Testing
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Testing
Hey all -
I'm having the head gaskets done under extended warranty (with arps) and and the same time I thought it might be best to do the oil cooler/egr thing due to the Insight showing a 23* delta between EOT and ECT and the engine is apart anyway. EW does not pay for the oil cooler/egr but it would cost less to do it now rather than wait for a disaster that's not covered.
Bear in mind that I spoke only with the SW at the dealership and not the tech (yet). The SW told me that the oil cooler and the egr were good. He told me that they test the oil cooler by a temperature test. Is this the standard test or do they measure coolant flow through the cooler ?
If the egr and oil cooler are good by standard tests then why the 23* difference
I'm having the head gaskets done under extended warranty (with arps) and and the same time I thought it might be best to do the oil cooler/egr thing due to the Insight showing a 23* delta between EOT and ECT and the engine is apart anyway. EW does not pay for the oil cooler/egr but it would cost less to do it now rather than wait for a disaster that's not covered.
Bear in mind that I spoke only with the SW at the dealership and not the tech (yet). The SW told me that the oil cooler and the egr were good. He told me that they test the oil cooler by a temperature test. Is this the standard test or do they measure coolant flow through the cooler ?
If the egr and oil cooler are good by standard tests then why the 23* difference
Tuned
Joined: Oct 2009
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Assuming the insite is showing 23*diff cruising without large loads,you should insist on farthur discussion and/or testing before they start. What caught my eye is your desire to delete EGR. That is probly why the SW said EW will not pay. For that matter I doupt the dealer will delete anything related to smog equipment,it is not legal to do so wherther you pay for it or not. I aggree both coolers should be addressed. Unless you and the shop start seeing things harmoniusly,I suggest you do or watch them do a thorough coolant flush "BEFORE" teardown(see tech folder)so you know without dought it was done correctly. Quick flush after reassembly and refill with Ford Gold under warranty and distelled water which should be warranty but most think shops use tap water sometimes so buy the water if nessary. Order the coolant filter now so you can install it the day you get the truck back. Your question was what else to do in the process. Replace t-stat and upgrade snap-to-connect oil pump fitting.
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Went to the dealership this afternoon and saw the engine already torn down for the head gaskets so flush is now a moot point. I'm going to insist that they do the oil cooler anyway since they're into the engine already and I'm aware that the oil cooler replacement is my dime. If the EGR failed it still would not be covered under the EW nor would any other parts damaged by the the failure of the EGR. This truck was new to me at 71k miles and there is no sign that a coolant filter was ever installed. I installed one about a month ago at about 80k but I fear the damage has been done. I guess my question is what is the the proper testing tecnique for determing if the oil cooler needs replacement ?
Tuned
Joined: Oct 2009
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BTW there is a new thread here discussing wherether the coolers are covered under extended warranty,have a look.
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Is this on the truck or on the bench ? If the oil cooler is good as per standard testing methods whatever they may be, then what is the cause of the almost 25* delta ?
Post Fiend
Joined: Oct 2009
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From: N. Fort Worth, tx
I would say the cause is pluged oil cooler. now you can get a slight spread when comming to a stop but it shouldnt last to long. but if you are rolling at 25* its time.
if they dont want to do it when its apart have the advisor go on a road test with you before you take delivery of it and some them its broke so they can do more work.
take a copy of 09-08-03 with you and highlight the oil cooler section were it talks about the spread. then once he/she says yes that 25* hand them the paper.
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Thanx Cheezit !
This is what I had thought and the SW tried to talk me out of it by saying the cooler was good. I insisted that it be done (and it will be) anyway because of the 23-25* delta, which by the way I wouldn't have known about if it hadn't been for a poster on RV.net who led me here. Also having the fuel pressure return line spring replaced and the STC connector checked and replaced if not the current version.
This is what I had thought and the SW tried to talk me out of it by saying the cooler was good. I insisted that it be done (and it will be) anyway because of the 23-25* delta, which by the way I wouldn't have known about if it hadn't been for a poster on RV.net who led me here. Also having the fuel pressure return line spring replaced and the STC connector checked and replaced if not the current version.
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Yeah, I know it's on my dime but cheaper now then the potential consequences
They're doing is tomorrow while the guts are out. Basically I'm using insurance money for the teardown amd rebuild costs. That price you quoted is aabout what they're charging.
Also requested the old oil cooler back and I'm gonna try to cut into it and see what it looks like. If it looks like I think it's gonna look, I'm gonna take that part and slap on the SW's counter.
Probably not but it sure feels good to say it
)
They're doing is tomorrow while the guts are out. Basically I'm using insurance money for the teardown amd rebuild costs. That price you quoted is aabout what they're charging.
Also requested the old oil cooler back and I'm gonna try to cut into it and see what it looks like. If it looks like I think it's gonna look, I'm gonna take that part and slap on the SW's counter.
Probably not but it sure feels good to say it
)
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From: Anchorage, Alaska
We just did an oil cooler in a Ford the other day. I was talkking to the foreman who was doing it about how the Fords are prone for going bad.
We never replace oil coolers in the Internationals. We have never replaced one for leaking. Only under warranty when they first came out in 2002. That is the only one I and the foreman can remember replacing in an International. We have a problem with the I6 engine losing oil coolers though, and they are a very similar design, just externally mounted.
Is it the confined spaces of the pickups that cause this engine to lose oil coolers due to more thermal saturation of the engine and its heat exchanging devices?
Don't get me wrong, we do EGR coolers from time to time on this engine and two of the other International engines.
We never replace oil coolers in the Internationals. We have never replaced one for leaking. Only under warranty when they first came out in 2002. That is the only one I and the foreman can remember replacing in an International. We have a problem with the I6 engine losing oil coolers though, and they are a very similar design, just externally mounted.
Is it the confined spaces of the pickups that cause this engine to lose oil coolers due to more thermal saturation of the engine and its heat exchanging devices?
Don't get me wrong, we do EGR coolers from time to time on this engine and two of the other International engines.
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From what I've been able to read both here and other sites it appears that the oil cooler plugs due to casting sand leaching out of the block and precipitates out of the coolant. In fact, I've seen pics of plugged oil coolers. A bypass coolant filter seems to remove a large amount of this debris before it clogs up the oil cooler.
Cargo Master
Joined: Mar 2007
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From: AB/BC
We just did an oil cooler in a Ford the other day. I was talkking to the foreman who was doing it about how the Fords are prone for going bad.
We never replace oil coolers in the Internationals. We have never replaced one for leaking. Only under warranty when they first came out in 2002. That is the only one I and the foreman can remember replacing in an International. We have a problem with the I6 engine losing oil coolers though, and they are a very similar design, just externally mounted.
Is it the confined spaces of the pickups that cause this engine to lose oil coolers due to more thermal saturation of the engine and its heat exchanging devices?
Don't get me wrong, we do EGR coolers from time to time on this engine and two of the other International engines.
We never replace oil coolers in the Internationals. We have never replaced one for leaking. Only under warranty when they first came out in 2002. That is the only one I and the foreman can remember replacing in an International. We have a problem with the I6 engine losing oil coolers though, and they are a very similar design, just externally mounted.
Is it the confined spaces of the pickups that cause this engine to lose oil coolers due to more thermal saturation of the engine and its heat exchanging devices?
Don't get me wrong, we do EGR coolers from time to time on this engine and two of the other International engines.
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From: Anchorage, Alaska
So this got me thinking what is the difference in ford and international.I dug up this on the VT365 http://www.midstaterv.com/index.php/...65-engine.html Coolant change at 300,000 miles(not a miss type) Factory fill is with TEXACO EXTENDED LIFE COOLANT.Hummm My trucks aren't getting motorcraft coolant again.
I thought the G05 coolant Ford uses is extended life as well. Is it 300,000 miles coolant?
There is no difference in the engine when you get down to valve covers, turbo, oil pan. Just some of the outside stuff like intake, water pump, front cover, that are different to accompany different locations of certain parts, or to adapt other parts (shrouds, heat shields, etc.)
I have never seen the "sand" in any International that I have torn down, and we never replace oil coolers for inefficiency.
Mind you these are lower horsepower engines (175 to 230), but to torque is much higher than the Ford Pickup. They are also in much larger and heavy vehicles, so I would think the trade off could be comparable.
