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So, where do they go from here for diesel engines?

 

Old news. Ford will be building their own diesel motors. See the 6.7L diesel forum just below this one.

 

I guess this is what is commonly referred to as "The point of no return". Probably a good break-up. I just hope that Ford has learned enough over the years with the bad experiences of the 6.0 to start the 6.7 off on the right foot. With all the diesels they build and sell overseas, you'd think they'd have technology on their side and the knowledge and engineering to make them somewhat bulletproof / reliable. I'm trying to decide now whether to get a 6.4 or wait for the 6.7. I guess it's a real crapshoot. I will say though, that I haven't heard nearly the horror stories with the 6.4. My 6.0 has been fantastic and I haven't had any of the problems others are reporting.

 

ford knows how to build a damn good diesel engine. the problem is the American public does not want a good dependable engine, they want one that produces 1000 hp that can fit in a pickup.

the ford 6.0 had alot of problems when they were new.
the international VT365 did not.
why?? because ford owners wanted horse power.
international designed the engine and computer program to work.
the ford program put the engine on the edge of its limits.
then the ever smart consumer put a custom program into the computer, taking it over the edge, and it broke.
so it was internationals fault for designing an engine and computer program that would not support what the end user wanted it to do.

 

There is a problem with that. When they contracted with Ford to do Ford's engine, they were designing an engine for Ford's end customer in mind. They should have done their research in that regard. You don't build something and say, I built this and your just going to have to buy it because I built it(this is actually the mentality of the farmer, which we know where that gets them), so either lump it or buy it.

Now I'm not saying the end customer is correct in wanting all that hp/tq or not, but Navistar should have realized it was a different ballgame going into partnership with Ford then when they did their own engines for their own vehicles. I'm willing to bet Navistar clientele is a niche one(very small percentage of the population, hell I didn't know squat about them tell I joined this site) and you really can't design your stuff for a niche market portion unless you stay with that niche market and sell only to that niche market.

Well I'm not negating the Ford's customers blame in this, Navistar when into this with their eyes closed or they just didn't care to build an engine that their customer's wanted(when they started building for Ford, Ford's customers became their customers too) and build one that they were going to build and the public just had to either buy it or lump it.

 

I agree with you generally. I'll just say though, that it wasn't just the Ford customer that wanted higher hp / tq. It was also Ford that wanted bragging rights in the midst of a now continuing hp / tq war among the manufacturers. Kind of like the trailer tow ratings. While there's no doubt that Ford has the field trumped when it come to towing, I think that when the new SAE tow ratings are applied across the board to all manufacturers, things will be a little more even than they are now.

 

Let us hope so. We'll be finding out soon enough.

I don't believe for a second that Ford designed a program without involvement and approval from Navistar. They screwed it up together.

Exactly right. We got used to easily cranking up the output from the 7.3 with a tuner, and it didn't break, and we figured we could do the same with the 6.0. But unlike the 7.3, the 6.0 was near it's limit from the factory. Those who did that got what they deserved. But those who never added a tuner, and still blew the HG, got the shaft.

 

The International VT365 also had plenty of issues, its a myth that the engine only had issues in Ford applications.

 

Now that this news is public; maybe Ford will see fit to start releasing some info on the 6.7 and the 4.4 diesels.

I visit those forums every so often. But I don't think anyone there really knows anything yet. Everyone just seems to be repeating rumors and adding to the rumors.

 

Welcome to the wonderful world of the 'Net.

 

I agree about the rumors. Only thing I know for sure is that the 2010 order guides only show the 6.4 and the two gassers. No mention of the 6.2 gas or the 6.7 diesel. Like was said in the article, the contract with Navistar will end 12/31/09. Looks like the 6.7 might make it in early 2010 as an early 2011 model. Again, that part is speculation but the order guide does show the 6.4 as the diesel for 2010.

It would be kind of interesting though, if they did like in 2003 and offered the 6.4 in the early 2010 models and the 6.7 toward the end of the model year.

 

may run the 6.4 till it is out of stock and then switch towards the end of the year. I would think it would depend on inventory levels. Then again they maybe just building per order?

 

I wonder if the size of the 6.7 will allow it to fit in E-350 cutaways. As I understand it the 6.4 doesn't fit in a E350. Ford has lost a lot of ambulance business to the Bowtie and to Navistar as I understand things.

When you consider for the most part almost every ambulance on the road is a Ford this is big if they can't get this done going forward.

 

I'm an Indianapolis resident and when I read the article in the Indy Star I could only think "sucks for the home team." One of the things I really like about my Super Duty is that the motor is built in my current home town and the truck was assembled in Louisville, where I grew up. Its as homegrown as I can get.