Let me start out by saying that the truck with the issues has only 1100 miles on it. It was bought by my former employer who decided to sell the company and retire a month after getting me a new truck to drive. It took me three months but I was able to buy the F250 4x4 Diesel pickup for about half what it would have cost me new.

I own 10+ trailers, the main purpose of this truck is for towing. I've got a 30' travel trailer, a 14' enclosed toy hauler, a 32' 3 axle enclosed car trailer, a 24' enclosed car trailer that's used for swap meets, a 16' open center car trailer,
a 14' BriMar dump trailer, one open single axle utility trailer, a 24' boat on a trailer, a 16' aluminum boat, and two equipment trailers, one is a year old Cam Superliner Warrior with optional steel deck, and the other a mid deck flat bed which was sold by a local farm supply about 40 years ago, most likely locally built.

Now to the issue, the truck tows all but two of the trailers without any issues, I've had the 32' enclosed trailer loaded to the ceiling with all my tools when I moved here in the spring, I was surprised the truck hauled it so effortlessly. I've towed the 24' enclosed all over the country with this and my old F150. It wasn't ideal but I made do with the F150 for many years.

Now the problem is with the two mid deck equipment trailers. Both trailers buck violently at 30 and 50 mph. If I accelerate hard, I can get up to highway speed without the issue but if I drive normal, it starts to buck violently around 29 mph and gets severe by 34 mph. The bucking stops for a bit and begins again at 50 mph to 61 mph.

It doesn't do any of this with any of my other trailer or any of my friends trailers I've pulled. The odd thing is that my old truck pulled both these trailers fine, as does my buddies 1997 F350, and another buddies 1992 F250 with a six cylinder.

I tried a few things to isolate the problem, first off was to set a fish tank full of water on the front of the trailer where I could watch it, and glass jar with water taped to the top rear of the bed rail.
When the bucking starts, the tank on the trailer is not sloshing around at all, the trailer apparently isn't feeling the bucking, the jars of water on the rear rails are moving around but not that much. Now if I put a jar of water on the drivers floor, its being shaken violently when the bucking starts.
Those riding next to me don't notice anything at all.

I've tried raising and lowering the ball, I've got two adjustable ball mounts, a load eq hitch, and one of those three way ball mounts.
The best results seem to be with the trailer slightly high in the front with a ball mount that puts the ball even with the bottom of the hitch tube about 18.25 " off the ground.

I took the whole rig to a trailer dealer, and to the Ford dealer, the dealer says its the trailer, the trailer people say its the truck or the hitch, so I let them put a brand new Putnum hitch and ball mount on it. The Ford dealer changed all four shocks, the rear springs, rotated the tires, replaced the driveshaft, and serviced the transmission, but nothing has changed.
I can't see how it can be either, the truck doesn't do it with any other trailers and the trailers don't act up on any other of my or my buddies trucks. I pulled the Cam Warrior equipment trailer home with my 1992 302 Bronco when I bought it, almost 400 miles one way and it towed great, I get the F250 to pull it and I can't make it around the block without it pounding the teeth out of my head.
A few times it got to bucking at higher speed, I was cruising about 65 mph with a light load on the trailer and it started up at that speed, it was so violent that it felt like I was being tossed up and down in the seat.
Adding a LOT of tongue weight helps. I had two bundles of 12' 4x4's on the trailer sitting stacked at the front of the trailer this morning and it barely bucked or bounced at all.
The sensation that I feel is like when a novice driver lets the clutch out too fast, (but my truck is an automatic). I feel it in the seat. It does it both accelerating and when coasting or braking. Pulling the light equipment trailer was the main reason for me wanting the heavier truck.
I can pull the extremely heavy camper with no issues, I can pull any other trailers but these tow with no problems.
Using the load equalizing hitch makes the issue ten times worse, the bucking is so bad I have to slow down and pull over and take off again harder to prevent it.
One thing that really has everyone stumped is that if I pull away fast, pedal to the floor, it doesn't buck, and it won't buck on decel that time, if I take off normal, it bucks around 30, and again around 50. If I take it up to 60, then let it coast back down, it'll buck again while slowing down at those speeds. Running with the hitch set too high is better than having the hitch level. I went down to a local trailer dealer, that doesn't sell these trailers and let them drive it, they told me the trailer was off balance? If that's the case, why doesn't any other truck buck with it? Even a few with the same 148 wb.
My neighbor has a 2002 7.3l auto 4x4, same configuration as my 2016, and that truck pulls either of these trailers fine at almost any hitch height.
The truck is like new, never been hit, never been modified other than the new hitch now. Its been in my possession since it left the dealer last December. It sat from April to mid July of this year while the owner of the company took his time coming up with a price and the title. I think it was a matter of him making sure the truck was paid off before he could sell it to me, either way, it means I finally have a diesel truck to tow with.
If it acted this way on all my trailers or if my old truck or any other truck did the same thing, I'd understand but its an issue with this truck and these two trailers. Neither trailer is all that heavy, at least nothing that should strain this truck.

I'm open to suggestions here, what on earth could make this truck and these two trailers such a bad combination?
Any ideas?

 

Wow, this is strange. Here's my WAG..
Since the bucking is speed related, what about balancing & making sure the the trailer tires are true?
These trucks seem to be subject to harmonics. My '17 (and others on another Diesel specific site) has random vibrations that come and go depending on road surface, speed and ??.
My thought is if the trailer has something minor going on vibration wise, the truck is amplifying it.

 

check with your ford dealer... was a service notice... for osculations..

ford has a device that mounts at frame to hitch.. to stop that very thing...
I think its called a harmonic dampener ..

talk to a dealer.

several posts on this forum about owners having this done..
some got it done under warranty.. others had to pay..

<< Found it >>
https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/1...pping-tsb.html

read that link... it might be your problem.

 

I saw that, one of the techs at the dealer brought it up but Ford only authorizes that for 8' bed trucks, mine is a shortbed supercab.

When it happens, its violent, hard enough to bounce you out off the seat. Yet things in the bed aren't moving around and the trailer is riding dead steady. I even had a buddy drive me around at 30 mph sitting on the front of the trailer while it does it, I can feel nothing at all while on the trailer, yet I can see the drivers head bobbing back and forth as it bucks up front.
The same while riding in the bed of the truck, you can feel it but barely. It appears to be bobbing the front of the truck up and down as it pulls but from the drivers seat if feels like the back of the truck is bouncing up and down. The one thing I did notice is that the hitch isn't rattling, its not seeing the oscillation at that point, the hitch has enough play in the receiver that it'll knock or rattle over rough roads but when its bucking, the hitch isn't banging around, its dead steady and under tension.
What also gets me is that it doesn't just do it under power, its just as bad when coasting down to and below those speeds. If I manage to take off and get up to say 65 mph with no bucking, it will never do it when coasting down to a lower speed, if it does it on acceleration, it will always do it when coasting or slowing back down. Once it starts, you can't stop it unless you slow down below 30 and re-accelerate.

The part that I really don't get is that adding load torsion bars to the hitch makes it 100 times worse, with the bars on its not driveable. It bucks and shakes so bad I have no doubt it'll do damage to the truck or hitch.


The trailer has plenty of tongue weight, more than 400lbs plus the weight of a 12,000 lb Ramsey winch and #27 battery on the tongue, and a spare tire in the tongue box. Its a heavy trailer compared to my car trailer but not that heavy considering its 10,000 lb GVW rating. Its got twin Dexter 5,000lb axles. The wheels are balanced and I upgraded the tires to 10 ply rated Michelin LT highway tires vs. the Carlisle tires it came with which were already showing cracks after only a few months.
I'm pretty confident its not the trailer, it pulls fine behind every other truck I've used it behind.

The only two definite things I know at this point is that tongue weight helps, (but doesn't completely eliminate the issue), and how hard I accelerate can decide whether or not it starts bucking.
If I take off like I'm at the races, just short of tire spin, it never bucks.

If I hitch it super high, high enough to almost unload the front axle trailer, (12" rise ball mount), it behaves a lot better but its still not perfect, and certainly not a safe way to tow the trailer.

I considered trying the box damper that Ford has for the bulletin you mentioned but they won't do it under warranty on a shortbed and they want $477 for the part and there's no guarantee it'll help.

I've also tried varying the length of the ball mount, if it is a harmonic issue, then changing the hitch or hinge point should change the speed or type of vibration but it made no improvement. Using an extra long ball mount did however make it a lot worse at higher speeds and with the longer ball mount, (about 12" from the receiver lip), it was almost undriveable even at lower speeds. It felt like I had a 10" lump on all four wheels at only 5 mph. It shook so bad it would make the CD player skip.
With the longer ball mount, it would start to buck or bounce even at minimal acceleration, just letting off the brake and letting it creep up to speed. It would start to shake almost instantly as the truck began to roll.
It felt like the rear wheels were egg shaped even at only a few mph.

The part I'm not getting is that this should be easier to find, its not a minor issue, it bucks so bad you can't talk in the truck when it happens, the CD skips, and people look at your funny because your being shook around in the cab.
I used to drive tractor trailers years ago, the effect I'm feeling reminds me of trying to move a heavy trailer with a single axle yard jockey with the fifth wheel too far back and a bad clutch. On those the cab would bounce up and down as the truck struggled to move the heavy load, but on them you simply let off the power a bit or downshifted to stop it.

The problem is that this pickup is doing it with an empty trailer, on a ball hitch. The trailer is light for what it is, maybe 2400 lbs or so empty. This trailer has upgraded axles and an all steel deck rather than wood so its a bit heavier than what they list in the brochure. The winch and battery add about 220lbs too.

As an example a friend of mine took this trailer tonight to go pickup some supplies in the morning at Lowes, he's towing it with an old 80 something Chevy Blazer, and it tows perfect behind that truck, which I hardly consider a good tow vehicle. It also don't buck behind my Bronco, or my 1992 F150, or my 1997 F350 4x4. I towed it home new with the Bronco, picking up a Ford Explorer on the trip home with it.

If its an issue, I may not keep the new truck, I can't have a truck that's finicky about what it tows.

I also don't see how a damper will fix a problem that's only there with two trailers, its fine with all the other trailers I've towed, even the new 32ft enclosed trailer and my smaller open car trailer.
I've even towed a few very similar trailers to the one with the problem with no issues.

 

400 pound for a 12,000 trailer... way to light.. my opinion..

my 8,300 pound trailer has a tongue weight of 1,100 pounds.

trailer should be level to slight nose down..


I hope you get it figured out.

 

There is another thread, I believe in the towing section, that has very similar symptoms. Different trucks pull the trailer well. But that same trailer on the Ford pulls horrible. I think he resolved it as I recall.

 

I would have your request contacting the area FORD rep and have him ride with you to demonstrate the problem. He has authority to try the mod required as the 8' bed trucks. This problem us a major safety issue. Also report it to NHTSA: https://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/VehicleComplaint/

 

The rep refused to make the call, said its not Fords problem they didn't build the trailer.

As to tongue weight, the factory hitch had a sticker on it stating that maximum tongue weight was 500 lbs, the hitch the trailer shop put on it reads 800 lbs max stamped right in the metal.
The initial set up for this trailer was to tow the trailer with the front about 1/4" lower than the rear, it bucked and jerked all the time like that. They then came up with a shorter ball mount that let it ride dead level, that was better but not much.
The best fix was about 4" high in the front, but the higher I get the tongue, the better it gets. Adding tongue weight helps but I have to add so much tongue weight that the truck is clearly overloaded. If I add torsion bars to level the load at that point, the thing bucks and vibrates the truck so bad its nearly impossible to drive.

A customer of mine who owns a similar but older truck today stopped by, when I asked if he ever had the issue he said he only tows his boat with the truck.
I let him hook up to my trailer and take it for a ride and it did the same thing, not quite as bad but it bucked when you took off easy.
His bucked almost the minute the trailer started to roll if you didn't give it a lot of throttle. If you let it just start rolling, it hopped right away and kept it up till you came to a stop.

I found one post from a few months ago where a guy had an older model doing the same thing but his turned out to be a broken hitch, mine has a new hitch and its done it with both the original hitch and the new hitch. I can see where this could tear or break a trailer hitch though.

After re-reading that old post, that guy pointed out something about the distance from the front wheels to the rear wheels matching the distance of the rear wheels to the trailer wheels and that's exactly what I've got here. The truck measures 148.5 inches and from the centerline of the rear wheels of the truck to the centerline of the front trailer axle I have 148.5 inches.
After realizing this, I stuck a ball in the bumper hole, shortening the distance about a foot, and while the bumper can't tow that way for long it did show me that the bucking was all but gone. Its not perfect but tolerable like that. This is my only longer wheelbase truck, all the other trucks are regular cab 8' beds. They don't have any issues at all with this trailer. The problem is almost all 10K equipment trailers are built very similar with the wheels being placed at a very similar point, close enough that it may give me the same issue if that indeed is where its coming from.

Also, if its a pivot point issue, then why do the torsion bars make it so much worse?

 

I stopped by the selling dealer today, (no longer local to me). I had the trailer in tow.
I had a coupon for a free oil change from when I bought it. While there I had one tech take it for a drive with the trailer. What he told me was a bit shocking. He said its called superduty bounce, they all do it and that its supposedly to do with frame flex. He said be glad mine doesn't do it all the time.
I didn't believe him and told him he'd have to prove it.
We unhooked the trailer, went and got his personal truck, a 2002 supercab shortbed 4x4 and took it out with my trailer, it did the exact same thing, but on his, without the trailer it bounces some even without the trailer around 45mph.
The service manager said its a harmonics issue that has to do with the frame rails flexing. He showed me a few TSB's on the issue but said none have yet to be successful. He said this has been an issue since 1999.

Had anyone else heard any such thing?
If this is how these things tow this truck is out of here.
The funny thing also is that it only does it on this trailer, but it is probably my heaviest trailer.
I'm going tomorrow to test tow a new trailer, one similar but a few feet longer to see if it solves the issue, but after hearing what I heard today I have my doubts.

 

The more I think about what the last dealer told me, the more it doesn't make sense to me.

Under very minimal acceleration, with the trailer on, its bounced or bucked from almost a dead stand still, I've had it do this while sitting in traffic moving 5 mph 10 ft at a time. Just letting it roll forward by letting off the brake is often all it takes. The first time it happened I thought I had a bad tire, it felt like a rear tire had a 6" lump, but that's not the case. I can also power through it with more throttle and prevent the bounce all together but I have to step down enough that I'd risk wheel spin or shifting a load around.
I can't see how it could possibly be frame flex or movement at such low speeds, trailer or not. Besides, if the frame was flexing, I'd feel some movement between the bed and cab while its happening. I can lay my hand across the bed to cab gap out the sliding rear window with someone else driving and there's no noticeable movement there, not like I see happening at the wheels. The real kicker here is that if I ride on the trailer while its doing it, I don't feel it at all unless its let go till the point it gets pretty drastic.
My brother owns a 2012 model basically the exact same truck as mine but with a gas engine. His truck pulls this trailer fine, not so much as a hint of a bounce. But for whatever reason, his truck doesn't stop as well as mine does with a heavy trailer. So that tells me there may be axle or brake differences as well but I used that truck before I bought this one and it pulled this trailer fine. His has 220K on it as well. Mine hasn't even reached its first oil change yet.
So far I've got a truck and trailer combo that's pretty much unusable together. So far they've replaced the shocks, wheels and tires, driveshaft, transmission mount, and rear springs. Nothing has changed a thing. When I was riding in my truck with the tech driving, I was able to completely turn around and look at the back of the truck while it was doing it, I could see the body going up and down on the suspension, at its worst, it was moving about 3 inches up and down on dead smooth road. It seems like the less throttle you give it, the faster the bounce or buck starts, at a minimal throttle take off, it feels like your being shaken up and down violently. We also found that if you let it continue, the tires actually bark as they load and unload. It gets out of control if you let it just keep getting worse.
If you stop, then take back off by mashing on the throttle hard it never bounces.
I can't see any flex in the body to cab area, its just the back of the truck bouncing up and down when it happens. Its not as noticeable looking in the rear view mirror, but when you can stick your head out the window and watch it, its obvious the gap between the tire and wheel lip is changing with every bounce.
The part I don't get is how if its the frame flexing, at such a low speed it could get the back of the truck bouncing that much? I don't think I could jump up and down in the bed and make it move that much.
One of the points they checked was the distance between the helper springs and the frame for some reason but as far as I know the truck has never been down on the helper springs, even with maximum tongue weight. Its sprung that heavy. I had the bed full of concrete blocks and the thing never showed any sag.

When I bought this truck I was after an F350 not a 250, the sales rep and a few salesmem at various dealers all said that the only difference in the 250 and 350 was ride height, they produced build sheets on both and all we could find different was the rear spring hardware. The power train, springs, and other running gear was the same.
After driving both, the 250 I bought rode the best overall and it had all the options I wanted. The tow rating was well over anything I'd ever tow at 12,200 lbs.
The lower ride height was the big plus to me over the taller 350 model.

I've always thought that the Superduty trucks were as good as it gets when it comes to towing, I can't see how or why Ford would allow these trucks to continue with some inherent problem.
I've always owned Fords, but I did look at the other two diesel trucks when I bought this, it was a close tie between the GMC and the Ford, but the Ford felt better all around. I wasn't going to buy a Dodge knowing that in some screwed up way it was a Fiat product now, with or without the Cummins engine.

 

Would it be possible to find a ball mount with a shank that is longer than your current one? Maybe adding a couple of inches to the over all length will help. The WDH shanks seem to be longer than regular ball mounts.

 

I tried that, the first set up I had tried was a load equalizing hitch that put the ball almost 13in from the receiver face.
The shorter I go, the better it feels.

I just tried one of those three in one combo drawbars, while its one of the shorter ones I've tried, it puts the ball even with the top of the receiver.
Its the worst combo I've felt besides the Drawtite eq hitch.
Higher is definitely better, with a 4" rise it only bounces at 30-34 mph at very minimum throttle but the front wheels of the trailer aren't seeing much weight that way.

I didn't design the trailer, but its laid out 60/40 like any other trailer I've ever owned. I have a 12 ton Jersey brand equipment trailer here, its a bit heavy for the F250 to tow at 2900 lbs empty but its still only got 512 lbs of tongue weight when measured in a scale empty. (Park my 580E on it and things change fast though). That trailer pulls with a pintle hitch and is usually behind a dump truck though.

The OEM hitch that came off it had 800 lbs max tongue weight in the owners manual, but only 500 lbs on the decal on the hitch. The one on it now is stamped 850 lbs max tongue weight Class 5. I don't think there's a hitch made rated for much more tongue weight.

A thousand pounds of tongue weight would have the rear suspension buried too. Keep something else in mind, this trailer tows fine behind all my other trucks, its just this truck that has the issue, my older and lighter trucks do fine with it. My two heaviest open trailers give this truck problems. However it tows my 32' enclosed trailer just fine and that thing weighs three times what my equipment trailers do.

I towed this trailer home with my Bronco, empty of course but it pulled fine, it didn't even feel like it was struggling at all. When I hook this thing to the F250, it feels like I'm pulling a load of lead behind me. The truck gets pushed around by the trailer, it bounces, and I have to push hard to keep up speed with it.
When I left the truck at the dealer last time, I couldn't leave the trailer there so they gave me a loaner. They didn't have a truck in the loaner fleet available so they pulled a used Ranger off the lot for me to use, I don't think the salesman knew about the trailer but I got in that truck, went around back, screwed a ball into the bumper and hauled my trailer back to me place up there with a 2010 4x4 Ranger pickup. It did the job just fine, even in the mountains there. The trailer isn't that heavy empty, maybe 2,200 lbs when empty tops. If a seven year old Ranger can tow this trailer, I don't see any reason why a brand new F250 diesel would have any issues with it. I've pulled a lot of less then ideal trailers over the years and never felt anything like this before.

I did a search online for F250 Bouncing, and found dozens of other people with the same issues all the way back to 1999. Apparently this may be an ongoing issue with these trucks? What they describe sure seems to be what I'm experiencing.

 

On mine I found the hitch broken away where the tube meets the cross bar but I am still not sure if the trailer caused it or if it was just a bad weld. It looked like they missed welded the hitch to me.

 

I think I pretty much eliminated the truck as being the issue here this weekend. I borrowed a 20' long 6 ton trailer and took a 500 mile round trip across PA to pick up a tractor and I didn't feel so much as a jiggle out of the that trailer at any speed. I ran full highway speeds the whole way.
Its got to be an issue with the trailer. The tires on that trailer can't be balanced since they have no centers, (low boy wheels), and not a single tire is perfectly round, nor were the last set. When you tighten the clamps, you go mainly for getting all the bolts even so the tire don't wobble, there's not much you can do about lateral runout in the tires. The tires on it now are name brand 7x14.5LT, I tried balancing them with their matching hubs attached but I don't feel any difference. I even tried moving the tires around to different positions but it made no difference.
Turning a corner definitely makes a difference, I drove 20 miles with out any bouncing on Sunday, after I made the first turn, it bounced like crazy, then two more turns, and it was gone. I'm starting to think that at certain times all the wheels get lined up just right so they all are off balance in the same direction of all the high spots all line up or something to that effect. When its not doing it, nothing will start it up other than making a turn. The tires are high pressure 14 ply trailer tires. The wear pattern is good, there's no uneven wear, but they are wearing fast. They were new last summer but they're probably half way worn down already in only a few thousand miles.
They also crown a lot when inflated, they look over inflated at only 35 psi, yet they're marked 120 psi max.

 

My truck does the same thing if I tow my trailer without removing my bed cover.