Good morning all,

I'm on the cusp of buying a 1977 F600 that I suspect needs a new brake booster. (The pedal is hard and requires a ton of pressure to slow the truck down) I've called local parts stores and it sounds like Cardone no longer sells these or does a repair service. I haven't found one for sale anywhere else online. There is a product from Battle Born Brakes that looks kind of like it would work, but their example photo doesn't exactly match the master cylinder that's in this truck.

Does anyone have a lead on where I could buy a brake booster for this truck or if the Battle Born upgrade would be compatible? Or even a factory part number for the booster would be helpful. Thank you!

 

Stay far, far away from any Cardone product; I returned three Cardone reman distributors last year; all were trash rebuilds (but very shiny!).

 

I was not aware of Ford using a dual master cylinder on the 77 models, or has someone attempted to upgrade the brake system

 

Yeah it looks like stock should have been a single master cylinder. Since it's already got lines there for a dual, maybe the battle born upgrade would be even more plug and play.

 

Well, they are asking $17,500 for that truck.





Probably oughtta merge this with his original decode thread.

 

MPC does show a dual MC for '73-on was available. I hadn't seem one before, but it was an option (as was air brakes, etc.). Back then, Ford had lots of options.

 

Thanks for looking that up, asavage. That is helpful information to have. Yeah, I started a separate thread because a part request might get different attention than the vin decode. It also makes this topic searchable if someone down the road is looking for booster info on one. If mods see fit to merge the threads, have at it.

His $17,500 asking price is pretty unrealistic considering what work still needs to be done. It's been for sale locally for a long time and I think he will be willing to negotiate something more fair.

 

The truck looks shiny . . . but the close-ups show it's not a restoration-level job, and F600s are cheap and plentiful around our part of the world. And that price is . . . wow. I don't doubt that there are that vintage F600s that are worth that coin, but I'd have to want that truck a lot to pay anywhere near their asking.

That said, I bought a driveable turd from Everett a year ago for $2.7k from a dying roofer (cancer) and the spreadsheet I have on it is well north of $7k now -- parts only, I guess -- and it's not shiny like that red one. So . . . maybe my price/value balance needs recalibrating. If your red one didn't need anything, well there's value in that for sure. For example, just getting a bolt-in radiator for our trucks is north of $1300; I went for a semi-bolt-in Chinesium knock-off for pickups, and then modified and compromised until I've got something that fits & works, for under $500. A lot of choices have to be made, working with 50-year-old iron. But, as you've seen WRT the brake booster, "it's always something".

ISTR that people have said here that NAPA can still source rebuilt remote boosters, and that the trick is ID'ing them correctly. The Battle Born setup looks really nice, but it's an investment, only to be undertaken if you're serious about keeping the truck. I wouldn't be alarmed (yet) about a failed booster, but my MO is always to use this kind of thing as major negotiating points. Knowing nothing about that red rig, it looks like . . . maybe $6k? I mean, even a mediocre paint job, done by someone else, is worth $3k these days. Shiny ones are rarer around here than work trucks, but they're around.

My bench seat was shot, and I found a newly-reupholstered F150/250 seat in Bow ("just up the road", for you non-locals) for $150 last summer that was a bolt-in; a restorer bought a parts truck it was in, and the new customer wanted different color . A local glass shop will put a new windshield in, with new rubber, for $430 out the door. The F-series stuff interchanges really well in that era. But it's always going to take time (or buckets of money, if you don't DIY), and in the end you trade one for the other.

 

I'm looking at NAPA on line. (Change vehicle type to "medium/heavy") and finding a couple or more frame mounted boosters.

Since you have the dual post master, it might take some doing to find the correct hydro-vac booster. Some of those trucks had two frame mounted hydro-vac boosters.

https://www.napaonline.com/en/p/NBB518006

Your OEM booster should have some identifying info on it with which you can search for a rebuild or replacement.

Does the booster have vacuum to it?

Check the rear of the intake for the vacuum line and check valve and associated hoses.

You posted this:
https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.for...53e3184267.png

That's for a firewall mounted booster, not your truck.

 

Yeah, it's kind of odd that there aren't two boosters under the cab, with a dual MC.

Good idea, esp. as there's painter's tape on the firewall check valve.





I'm not so sure. It's vague, but I think that the ad is for all Fords with the MC on the firewall, as opposed to what we read when looking up boosters ("fits all with factory firewall booster", etc.). What Ford calls "Vacuum -- Dash Mounted". IE, not the C-Series, but yeah, hard to figure.


[later]
Uh, oh.

Here's what the dual system should look like:




A dual booster, and a reservoir. There might be other variations, but you know the MPC: unless you're an expert, and lot can hide in there.

Anyway, what's more concerning is this oddity:




Now, where does that second MC brake line go? Doesn't look like it goes to the brakes. My guess is a brake controller for towing, perhaps?

I agree with @@85e150 that a hard pedal and no whoosing (hissing), and the brakes do still operate (poorly) sounds more like a lack of vacuum than a failed booster, but I'm no expert and that's just my opinion. You can't check anything on the truck, I assume, so it'll have to remain a mystery, but . . . does the dash-mounted vacuum gauge operate? If so, there's vacuum to the firewall check valve/tee, which means that unless someone has clamped the line from the tee to the booster (or inserted a plug in the hose, which I have been unfortunate enough to have had to encounter and diagnose), the booster would be the next likely culprit.

If there is a whoosh coming from behind the driver seat when the pedal is first depressed, and it doesn't continue to whoosh as the pedal is held down, the vacuum portion of the booster is doing something somewhat correct, and you might have other issues related to the hydraulics, which as we have seen posted recently can be as simple as someone applying vice grips where they don't belong. Hard pedal but only one or two wheels being braked, it has happened.

 

for what it's worth : my 1978 F-600 had a single line MC & booster , I suffered the same problems with Cardone. I installed a Battle Born dual line kit on it , I am very pleased with it . Within the last year I posted a report on the details

 

For the $17,500 price tag on that 77 model truck those brakes should darn well work with no issues
It starting to souls like lipstick on a pig

 

Thank you all for the input on this, especially asavage for finding that diagram of the dual MC setup. There is just the single booster under the cab. The seller gave me some old photos of the truck and one of them shows a trailer brake controller in the cab right where that second brake line disappears. I did buy the truck and paid a much more reasonable price. It’s at my shop (not at home) right now but I’ll be going through all this stuff more closely on Monday.

@85e150 I did see those listed at NAPA but when I called for availability they have been discontinued. I got an email back from Jacob and Battle Born Brakes. His firewall mounted booster setup is designed to be a replacement for trucks that originally had under-mounted boosters. He said it would work on this truck but I need to send him a measurement from back of MC to the brake pedal so he can send me one with the correct length rod. I think I’ll go that route since I’ve heard good things about it. First I’ll look everything over though in case it’s something more simple like vacuum line problems or ill-placed vice grips.

//// UPDATE /////
I did install the brake booster and master cylinder from battle born brakes and it works great. It was a little tricky to get all the air out of the lines. This was my first time making brake lines, so someone with more experience would have an easier time with it. I mounted the distribution block to the inside of the frame.

 

Sounds good. Good luck with it!

 

Funny you should mention that. My '73 F600's MC was leaking and when I went to buy a replacement, I bought a , not noticing its coverage was only through '72. It bolted in OK, but the pushrod length required was wrong; there was a mile of play. I "fixed" that by buying an , which took care of that. For the F600, apparently the MC piston pushrod depth was machined shallower '73-on.