EBay headers – cracked
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Senior User
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 439
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From: Lubbock, Texas
EBay headers – cracked
I recently installed EBay headers about 1 month ago and now have a major exhaust leak. I noticed a small exhaust leak during a trip to <ST1
Padre Island</ST1 last week, it continued to get worse throughout the day. After arriving I put a wrench on the manifold bolts…all tight. It’s not coming from the gasket. It looks like the leak is coming from the collector (where all the pipes come together) I’ve got to get under there and find the crack. Not sure if it can be repaired while on the truck? Heck, not even sure it can be repaired at all. I still have the stock exhaust manifolds and considering putting them back on with bolts instead of studs. I didn’t notice any performance or mileage improvement with the headers, if these things already developed a crack within a month not sure this is the direction I want to go. What do you guys think?
Padre Island</ST1 last week, it continued to get worse throughout the day. After arriving I put a wrench on the manifold bolts…all tight. It’s not coming from the gasket. It looks like the leak is coming from the collector (where all the pipes come together) I’ve got to get under there and find the crack. Not sure if it can be repaired while on the truck? Heck, not even sure it can be repaired at all. I still have the stock exhaust manifolds and considering putting them back on with bolts instead of studs. I didn’t notice any performance or mileage improvement with the headers, if these things already developed a crack within a month not sure this is the direction I want to go. What do you guys think?
Elder User
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 619
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From: Steeler Country
I installed the Headman with y pipe about 1 1/2 month ago. My only complaint is the bolts from the headers to the y pipe loosened some. Just double nutted them today with some new bolts. Think the ball and socket was moving around at first, now the bolts seem to be loosening. Also went to fine thread (24) bolts. Manifolds have not moved, Summit locking bolts.
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Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 4,171
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From: SE Texas
This is exactly what I try to warn people about when they're thinking about buying short headers and especially thinwall tubing. It's the EGT's in a truck/towing application, and the short tube's inability to expand at the same rate as the rest of the header tubes. Over a short time, it will stress fracture as you've found out the heard way. Thinwall tubing headers must be engineered to expand/contract at the same rate,and be reinforced to prevent the larger mass pulling apart the smaller mass when the metal expands. Very few header manufacturers are capable of this engineering,they simply mock up tubing to clear everything in the way and fit with no though on anything more than blingy looks and a gimmicky name to make a sale.
I refuse to use any header that is not at least a "mid-length" with 18-24" primary tubes,and unless there's no other option,14 gauge tubing.
JL
I refuse to use any header that is not at least a "mid-length" with 18-24" primary tubes,and unless there's no other option,14 gauge tubing.
JL
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Senior User
Joined: Dec 2008
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From: Lubbock, Texas
JL
<O</O
The trip to Padre had the travel trailer (7,500 lbs, loaded) in tow with the truck bed loaded with two 55 gallon drums of drinking water, gasoline, generator, and more heavy items to beach camp for a week. Your concern is similar to mine…will these things hold up? My performance and mileage evaluation might not be fair because of the short time I had them installed but I didn’t notice any improvement over the stock exhaust manifolds.
<O
</OThe trip to Padre had the travel trailer (7,500 lbs, loaded) in tow with the truck bed loaded with two 55 gallon drums of drinking water, gasoline, generator, and more heavy items to beach camp for a week. Your concern is similar to mine…will these things hold up? My performance and mileage evaluation might not be fair because of the short time I had them installed but I didn’t notice any improvement over the stock exhaust manifolds.
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Joined: Jun 2008
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From: Wayyy NoCal, USA
Ohh, man... That would be so disappointing after all that work! Sorry to hear it.
I would not invest any time or effort in trying to repair these. I predict you would end up chasing new cracks every couple months.
I would not invest any time or effort in trying to repair these. I predict you would end up chasing new cracks every couple months.
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Senior User
Joined: Dec 2008
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From: Lubbock, Texas
mwsf250
It might be different if the headers showed noticeable improvements in power or mileage. However, I am not feeling/seeing any gains. I share the same concerns as you it will be a never-ending problem. I think I will go back with the stock logs. I really do not want to install the stock manifold studs. Do you think using SS bolts would be the best avenue if going back to the stock manifolds?
It might be different if the headers showed noticeable improvements in power or mileage. However, I am not feeling/seeing any gains. I share the same concerns as you it will be a never-ending problem. I think I will go back with the stock logs. I really do not want to install the stock manifold studs. Do you think using SS bolts would be the best avenue if going back to the stock manifolds?
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Joined: Oct 2004
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Might it partly be due to the header wrap? I've been doing some research on the 'net because I'm looking at headers for my truck, and what I'm finding is that header wrap increases the chances of a crack developing. Hedman specifically stated that header wrap voids their warranty.
Not trying to play the blame game here, but I was leaning toward the ebay headers and want to be absolutely sure about their durability.
Not trying to play the blame game here, but I was leaning toward the ebay headers and want to be absolutely sure about their durability.
Postmaster
Joined: Jun 2008
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From: Wayyy NoCal, USA
mwsf250
It might be different if the headers showed noticeable improvements in power or mileage. However, I am not feeling/seeing any gains. I share the same concerns as you it will be a never-ending problem. I think I will go back with the stock logs. I really do not want to install the stock manifold studs. Do you think using SS bolts would be the best avenue if going back to the stock manifolds?
It might be different if the headers showed noticeable improvements in power or mileage. However, I am not feeling/seeing any gains. I share the same concerns as you it will be a never-ending problem. I think I will go back with the stock logs. I really do not want to install the stock manifold studs. Do you think using SS bolts would be the best avenue if going back to the stock manifolds?
My personal theory on stud breakage is that fatigue from thermal cycling and stretching (due to manifold expansion) is a major but not fully understood factor.
My current experiment is to use stock studs (pulled from the 2006 3V engine I bought) but replace well before 100k miles. I live in NoCal where it is very dry and roads are never salted, and used anti-sieze during install, so replacing one at time (so as not to disturb gasket) should be doable. Unfortunately, I don't put a lot of miles on the truck, so I won't have any data for a long time!
Postmaster
Joined: Jun 2008
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From: Wayyy NoCal, USA
Might it partly be due to the header wrap? I've been doing some research on the 'net because I'm looking at headers for my truck, and what I'm finding is that header wrap increases the chances of a crack developing. Hedman specifically stated that header wrap voids their warranty.
Not trying to play the blame game here, but I was leaning toward the ebay headers and want to be absolutely sure about their durability.
Not trying to play the blame game here, but I was leaning toward the ebay headers and want to be absolutely sure about their durability.
BUT, it takes thousands of thermal cycles to cause a thermal fatigue failure in a well designed item.
In this case, we have clear data that there were not thousands of thermal cycles, which means the more likely cause was poor design or manufacturing leading to significant stresses in the part right from manufacturer. The size of the crack also supports that.
So this is a rather significant data point saying "absolutely sure" is not possible with this design and manufacturing process.
A different batch could be better.
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Senior User
Joined: Dec 2008
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From: Lubbock, Texas
<FONT face="Times New Roman">I’ve got the E-Bay header off and able to get some good pictures of the crack. I have several other angles of the crack in my album if you’re interested. I’m not sure if the header wrap contributed to the crack or simply “you get what you pay for” but only lasting 300-400 miles is unacceptable. The truck had so few miles on it after the header install…the first trip my wife took in the truck was our trip to <ST1Padre Island</ST1. That’s when she mentioned (at the first stop light before getting on the freeway) she heard a noise that sounded like a kids bike with cards in the spokes. I told her that was how the truck sounded with the new headers. Well it didn’t take but a few miles down the road and I could here it getting worse. The header must have already cracked before we started towing. <?xml:namespace prefix = st1 ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com
Padre Island</ST1. That’s when she mentioned (at the first stop light before getting on the freeway) she heard a noise that sounded like a kids bike with cards in the spokes. I told her that was how the truck sounded with the new headers. Well it didn’t take but a few miles down the road and I could here it getting worse. The header must have already cracked before we started towing. <?xml:namespace prefix = st1 ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com
Elder User
Joined: Apr 2010
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From: Steeler Country
Anyone with a bunch of miles on the ebay headers? I have not seen them in person, but the pictures never looked like a high quality piece to start with. The pipe and welds looked like a backyard job.
The Hedmans were more money, $600 through summit, but I felt they were a known company with experience. Plus the y pipe included with no welding needed, seemed to be reasonably close when all said and done.
Will find out Sunday, towing 8k and loaded with 6 inside, to the beach from Pittsburgh. Some mountains in the way. See if the extra was worth it. Already know highway empty milage went from 13 to 17. See what towing is.
The Hedmans were more money, $600 through summit, but I felt they were a known company with experience. Plus the y pipe included with no welding needed, seemed to be reasonably close when all said and done.
Will find out Sunday, towing 8k and loaded with 6 inside, to the beach from Pittsburgh. Some mountains in the way. See if the extra was worth it. Already know highway empty milage went from 13 to 17. See what towing is.