Standyne later this week.

p.s. - The guy at PowerService agreed they do a poor job of marketing all of their benefits (to the general public) and that the results and use speak for themselves. They are happy with the sales and support of all major deisel motor manufactures use and support.

Thanks,

Jeff

 

Picked up a big bottle of the stuff (grey bottle) at advance auto the other day. Haven't put it in yet. Waiting to fill up. Dumb question... Do you put it in before you gas up or after? I assumed before would mix it beter...

Does it pour easy? Right from the quart size bottle into the tank? or do you use a funnel?

I was trying to think of the easiest way to measure it in and I figured just pouring a little, and looking at the level in the clear indicator strip would be good enough.

Any other methods?

 

Great info Jeff! Thanks for taking the time to share all of that. I've used both DK and Stanadyne in my truck in every tank, DK only in my tractor. Pending your call to Stanadyne it seems like DK may be the best way to go.

I'm always more impressed with a company that focuses on the positive aspects of their products, acknowledges the competition, and avoids negativity regarding their competition.

Regarding adding the product, I use a transmission fluid funnel and it works very well. Stanadyne has 'one-shot' bottles and I've refilled those with DK. Those fit right into the fuel filler neck. I add prior to fill up so it mixes well.

Russ

 

OK.... to be fair, I called Stanadyne just now (1/4/06).

Spoke with Simon (Dir. of Sales & Marketing). Here is what he had to say (interesting stuff)...

Their market is the private owner, RV's, VW diesels, Pick-ups and farmers, yet when I mentioened that his product is hard to find and buy for the "common person" he agreed. He staes that as a injector and pump manufacture they "know diesel motors" better than anyone else. Their market is the "off-road" market (industrial needs) and that over the road "big trucks" are not as finicky as our 6.0L motors (interesting).

They sell to OEM (Ford, GM, VW and John Deere to name a few). Their products are only sold at authorized distributors and injection pump specialists and rebuilders and they do not want to compete in the mass market arena (not sure why as their primary focus is on private owners like us) - his words not mine????
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So for agruments sake... lets just say that the two brands are equal.... here is where the use of DFA's is key and most companies said the same thing for all of us to consider....

1) Use FDA's in every tank - partial use is OK, but true benefits are only achieved when used 100% of the time.

2) The ultra low sulfur fuel comming out will only make it worse for all of us and increase the need for DFA usage!!

3) Since diesel in the US has a cetane rating of 40 (give and take), rasing the cetane level to the max makes for less soot, cleaner burn, less EGR valve fouling, less fuel consumption and more HP!!!!

4) The recommended dosage on the bottle (both companies) is to use 16oz (give or take) and both said that testing shows that double-treating really reduces EGR fouling... but that triple-treating is not beneficial and your spending more money than the benefits gained!!!

5) He went on to agree with PowerService that double-treating with any quality DFA is unfortunatly needed and will protect our motors better and will provide the protection we are after.
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I would like to see a poll of those using Stanadyne and Powerservice at regular strength and double strength and whether or not they have had any injector problems??? Seems that what is common between both brands is that cetane levels in the US are between 37 - 43 and the need for added lubricity is key!!!! Could explain all of the problems some of us have had or read about?

I run double-dosage year round in every tank.... and so far no problems... anyone else??

My final thoughts.... use Stanadyne or PowerService only (two largest producers) and use at double dosage rate all the time!!!!

Thanks,

Jeff
Trying to be "Fair & Balanced" in my reporting of the facts

 

nice work jeff you should work for a diesel power or truck magezine
as a journalist.

 

Now that would be cool... free use of all new trucks for testing... where do I send my resume?

 

Just use the window area on the bottle. The quart bottle neck fits just fine into my Excursion filler neck and I use the whole bottle (32oz) for my 44 gallon tank. I would use at least 16oz with the smaller tanks and not to worry about it.

Both companies said that their directions are a "guide" based on testing, but both said that their testing confirms way better results when using at double strength!!! I am amazed at what lengths people go to "measure" thair additives... just pour it in and know your doing the right stuff. I personally use PowerService due to increased availability and lower cost... therefore I just use the whole QT bottle and I do not worry about it (knock on wood).

 

BEACHBUMCOOK Great info! I never once used an additive for my 97 7.3 psd and never had any problems. I have used ps since day one on every tank on my 05 6.0 psd. and never have had any problems. I use a half bottle with every fill-up.
Diesel cetane rating is 48 in california according to cheveron. I always pay the extra dime for the good fuel. It just makes me feel safer.

 

That's great that your cetane is that high (must be some of the highest I have heard about). The problem is that cetane numbers are not mandated to be posted and the term "premium diesel" is loosely used and no one has any idea as to what makes it premium. On the Chevron website, they say that diesel fuel can be labled "premium" if it has 3 out of the 5 "improved" properties of diesel fuel present... problem is no one knows which 3 of the 5??? Maybe other benefits, but not cetane... no one knows unless a certain gas/fuel outlet goes out of the way to promote and ensure that it is.

Both companies said that adding their product raises cetane and that it is soley dependant on the fuel's original cetane level before adding their additive. Stanadyne said that it is about a penny a galllon per number increase in cetane level due to the extra refining process.

Keep adding it at double dosage and you will be fine according to both companies and we all will feel better when Ultra Low Sulfur Fuel hits the market later this year and in 2007.

 

Perhaps most here have seen it, but I will mention that Bosch had a report out on fuel quality about three years ago. I happen to find it somewhere, I don't remember where. It is in PDF format and I can send it to anyone that wants it. Its called "Diesel Fuel Lubricity Requirements for Light Duty Injection Equiptment." It is a fairly interesting read as it contains info on how the fuel quality affects the pumps etc. as they are fuel lubricated. It is interesting to understand that Bosch is concerned about the availability of quality fuel since they make the fuel systems for all the big three trucks.

 

Lubricity is the key buzzword. Jeff hit the nail on the head here. Good job.

Matt

 

Awesome info. That otta get you some positive rep points for a change

You and I and some others (including Timmy) have been beating the DFA drum for quite some time. Specific to the 6.0 engine.

A couple of points. 40 to 50 cetane is the range. 44 cetane is the National average. The 9 county DFW area distributors are mandated by the EPA to supply 46 cetane diesel. One of our posters has told of higher cetane ratings in Michigan as well. Just some FYI.

Since the beginning I have used PS a the rate of 0.64 oz / gal. at each and every fill up. I make a quick calculation of approximate fuel to be pumped and add first, according to the noted formula. And yes, my family would rather pick tics off a porcupine than sit in the truck while I fill 'er up.

From a cetane standpoint the value gained plateaus at 50. But, you can use that as a benchmark. Adding more than the prescribed dosage will not hurt, In fact, it will enhance the lubricity properties even more.

IMO both products are good. What is important is that you use something...all the time.

Thanks again Jeff.

 

Well if lubricity is what we need then a little Bio-diesel should due the trick. The only problem is finding it at the 5% level per Ford.

 

Another product with interesting claims is Pri-D. I have been using them for a while. You can find information at http://www.priproducts.com/.

 

Just add 1/2 a bottle (quart) at each fill up and spend the new found free time buying yorself a beer (can you still drink a beer while driving in Texas... like the old days)? Stop upsetting the family... your stuck with them for the next 10 hour drive for your vacation!!!!