same price to boot, so you loose all around with that junk.

 

If you are worried about that then go get some diesel Kleen, just make sure it is ULSD compatable. It will help with the cetane as well.

 

Depends.

Whether the stuff is made from bacon grease, used motor oil, IFO 380, peanut oil, or rendered chicken fat.

Oh... try to ask the vendor what they really used to make biodisesel.

Come to think of it, I am sure someone out there is recovering human fat from crematoria to make this stuff....

 

The truck is stock. We have not modified it at all. We do not normally run biodiesel although I know that I have gotten B2 once or twice in the past year.

 

Did you experience injector failure after you used biodiesel?

If the answer is yes, I think we have the prime suspect.

In which case, the perps probably got off scot free.

 

Diesel Kleen cannot fix basically the misuse of the vehicle with a fuel that is incompatible.

 

Nope it cannot I agree. I was referring to what can help with the overall lubricating and cetane of fuel.

 

If he has used a fuel that is "within spec" as far as Ford is concerned, you are right on.

However, with biodiesel, there is absolutely no telling what is actually in it.

Read the first post --- everything seem to suggest that the problem occurred after the use of biodiesel.

Without a fuel sample pulled from the tank at the time of filling, there is no way to go back and figure out what it really was that was sold to him as biodiesel.

A plausible (not necessarily probable) scenario is the biodiesel was made with a detergent like emulsifier that got water past the water / fuel separator and the water barrier in the fuel filter. Without an actual fuel sample, that cannot be ruled out. That is also the kind of stuff that can cause an injector to lock or to explode.


There are very few things that can cause injectors to "explode" or "lock".

When most of the likely causes are ruled out... what have we got left?

 

I don't see that in the first post....the only mention of bio use by the op is here, in this post:

Hardly enough to condemn bio as the cause of the injector failures,, IMO.

Ford says bio is fine in concentrations up to 5% in a 6.0, so buying 2% a couple of times in the last year is certainly "within spec".

It's accurate regarding the engine's fuel system.

This chart shows that a 2% concentration of soy-based bio provides the best improvement in lubricity over other additives

 

Steve:


There are two issues here.

On the "spec sheet" case, you are completely correct.


I am talking about the reality case of what is sold as biodiesel.


There are tens of thousands of producers, with virtually no quality control, certification, testing, and huge incentives for fraud, incompetence, to plain foolishness.


Buying biodiesel puts you in the league of buying "white powder" from street corner vendors.

You never really know what is in it.

The spec sheets don't mean a thing when there is no reason to believe that is what it actually is.

Just how would you tell if something is B85, B10, or B whatever?

Do you propose to test the batch at the pump?

How do you know what oils went into the brew?

How it is processed? What it is processed with?

The reality is very different from the spec sheets.


I never let my engine near that stuff.




Let me pose the question in this way:



Would you buy "white label" CJ-4 "synthetic" motor oil off someone you don't know?

At a shop you don't know?

 

Those are all great questions for a thread in the bio/alternative fuels forum.....this poor guy's just trying to figure out what's caused his injector failures. I'm pretty sure it wasn't the 1 or 2 times he bought 2% bio in the past year.

There are many, many people here that use B2 all the time without issue, Bismic being one of them.

 

I don't have answers to why the injectors failed, but I have a lot of observations. First being, this thread has turned to crap.

You put about 50k miles on the truck in one year. Obviously mostly towing. And depending on your rear axle ratio, you were overloaded, or at least right at the max spec for the truck. Either way, all your services should have been at the severe duty level. To add to the mystery, the truck had 44k miles under the care of another owner. Do you have his service records?

Next to doing it yourself, that is your best bet. But it is far from a guarantee that the truck got all the prescribed filters and fluids. Especially if you used the quick lube lane at the dealership. I definitely don't trust them.

Excellent question. One of the first things that should be checked.

They do. Read your manual. Towing or using Bio, either one means you are considered severe duty. And I already mentioned how little confidence I have in the dealer, and that includes their advice.

Why? This is an '05 6.0. But that is all you can buy now anyway.

Bio is NOT waste vegetable oil. Don't confuse the two. A B2 blend from any major fuel station is reliable. And a B2 blend is a neglible blend. Ford allow 250% of that blend, but it still requires severe service maintenance.

I don't want to run Bio, but I do not believe a few fills of B2 will do anything bad.

If he did, I would call it coincidence. And when you run 50k miles in a year, it is just guessing to place blame on any particular load of fuel.

I can't agree with any of that. Again, this is Bio, not WVO. You won't find harmful Bio-D in any major brand.

 

The injector failures have NOT occured right after I fueled with B2 biodiesel.
Yes, we have been using the vehicle fairly hard, but it only tows 17,000# going down to FL. The trailer is empty coming back, so only weighs 4500#. According to the specs on the vehicle it is capable of hauling 18,000#. It has the 4.30 rear axle (I think that is the correct number).
The service has been done by a Ford Dealer, but we have not gone thru the quick lube lane (not sure this dealer has one). We drop it off and come pick it up later. I do wonder if they have been draining the water separator, but I did not know myself that this needed to be done. This is the first diesel that I have owned.
Has anyone put a separate water/fuel separator on their truck? Would anyone recommend one or the system by FASS or Airdog? Would that void the extended warranty?

 

I have no doubt that Bismic can use biodiesel without any problems.

I am also sure that Steve can do the same.

Bismic and you watches your fuel like a hawk, and he is very careful who he buys from and alert to the first sign of trouble.

You also keep very accurate records.

My concerns are related to the general state of bio-diesel quality control once you are outside of the "known good" sources.


We have enough trouble getting good diesel fuel ---- let alone biodiesel.

 

What's done is done, so I suppose we should concentrate on what you do now. I already mentioned what I would do with the injectors. I think they also need to check all of the fluid pressures, and the Fuel Injector Control Module (FICM). Just ask them to do a complete health check on the engine. Maybe put a couple of fresh batteries in it too. Voltage plays a part in the injector control. Unfortunately, you are going to have to pay for all this. Ford is only going to repair under warranty the components that fail. They will happily replace injectors one at a time, just doing the bare minimum to get you out of their shop. They have no respect for your lost time.

Guys here like the FASS and Airdog2. You never know for sure how that will affect a warranty, but I personally would not risk it. I think they will use it to deny anything fuel supply related. I also don't think it would solve anything for you. You could have a weak fuel pump, but an OEM replacement should work for you.