This ain't politics but FACTS that deal with a company called Ford whom produces the F-150. I wonder how many F-150 sales NEVER happened because companies like Exxon made $14.83B in a single quarter gouging our wallets? And who was behind this $147 oil? If you have to ask that question you have no clue as to the corruption in our financial/corporate world. If you have an IRA/401(K) look at it and tell me who’s speaking truths. And then look at F-150 sales and its' respective production cuts.

 

And exactly what is your point................................

 

yeah, what is your point...

"What we're paying for at the pump is basically two or three kinds of things, i.e. taxes, the leftist refusal to allow us to drill for oil or build refineries over the last 40 years, and the world price of oil which is driven somewhat by speculation and also by the rising economies of places like China and India."

i don't like the prices either so we can do a few things about it: we can start voicing our opinion about our countries ability to look for and drill for oil, start developing new technology. The bad part is it doesn't matter what we do for the most part because as long as China, and India keep importing more and more oil the demand keeps rising and there-for the price climbs.

It's nice right now because the price has fallen as the global economy goes into a slow down but once the markets start to turn around the price will go right back up again.

 

It'd be nice if oil stayed around $100-$120. For about a year, let things get settled in at that and all would be good. The cost of diesel has dropped $.15 a liter where I am even though oil has dropped around 50% in cost.

 

The markets plunging has been due to the credit meltdown over the past year, not due to Exxon and other American oil companies who accounted for a minority of the oil used in this country. If anything, the energy funds in my portfolio have helped hedge against losses elsewhere. Exxon produced only about 3% of the world's oil last year, and they hardly have control of the market.

Speculators flocked to oil futures as the credit meltdown started to occur, just as they often go to other commodities such as gold and silver when the value of the dollar is at risk. Its natural market cycles that the money will flock to presumed safe havens. I noted on these forums when the speculation was driving up prices that just as with every other speculative boom in history that it would eventually collapse, and it did. It's gone down by half in less than two months, plunging faster than it ever went up, just as with all other false booms going back hundreds of years (read up on the Dutch tulip speculation history if you want an example of how far back this sort of market correction goes). Unfortunately, as with practically every other false boom people forget history and somehow think things are different this time around.

Additionally, a major component of oil prices going up is the plunging value of the dollar. This results in more dollars having to be exchanged to foreign currency to purchase the same amount of oil. The oil companies can't be blamed for this... the collapse of the dollar is directly related to the credit market, and the loss of confidence because the government couldn't hold it up if it wanted to, despite what is said by politicians about bailouts ($750 billion is a drop in the bucket, the mortgage market is several tens of trillions of dollars).

Now consider if Ford and GM were to come up with technology which tripled fuel economy. They control a larger US market share than Exxon does. They would see a huge boom, and oil companies would see a loss. If a credit meltdown happened at the same time I wonder how many people would blame Ford and GM? Hardly anyone, because people love to hate oil companies except when they are losing tons of money like they did in the 1980s.

In every market change there winners and losers. This happens in both bear and bull markets. Mortgage prices climbing due to years of speculative loans meant many people were priced out of the market... the losers during a "boom." Now, prices have plunged and people with good credit have real bargain opportunities available... the losers are now the winners. The boom winners who were speculators (people who should have never qualified for a mortgage in the first place) are now the losers, as they are made to actually pay for their bad decisions. If you have a good, stable job a recession can be a good thing. Bargains galore become available from retailers as they slash prices to keep up market share. Weak companies fold... the losers. Strong companies increase share and become stronger... the winners. If you talk to some economists they say that recessions are often the best time to start a business because a crisis brings new opportunities to the table.

Stocks are down... a bad thing? Well, only if you live for today. In the past 30 years there have been 7 downturns in the market and every time the market recovers and grows bigger. Some people thought the market collapse after the dot com burst was the end of the world... the market recovered. It will again. Right now is the best time to put money into the market. Many shares are under valued and will represent huge returns if you get in before they go back up (and they will go back up). Has my retirement portfolio been hit? You betcha! Does it bother me? Yes, I'd hardly be human if it didn't. Have I pulled out of the markets because I'm scared or because it bothers me? No. Fear and pulling out when its low is how you lose money over the long haul. Unfortunately people make the same mistake time and time again... they buy high (throwing tons of money at the market when its high) and sell low (bailing out when its low). Have a retirement plan for the long haul and stick to it. If someone tells you something like "well, my 401K went down 30% and I was going to retire in 3 years so I'm screwed." Well, they didn't have a good plan... if you're that close to retirement the bulk of your 401K should not be in stocks --- retirement portfolios should be rebalanced as you get closer to retirement in order to lower risk as time horizons shrink.

 

Very well put. What I rarely see mentioned, is the fact that Government, via taxes, makes more money per each gallon of fuel sold than the oil companies. THAT, boggles my mind; how the perception that these companies are so greedy...

 

Exactly! Heck, I made money in coal stocks during this boom. I figured that other energy stocks would go up in addition to oil futures, but due to them not being oil they wouldn't collapse fast. 30% gain before I got out. Does that make me greedy, or just good and lucky timing. I don't do much in individual stocks, less than 1%, because timing markets is damn near impossible - instead focusing on index and sector funds for the long haul because I know a steady retirement portfolio is not about short term gain and timing stocks/markets, but instead relying on the historical long term climb of most markets over time. I have more concern about tax changes impacting my eventual retirement than I do market changes/corrections, but I won't go into details (it would stray into politics).

 

FTE sounds like you have a MBA LOL. But I could not have said it any better. I made a few dollars from oil in the last few months myself. With oil down to $64.00 a barrel i cashed out right in time.

 

I would be happy if oil was around $30 to $35/barrel and I was paying $1.50/gallon for diesel again.

 

Crude oil closed at $65.06 today on the NYMEX; NYMEX Crude Oil Front Month CL.1:NYM - Performance - FT.com
87 octane $2.19, Diesel $2.96 Here locally. We pay an additional $0.02 per gallon tax for the seawall here.

 

Yeah....I just paid $3.19/gallon for diesel today. It's stubbornly staying about $.80 higher than gas right now......All I can guess is that gas is replaced quicker at retail locations and the 'lower' priced refined barrels are going into the gas tanks quicker than into the diesel tanks.

I paid $4.79/gallon for diesel on a recent fishing trip back in July. I filled up the tank 4 times and ended up having to fork over about $400 just for fuel for that trip. I just got back from ANOTHER fishing trip last week and paid $3.49/gallon for diesel, and my fuel bill for THIS trip was about $300 and change. Back when I first bought the truck 3 years ago, I was paying $1.79/gallon for diesel.....and 4 fillups cost about $160 for a trip.

Those are pretty big differences, sportsfans. That July trip at $4.79 'bout killed me. I ain't rich like some of you bastids....

 

Well, since my thread was and closed....
Ford extended my one week of work to the end of November. Ford also announced today that they will be adding the third shift back to DTP starting January 12, 2009.

Looks like I'll be building trucks again after all!!!!

Ken, first pop is on me the next time you come to the motor city!!!

 

Sounds good. Looks like Ford sold most off there 08 inventory ahead off schedule an the new 09s are making there way to dealer lots. Senn quite a few new ones on the road already. Glad to see you back doing what you do best.

 

If you were running for office, the opponent would be running slander ads about how you made money in the stock market while the economy tanked
I see this all of the time. Personally if anyone, politician or not, can invest in the right stocks and make money, then good for them. That is what it is there for. It doesn't make someone a bad person.


As for the original post, I do think that the high oil/gas prices had alot to do with the economy tanking and thus killing truck sales!!

 

Very glad to hear that DD!! Congrats!