Need some advice
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Need some advice
I have a 2000 F250XLT Super Duty 7.3L Automatic Transmission Diesel with a 3.73 rear. It has a tow package and has a fifth wheel in the cargo bed. It is a crewcab with a short bed. The GVWR on the truck is 8,800lbs and the owners manual says the gcwr is 20,000. The manual says the maximum towing capacity can be determined by subrtacting the GVW (which I would assume is the weight of the truck empty and no where to be found on the door sticker) from the GCWR. 1) Can anyone give me an approximate weight on that truck and 2) What do you think a safe amount to tow on a fifth wheel is on that vehicle. Thanks for your help.
FTE Leadership Emeritus
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 7,298
Likes: 45
From: Southern California
Need some advice
GVW or GVWR is the maximum rated laden weight of the truck only. Not the empty weight. The GCWR or gross combined weight rating is the total weight of gross laden vehicle and towed load.
Math: 20,000#-8,800#=11,200# towed weight.
So it would seem that 11,200# would be the max load your truck is rated to tow at gross weight. At less than gross, I suppose the truck would be rated to tow more. Just make sure that the 20,000 GCWR is what is listed for a truck with your axle ratio, engine, transmission and wheelbase.
To find the tare, or empty weight of your truck, check your vehicle registration. Or take it to a public scale.
Sounds like a pretty nice truck!
Scott
Math: 20,000#-8,800#=11,200# towed weight.
So it would seem that 11,200# would be the max load your truck is rated to tow at gross weight. At less than gross, I suppose the truck would be rated to tow more. Just make sure that the 20,000 GCWR is what is listed for a truck with your axle ratio, engine, transmission and wheelbase.
To find the tare, or empty weight of your truck, check your vehicle registration. Or take it to a public scale.
Sounds like a pretty nice truck!
Scott
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Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 4,334
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From: Mills River
Need some advice
[font size="1" color="#FF0000"]LAST EDITED ON 12-Jun-01 AT 01:47 PM (EST)[/font][p]docolena,
Your truck weighs about 6,600 lbs empty (a 4X2 with a full tank but without passengers, aftermarket accessories or cargo; add another 300 lbs if a 4X4), the GVWR is 8,800 lbs, and the GCWR is 20,000 lbs. The fifth-wheel trailer towing limits for the "big" F250 SD is usually limited by the GVWR rather than the GCWR.
Let's take your 250 and add some people (4 @ 150 lbs each), some accessories and cargo (~400 lbs), and the truck now weighs 7,600 lbs (6,600 + 600 + 400). With a 8,800 lb GVWR, that leaves 1,200 lbs for the trailer's pin weight (this part of the trailer's total weight becomes carried weight in the truck).
The rule of thumb for fifth-wheel pin weight is that it should be 15~25% of the loaded trailer's total weight. If we pick 20%, that means the loaded trailer can weigh up to 6,000 lbs (1,200 / 20%). This probably means a trailer that's about 5,000 lbs empty.
To wrap this up, the loaded truck (7,600 lbs) plus the loaded trailer (6,000 lbs) result in a total weight of 13,600 lbs -- far below the 20,000 lb GCWR advertised by Ford. However, since Ford says to never exceed either the GCWR or the GCWR, this example shows the 250's GVWR is the limiting factor.
This problem is common with the "big" 250 Super Duty trucks. All 250 SD's, regardless of configuration, have a GVWR of 8,800 lbs, and the additional weight of the heavy options (i.e. diesel, crew cab, XLT/Lariat package and/or 4X4) really cuts into the available payload.
It's something of an irony, but, due to the GVWR limitaions of the 250, the "big" models have reduced cargo capacity and fifth-wheel tow ratings.
Although my numbers are good estimates (my gasser 250 XLT CC 4X2 weighs 6,000 lbs), your actual weights may differ a bit. You may wish to weigh your truck, factor in the actual weights of accssories, people and their "stuff", and then run the calculations again to find the answer to your situation.
BTW, it's a different story for tag-trailers. The rule of thumb for the tongue-weight is 10%, which would suggest a 12,000 lb trailer in this case (1,200 / 10%). This combination (7,600 + 12,000 = 19,600) gets closer to Ford's 20K GCWR.
You're to be commended on "looking before you leap".
Hope this helps,
crewzer
Your truck weighs about 6,600 lbs empty (a 4X2 with a full tank but without passengers, aftermarket accessories or cargo; add another 300 lbs if a 4X4), the GVWR is 8,800 lbs, and the GCWR is 20,000 lbs. The fifth-wheel trailer towing limits for the "big" F250 SD is usually limited by the GVWR rather than the GCWR.
Let's take your 250 and add some people (4 @ 150 lbs each), some accessories and cargo (~400 lbs), and the truck now weighs 7,600 lbs (6,600 + 600 + 400). With a 8,800 lb GVWR, that leaves 1,200 lbs for the trailer's pin weight (this part of the trailer's total weight becomes carried weight in the truck).
The rule of thumb for fifth-wheel pin weight is that it should be 15~25% of the loaded trailer's total weight. If we pick 20%, that means the loaded trailer can weigh up to 6,000 lbs (1,200 / 20%). This probably means a trailer that's about 5,000 lbs empty.
To wrap this up, the loaded truck (7,600 lbs) plus the loaded trailer (6,000 lbs) result in a total weight of 13,600 lbs -- far below the 20,000 lb GCWR advertised by Ford. However, since Ford says to never exceed either the GCWR or the GCWR, this example shows the 250's GVWR is the limiting factor.
This problem is common with the "big" 250 Super Duty trucks. All 250 SD's, regardless of configuration, have a GVWR of 8,800 lbs, and the additional weight of the heavy options (i.e. diesel, crew cab, XLT/Lariat package and/or 4X4) really cuts into the available payload.
It's something of an irony, but, due to the GVWR limitaions of the 250, the "big" models have reduced cargo capacity and fifth-wheel tow ratings.
Although my numbers are good estimates (my gasser 250 XLT CC 4X2 weighs 6,000 lbs), your actual weights may differ a bit. You may wish to weigh your truck, factor in the actual weights of accssories, people and their "stuff", and then run the calculations again to find the answer to your situation.
BTW, it's a different story for tag-trailers. The rule of thumb for the tongue-weight is 10%, which would suggest a 12,000 lb trailer in this case (1,200 / 10%). This combination (7,600 + 12,000 = 19,600) gets closer to Ford's 20K GCWR.
You're to be commended on "looking before you leap".
Hope this helps,
crewzer
FTE Leadership Emeritus
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 7,298
Likes: 45
From: Southern California
Need some advice
crewzer,
Good job explaining GVWR and GCWR.
My fuzzy math did not take into account the pin weight from a 5th wheel. Thanks for taking the time to explain everything fully.
Although we may never hear from docolena again, your shared wisdom was not wasted on me. Thanks.
Hey, maybe I'd have a good future selling huge 5th wheels to people with F-150's! Naaa, I'd have to move too often! LOL!
Scott
Good job explaining GVWR and GCWR.
My fuzzy math did not take into account the pin weight from a 5th wheel. Thanks for taking the time to explain everything fully.
Although we may never hear from docolena again, your shared wisdom was not wasted on me. Thanks.
Hey, maybe I'd have a good future selling huge 5th wheels to people with F-150's! Naaa, I'd have to move too often! LOL!
Scott
