Strange overheating problem
Strange overheating problem
I have a 90 E350 that I have had for about 2 years, it has at least 200k, probably 300K miles on it. It was a Navy van originally.
Anyway, I have always had a problem with overheating, most of it has been fixed by replacing the thermostat, water pump, and fan clutch.
Now, it only happens when I have electrical drain, ie headlights and heater fan or 12v battery charger for 18v tools, etc.
So here's the question: Do alternators go bad slowly? Are they harder to turn if going bad and under load? I know they are harder to turn under load, but should it be so hard that I overheat? The engine does not like to be pushed. I have a 3 speed AT and can't go over 60 w/o starting to heat up.
Pulling my boat seems ok though..?? I also have chronic low oil pressure, but changing the oil pump requires raising the motor and I don't want to deal w/ that.
Also have a vacuum leak that I can't locate, or at least the symptons are of a vacuum leak.
Anyway, blah, blah, I could go on and on.
Any comments are appreciated.
Thanks.
Anyway, I have always had a problem with overheating, most of it has been fixed by replacing the thermostat, water pump, and fan clutch.
Now, it only happens when I have electrical drain, ie headlights and heater fan or 12v battery charger for 18v tools, etc.
So here's the question: Do alternators go bad slowly? Are they harder to turn if going bad and under load? I know they are harder to turn under load, but should it be so hard that I overheat? The engine does not like to be pushed. I have a 3 speed AT and can't go over 60 w/o starting to heat up.
Pulling my boat seems ok though..?? I also have chronic low oil pressure, but changing the oil pump requires raising the motor and I don't want to deal w/ that.
Also have a vacuum leak that I can't locate, or at least the symptons are of a vacuum leak.
Anyway, blah, blah, I could go on and on.
Any comments are appreciated.
Thanks.
Yeah, I have to add coolant regularly. There is no overflow tank.
Just to clarify though, it doesn't overheat to the point of boiling or anything, it just runs hot and burns off some coolant.
I have been planning on adding one of those aftermarket overflow tanks but I don't know if it will do any good so I just havn't done it yet.
Also, this motor is old, the vacuum lines, wires, hoses, everything, are in bad shape, but this is a work truck that I bought for $1000 almost 2 years ago. I'm not looking to make a drag racer out of it, I just want to make it reliable.
Changing the water pump was a nightmare job for me, that is about as much as I want to do. While doing that, I had to remove the alternator, but after getting it unbolted it would not come out of the vehicle, it just plain doesn't fit thriugh space available. Maybe if I remove the fins I could get it out.
And I have tried to find the vacuum the leak and can't..but there are hoses/fittings that are just plugged/capped. Hell, the smog pump has been removed, bypassed, and hoses plugged.
Just to clarify though, it doesn't overheat to the point of boiling or anything, it just runs hot and burns off some coolant.
I have been planning on adding one of those aftermarket overflow tanks but I don't know if it will do any good so I just havn't done it yet.
Also, this motor is old, the vacuum lines, wires, hoses, everything, are in bad shape, but this is a work truck that I bought for $1000 almost 2 years ago. I'm not looking to make a drag racer out of it, I just want to make it reliable.
Changing the water pump was a nightmare job for me, that is about as much as I want to do. While doing that, I had to remove the alternator, but after getting it unbolted it would not come out of the vehicle, it just plain doesn't fit thriugh space available. Maybe if I remove the fins I could get it out.
And I have tried to find the vacuum the leak and can't..but there are hoses/fittings that are just plugged/capped. Hell, the smog pump has been removed, bypassed, and hoses plugged.
I just thought of something else that is very relevent...
There is a sticker in the enigine compartment that says something like 'This vehicle is equipped with a secondary electric fan that may run while the engine is off..', well, there ain't no secondary fan anywhere.
There is a big empty space on the driver's side of the engine compartment w/ no less than 4 unconnected plugs hangin' there, but that's it.
There is a sticker in the enigine compartment that says something like 'This vehicle is equipped with a secondary electric fan that may run while the engine is off..', well, there ain't no secondary fan anywhere.
There is a big empty space on the driver's side of the engine compartment w/ no less than 4 unconnected plugs hangin' there, but that's it.
Just because there is a plug doesn't mean it should be plugged into something, there may be optional equipment that I don't have.
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"Also, this motor is old, the vacuum lines, wires, hoses, everything, are in bad shape,..." and "And I have tried to find the vacuum the leak and can't..but there are hoses/fittings that are just plugged/capped. Hell, the smog pump has been removed, bypassed, and hoses plugged."
I rest my case.
I rest my case.
Ok, your opinion has been noted.
If anyone has anything helpful to say, it would be appreciated. Or is this forum only for people who are restoring vehicles and motors to new or better condition?
This is a work truck.
If anyone has anything helpful to say, it would be appreciated. Or is this forum only for people who are restoring vehicles and motors to new or better condition?
This is a work truck.
I have a 90 E350 that I have had for about 2 years, it has at least 200k, probably 300K miles on it. It was a Navy van originally.
Anyway, I have always had a problem with overheating, most of it has been fixed by replacing the thermostat, water pump, and fan clutch.
Now, it only happens when I have electrical drain, ie headlights and heater fan or 12v battery charger for 18v tools, etc.
So here's the question: Do alternators go bad slowly? Are they harder to turn if going bad and under load? I know they are harder to turn under load, but should it be so hard that I overheat? The engine does not like to be pushed.
-------
When my alternators went bad, they became so hard to turn that they made the belt squeal all the time & you couldn't touch them after just a couple min. running. It did not effect engine temp.
-------
I have a 3 speed AT and can't go over 60 w/o starting to heat up.
Pulling my boat seems ok though..?? I also have chronic low oil pressure, but changing the oil pump requires raising the motor and I don't want to deal w/ that.
-----
Low oil pressure--as per the stock gauge? Or a real gauge? If stock, get a real one and hook it up to the sender port and get a reading. We have them at work that barely make the needle move on the stocker, yet the run with 30 psi when checked with a real gauge.
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Also have a vacuum leak that I can't locate, or at least the symptons are of a vacuum leak.
------
Using WD 40 or Carb cleaner, spray around the manifold and any place you suspect. A change in idle represents 'Bingo'. If someone did a hack job on the egr or the evap system, that could be the issue & a place to check.
-------
Anyway, blah, blah, I could go on and on.
Any comments are appreciated.
Thanks.
Anyway, I have always had a problem with overheating, most of it has been fixed by replacing the thermostat, water pump, and fan clutch.
Now, it only happens when I have electrical drain, ie headlights and heater fan or 12v battery charger for 18v tools, etc.
So here's the question: Do alternators go bad slowly? Are they harder to turn if going bad and under load? I know they are harder to turn under load, but should it be so hard that I overheat? The engine does not like to be pushed.
-------
When my alternators went bad, they became so hard to turn that they made the belt squeal all the time & you couldn't touch them after just a couple min. running. It did not effect engine temp.
-------
I have a 3 speed AT and can't go over 60 w/o starting to heat up.
Pulling my boat seems ok though..?? I also have chronic low oil pressure, but changing the oil pump requires raising the motor and I don't want to deal w/ that.
-----
Low oil pressure--as per the stock gauge? Or a real gauge? If stock, get a real one and hook it up to the sender port and get a reading. We have them at work that barely make the needle move on the stocker, yet the run with 30 psi when checked with a real gauge.
------
Also have a vacuum leak that I can't locate, or at least the symptons are of a vacuum leak.
------
Using WD 40 or Carb cleaner, spray around the manifold and any place you suspect. A change in idle represents 'Bingo'. If someone did a hack job on the egr or the evap system, that could be the issue & a place to check.
-------
Anyway, blah, blah, I could go on and on.
Any comments are appreciated.
Thanks.
Also, regarding the electric fan and loss of coolant. Is there an obvious place, bracketry, other evidence of the electric fan? And where is the coolant going? Puking out the overflow? Or just disappearing? If it's going out the overflow, get a recovery tank set up. $20 at your favorite parts store. If it's just disappearing, pull you plugs a little while after shutdown and look for water. A leak in a head gasket can super heat the coolant when running, especially under higher loads (which cause higer cylinder pressure), and then allow the still pressurized coolant to leak into the combustion chamber after shutdown. You usually get a white cloud on start up with this one.
Last edited by 85e150; Jan 9, 2009 at 11:36 PM. Reason: I still can't use italics.....
Thanks
The coolant is just going out the overflow, I have seen, and will get the overflow tank. I don't get any visible smoke ever.
No, there is no obvious place where something is missing, but I have no idea where the fan would be.
The coolant is just going out the overflow, I have seen, and will get the overflow tank. I don't get any visible smoke ever.
No, there is no obvious place where something is missing, but I have no idea where the fan would be.
1---Alternators do go bad and still work--The alternator is basically a 3 phase ac generator, each phase being changed to dc by two diodes (for a total of 6 in a heat sink) it will still charge with one phase out ( bad or shorted diode/s ) but will barely keep up with the demands. It will however not load down the engine any more than usual.
2. Vacuum leak-====== Lean engine ====heat.
3. No recovery tank. The recovery tank is just more than an over flow tank. When you top off a radiator and start the engine, the liquid expands and has to go some where. Either to the tank or on the ground. What happens when the liquid in the cooling system cools off???? If here is no recovery tank. When the coolant cools off there is a vacuum created in the cooling system by the coolant shrinking in volume and outside air is drawn into the system via the radiator cap. This air will be mixed with the coolant the next time you start the engine and now you have a mixture of air and coolant which is a bad heat conductor. With the recovery tank, when the engine cools and the coolant volume shrinks the vacuum created will draw in coolant from the tank via the overflow line connected to the tank.
4. advanced ignition timing = heat
5. Sorry --but It sounds like this truck need a lot of work that you don't want to do. And are looking for a quick fix. There is no magic wand and a fairy god mother to wave it.
6. The electric fan would have been attached to the radiator. most likely across the front of the radiator so it could blow through it. Sounds like someone else had an overheating problem also.
7. That engine would have had a radiator shroud between the engine and the radiator. The shroud would fit the diameter of the fan on one side and the radiator on the other. It acts like a funnel so all the air drawn by the fan would come through the radiator. If the shroud is missing the engine is most likely going to overheat!!!
2. Vacuum leak-====== Lean engine ====heat.
3. No recovery tank. The recovery tank is just more than an over flow tank. When you top off a radiator and start the engine, the liquid expands and has to go some where. Either to the tank or on the ground. What happens when the liquid in the cooling system cools off???? If here is no recovery tank. When the coolant cools off there is a vacuum created in the cooling system by the coolant shrinking in volume and outside air is drawn into the system via the radiator cap. This air will be mixed with the coolant the next time you start the engine and now you have a mixture of air and coolant which is a bad heat conductor. With the recovery tank, when the engine cools and the coolant volume shrinks the vacuum created will draw in coolant from the tank via the overflow line connected to the tank.
4. advanced ignition timing = heat
5. Sorry --but It sounds like this truck need a lot of work that you don't want to do. And are looking for a quick fix. There is no magic wand and a fairy god mother to wave it.
6. The electric fan would have been attached to the radiator. most likely across the front of the radiator so it could blow through it. Sounds like someone else had an overheating problem also.
7. That engine would have had a radiator shroud between the engine and the radiator. The shroud would fit the diameter of the fan on one side and the radiator on the other. It acts like a funnel so all the air drawn by the fan would come through the radiator. If the shroud is missing the engine is most likely going to overheat!!!
Point 2 & 4: I will continue to try and a find the leak. It is however only suspected based mostly on rought idle and hesitation. Could that also be timing? I will check the timing.
Point 3: It does not appear that a tank is missing. The overflow line is neatly attached down the side of the radiator. I will still add a tank, but did it most likely have one originally?
Point 5: Yes, it does need a lot of work. I will do what I can, when I can, but I still want to try and solve the immediate problems w/o doing more than necessary. I have a busy life and my trade is residential construction, so things are tight right now.
Point 6 & 7: The shroud is in place. I just changed the fan clutch and I don't see how anything could fit in there anywhere.
Thanks
Point 3: It does not appear that a tank is missing. The overflow line is neatly attached down the side of the radiator. I will still add a tank, but did it most likely have one originally?
Point 5: Yes, it does need a lot of work. I will do what I can, when I can, but I still want to try and solve the immediate problems w/o doing more than necessary. I have a busy life and my trade is residential construction, so things are tight right now.
Point 6 & 7: The shroud is in place. I just changed the fan clutch and I don't see how anything could fit in there anywhere.
Thanks










