I know that this is a subject talked about often enough but my questions is that I have the parts for my '58 that I want to have cleaned up before sheet metal work. I have been reading what I can about acid dipping and soda blasting.

But my situation is that I have been talking to a auto mechanic in my area for quite some time and he keeps on insisting me to have my parts dipped. But what I can find for businesses on dipping, I would have to drive 5+ hours to get my parts to a place that does it. On the other hand I can drive only a few hours away and have them media blasted.

I tried talking to him about having my parts media blasted but he seemed to almost get worked up. He was talking like media blasting is the worst thing to have done in a restoration. Well as I see it, yes it can be bad if the guy doing the blasting doesn't know what it is that he is doing and spends to much time on the panels yes then they will most likely warp on you. Otherwise it really would effect much would it right? On a few things I read sounded like they would blast the parts more than one time is this true?

Does anyone know of any other acid dipping place that would be closer to southeast MN other than the Redi-Strip in Roselle IL? I seen a Redi-Strip in Milwaukee but all I could find about that was it sounded like it focuses mainly on buildings or construction.

As for media blasting all I could find are businesses in Minneapolis.

I would guess the dipping would be easier for him but wow would it be nothing but frustrations for me. Where as the media blasting would be much easier for me and he would also probably be able to cope with it.

All of my parts have the really thick heavy paint and the scaly rust all over them. At this point I could probably afford to have either process done but I don't want to blow all my money on dipping and not have any money left to have the sheet metal work done. Any sugestions?

 

Media blast (glass beads, plastic, walnut shells, whatever) will not damage the metal, but also will not remove any rust.

so, you will have to use sand or dip. I lost a hood, doors and part of a cab to a bad blaster using sand..

sam

 

This is a good topic as I have heard horror stories from folks for both options. Sure makes it hard to decide!!

I went the media blast route. Luckily for me living near Mobile AL, there is a gentlemen nearby that has media blasted about 3,000 car/truck components over the past 15 years. He uses high volumes of a sand media that is extremely fine. It removed all paint and rust and did not warp or do any damage to the sheet metal. To blast and prime the cab was $200, each door was $60. The parts came back looking like the day they were born (that is if they were born with some dings, dents, and rust holes!).

I only found him through networking with some locals who have done restorations themselves. Even contacted a small local body shop that I had heard did nice restorations. Once all my contacts pointed me in the same direction, I felt comfortable using him. It was still a hard decision, so good luck with yours. You may try the same approach by making some contacts with those in your local area that have done restorations.

For those of you looking to get this done in the deep South, here is the gentlemen I used:
Phil Osterkamp (Strip Tech), Grand Bay, AL, Contact Phone: (251) 865-3678



Fred

 

I should have added.. for the front fenders & inners, cab, doors, hood, and running boards the 1st disaster cost me $750. (lost a hood, doors, and caused major work on the cab). make sure the contract makes THEM responsible, and take pictures in advance.

the second one, a whole truck, cost $1100..

in both cases they primed after blast.

Sam

 

Blast. The acid NEVER comes out of the seams, and messes up your paint later on down the line.

~Jason

 

From what I have read sounds like media blasting will remove the rust but it isn't as abrasive as sand blasting. And soda blasting is so delicate that it won't even skratch glass. But soda blasting will not remove the rust.


I deffinatly would not want to send my parts off to someone who blasts parts only so often. I would want to send them off to someone who has been in the business for years. Someone that is really experienced at what they do like in your case.


Well again on what I have read yes it can if no preparations have been done to the body parts before they are painted. Sounds like you can use a mixture of 90% water and 10% vinegar to spray and douce those tight seems with to neutralize the acid.




To me it sounds like both processes have their down falls and can be damaging if not done right. They both have to have their preparations to be done before painting. The acid dipping gets more through in the cleaning aspect almost to thorough but costs big bucks. Acid dipping sounds to be much easier to everyone if convient for your project. Throw them in a tank and let the acid do the work. Where blasting you still have the middle man doing the blasting but it does costs much much less. Isn't as thorough but it really doesn't have to be thorough in that every nook and crany is cleaned.

I guess I am leaning more towards the blasting route because I just don't need the cleaning to be as thorough as the dipping.

But i guess my real problem is do I go against what he keeps telling me about the dipping process and have my parts blasted?

There are other businesses that do restorations in my area but one in particular focuses on old cars but they do charge big bucks to do it. I am actually going to talk to the guy that owns that business today because he has a 1960? F-250? 4x4 that he wants to sell for $400. He's not sure of the year but I am guessing it's an F-250 because it's 4x4.

Where this guy that I have been talking to has been in the auto mechanics business for many years he hasn't told me a number. Sounds like 30+ years, he has told me about all of the cars that he has worked on. Even sounds like he has high standards for the work he puts out. He was pretty sure that I should have my parts dipped and not blasted. Like blasting was the worst thing in the world.

Do I tell him that I will have them blasted and if he doesn't like it I will go somwhere else? He is a nice guy and all but I don't want to be the bad guy.

 

You are in a tough spot... Well I have had both done and won't dip a body again. I have a 34 ford coupe body that was dipped some 20 years ago and yes it got all the rust but it did leach out of body seams later. Luckily the car took a long time to build and almost every seam was cut open to be rust repaired so I don't expect final paint problems. Getting the rust out of the seams does not mean that there is any rust prevention that is going back in so will rust again and that may bleed onto final paint as well. These trucks were assembled in bare metal then painted so there is going to be some amount of rust in every seam. I blast stuff myself as the cost is just too much even tho it is a dirty job. Acid dipping I think is good for things like door latches that you don't want to take apart. If it could be dipped then neutralized then soaked in an epoxy primer that gets into the spot welded seams then sign me up for that, otherwise media blast.
It is your truck and you are the one that has to fix it later so the best thing to do is keep talking to people that have actually done it to their own car.
I have some drip rails on my panel that are very rusty in the seam and the only real fix is going to be removal, blast clean, prime and weld back on and then hope it doesn't bleed rust later. Good luck

 

If you want to media blast, I used a brand called black beauty its ground up slag.
It made quick work of paint and rust, however you cant stay in one area too long. Otherwise it will blow a hole through thinner areas of old rusty steel panels. Sand blasting "silica sand" is very risky health wise, you Have to use the proper breathing equipment.

If you elect to have it acid dipped make sure they bake all parts,this will ensure all the liquid is gone in all the seams. A good dipping shop will charge anywhere from $800-1000 for just the cab alone, it usually takes a week or longer for a correct dip.

 

Chemical dip or sand blast. Both are fine if the person or company knows what they are doing and has the proper equipment. Chemicals can ruin a job if they are used wrong and so can sand blast. What you get with the dip is the ability to clean where sand blast can't get. I take our stuff over to the powder coat place and have them bake the parts after dipping (only when there is a seam or joint I can not wash really well) even if I am not going to powder coat them. Costs a little but saves having to deal with possible problems later. The quality of the shop doing the work is what is important. DO YOUR HOMEWORK

 

[/I]"As for media blasting all I could find are businesses in Minneapolis."

I heard there is a guy in Owattona who media blasts.

 

First,you need to use the right terminology to get the right results: You would NEVER acid dip a body unless you were a drag racer looking to lighten a steel body. Acid attacks and eats away metal, thinning the body, NOT what you want to happen. Chemical (or dip tank) stripping uses a liquified alkaline (opposite of a acid!) or chlorinated solvent, basically the same chemicals that are in paint stripper you can buy at the hardware store, to attack and dissolve paint. Depending on the strength and type bath that is used and the type/age/thickness of the paint, chemical stripping may require several trips to the tank with pressure washing after each dip to blow away most or all the softened paint. Environmental restrictions for getting rid of the waste has made chemical dipping an expensive process or put a lot of people out of the business entirely. Note that the chemicals attack the paint only, it does not remove rust. The chemicals are not easily or effectively neutralized in seams or evacuated from pockets and inside panels and can/will leach out and attack your new paint job down the road. Except for industrial work, dipping has gone the way of the dinosaur as far as restorers/body men are concerned. If you watch the auto/truck makeover shows no one sends a body out for dipping they all use media blasting.
Except for heavily rusted thick metal (like a frame) "sand" blasting is not used for paint removal. Sand (silica) like found at the beach or your local building supply is a hard sharp, heavy abrasive that requires a lot of pressure to use. That pressure causes the particles to fracture and embed themselves into the softer sheet metal and beat on the metal. The beating and heat generated work hardens the steel and the embeded sand makes the sheet metal effectively into steel backed sandpaper. This makes working and finishing the metal difficult. Save blasting with sand for etching tombstones and cleaning bridges. WARNING! silica dust is more carcenogenic than asbestos, and it doesn't require breathing very much to develop silicosis a serious debilitating/fatal lung desease. Yes, play sand is cheap, but hospitalization is not, and death is forever.
Media blasting (missnamed "sand blasting") uses various materials to abrade away softer materials like paint without attacking the harder surfaces underneath. There are a lot of media to choose from slag, glass beads, different grades/hardnesses of abrasive containing plastic, as well as natural organics like crushed walnut shells and chemicals like baking soda. Each has a place where it is preferable, but today most car body blasters use walnut shell and/or soda for general paint removal followed by spot blasting with a more agressive media for rust removal. Walnut shell is very environmentally friendly and the residue can be blown or vacuumed away. It will not damage glass or rubber, but may not completely remove old hard body fillers. Baking soda is also very enviromently friendly, water soluable so it can be vacuumed or washed away with plain water, and is a mild metal protectant. It will not harm glass, rubber and even some plastics if accidently hit. It will not remove most body fillers.
If you have a lot of paint to remove I'd suggest walnut shell blasting with spot blasting with slag or plastic media for rust removal. If the paint is thin and rust is minimal I'd suggest soda blasting.
I'd look in the phone book or ask around at a local car show for what shops do high end customizing/restoration work. Pay them a visit and when they aren't too busy inquire as to where they go for an experienced media blaster. I always go in person and wait for the right opportunity to ask such questions rather than calling on the phone. Same for the blaster, visit his place a see what kind of facilities he has and examples of the work he does. A good blaster is like a good painter, he is proud to show off his work.

 

I used a wire brush on an angle grinder when I did my car, lol but I'm frugal. Works pretty fast, if it can get into the angles on a '67 Mustang, it can on a truck, be sure to wear thick jeans, a face mask, and a coat and gloves, when those wires start to break they like to go everywhere, lol. Aircraft stripper also works wonders if it's not cold outside.

With the wire wheel I was able to strip the whole car, including the insides, in a couple of 6 hour days (couple layers of paint plus 1/2" body filler in a few places). Costs about $40, you'll need a couple of wheels.

Just a couple more options.

 

I have said it many times before, please do NOT use a wire wheel on ANYTHING for ANYTHING!!!! My brother is blind in one eye thanks to a wire wheel. There are MUCH SAFER alternatives.
For removing rust, paint and body filler without removing metal: use a Clean and Strip wheel. They are available at your local big box DIY store in the tool dept right next to the wire wheels. They look like compressed dark grey plastic "steel wool" and are made by 3M and Norton. They work very fast (faster than a wire wheel) and last very well.
For getting into tight areas and around protrusions not accessable to the C&S wheel use one of the "plastic bristle" cup brushes available at ACE hardware and possibly Harbor Freight stores. They have stiff scrub brush like bristles and come in 3 grades/colors, I find the orange to work the best. Again they work better, last longer and are much safer than a wire cup wheel.
Stephen67, try these, and you'll throw away your wire wheels, believe me!

 

He did say he had a face mask on....I had the fenders of my truck media blasted by a guy who does a lot of sheetmetal. they came back looking great and rust free, I went over them with some 220 grit on a DA then epoxy primer

 

Yes, but so did my brother. He took it off, then checked his progress before quitting and saw a spot that just "needed a touch". The shield was not right at hand, but the grinder was. You know the rest. There are much safer alternatives that's all.