newbie with a problem!
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newbie with a problem!
Hey guys,
thanks in advance for any help you can offer to a zero post guy! (come over to the PY GTO forum and I'll load you up with advice in return!)
I've got a 98 Explorer 5.0 AWD that's running too rich. When it's cold it starts on the first crank, when it's hot it cranks for eternity and when it finally catches you can smell gas like it's flooded itself to death. It's throwing code 172 right bank too rich. I've cleaned the MAF, I've replaced the MAF, there's no vac leaks I can find, the EGR is not stuck and the manifold to EGR pipe's been replaced so there's no cracks. DPFE was replaced as well. All 4 o2 sensors were just replaced. I had access to a decent scanner today and drove around with it. Long term Bank 1 fuel trim shows -20% and Long term Bank 2 fuel trim shows -10% If I'm understanding that correctly that means that the computers running bank 1 at 20% lean to try compensating for running rich and 10% on the left bank. I read somewhere on here that it throws a code at 15% variance so that's why I'm not getting an error on the left bank?
Fuel pressure test on the regulator seemed fine. per my research, pop the vac line off the regulator. Pressure comes up to 40psi and stays there. If it's bad it would fluctuate and/or fuel would come out of the diaphragm. Mine is dry and pressures steady. When it's all connected I'm running at about 34 psi and it'll surge up to 40 on quick throttle before dropping back to 34. After I shut it down, it's losing pressure. After 2 minutes I'm down to 30 psi, after 5 minutes it's down to 20 psi, after an hour it's down to 8 psi. When I started chasing this, I wasn't having such a huge drop in pressure.
I'm thinking everything is pointing to leaking injectors. I can't get past the fact that when I first bought the truck about a year ago, I had a fuel leak in the line that I later found was due to someone cutting the steel braid covered flex hose near the steering column and clamping a piece of 3/8" air hose over it. When I took that crap off I could see some deteriorating rubber schrapnel that I'm sure must have got up inside the line and since this splice occurred after the fuel filter, it had to have let some crap up into the injectors. Since the motor ran fine I never really pursued it beyond gallons of fuel injector cleaner but since I live in NY, I can't get this truck through inspection with the CEL on so now that it's overdue, I need to fix this!
So anyone got any other ideas beyond dropping a ton of money on new injectors?
Thanks!
Dennis
thanks in advance for any help you can offer to a zero post guy! (come over to the PY GTO forum and I'll load you up with advice in return!)
I've got a 98 Explorer 5.0 AWD that's running too rich. When it's cold it starts on the first crank, when it's hot it cranks for eternity and when it finally catches you can smell gas like it's flooded itself to death. It's throwing code 172 right bank too rich. I've cleaned the MAF, I've replaced the MAF, there's no vac leaks I can find, the EGR is not stuck and the manifold to EGR pipe's been replaced so there's no cracks. DPFE was replaced as well. All 4 o2 sensors were just replaced. I had access to a decent scanner today and drove around with it. Long term Bank 1 fuel trim shows -20% and Long term Bank 2 fuel trim shows -10% If I'm understanding that correctly that means that the computers running bank 1 at 20% lean to try compensating for running rich and 10% on the left bank. I read somewhere on here that it throws a code at 15% variance so that's why I'm not getting an error on the left bank?
Fuel pressure test on the regulator seemed fine. per my research, pop the vac line off the regulator. Pressure comes up to 40psi and stays there. If it's bad it would fluctuate and/or fuel would come out of the diaphragm. Mine is dry and pressures steady. When it's all connected I'm running at about 34 psi and it'll surge up to 40 on quick throttle before dropping back to 34. After I shut it down, it's losing pressure. After 2 minutes I'm down to 30 psi, after 5 minutes it's down to 20 psi, after an hour it's down to 8 psi. When I started chasing this, I wasn't having such a huge drop in pressure.
I'm thinking everything is pointing to leaking injectors. I can't get past the fact that when I first bought the truck about a year ago, I had a fuel leak in the line that I later found was due to someone cutting the steel braid covered flex hose near the steering column and clamping a piece of 3/8" air hose over it. When I took that crap off I could see some deteriorating rubber schrapnel that I'm sure must have got up inside the line and since this splice occurred after the fuel filter, it had to have let some crap up into the injectors. Since the motor ran fine I never really pursued it beyond gallons of fuel injector cleaner but since I live in NY, I can't get this truck through inspection with the CEL on so now that it's overdue, I need to fix this!
So anyone got any other ideas beyond dropping a ton of money on new injectors?
Thanks!
Dennis
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 4,901
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From: Salt Lake City, Utah
You hit the nail on the head. Leaking injectors. There are not a lot of things that can cause a too rich condition, and leaking injectors is one of them, and the fuel pressure is otherwise in specs. As far as isolating an injector, I don't really know, you can try listening to each one with a mechanics stethoscope.
Also, good work, you are a thorough, it's amazing how many mechanics would have already jumped to conclusions without doing any of the tests you did.
Also, good work, you are a thorough, it's amazing how many mechanics would have already jumped to conclusions without doing any of the tests you did.
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You hit the nail on the head. Leaking injectors. There are not a lot of things that can cause a too rich condition, and leaking injectors is one of them, and the fuel pressure is otherwise in specs. As far as isolating an injector, I don't really know, you can try listening to each one with a mechanics stethoscope.
Also, good work, you are a thorough, it's amazing how many mechanics would have already jumped to conclusions without doing any of the tests you did.
Also, good work, you are a thorough, it's amazing how many mechanics would have already jumped to conclusions without doing any of the tests you did.
$23 each for rebuilt ones off some place on the internet ($200)
$45 each for BWD special order through a parts store ($390)
$68 each for Standard through Napa (in stock) ($589)
On the searches, I've found guys saying rebuilt is crap and buy new and I've seen just as many guys on the other side of the fence saying the rebuilds are fine.
I'm ignoring the "good used set" guys on ebay since they seem to have quite a few "replaced my 19 lbs for performance 24 lbs and nothing was wrong with them" stories which I find hard to believe since if you dig into the feedbacks you'll find identical auctions from a month ago with the same pictures. (I'm still waiting on the answers to my questions when I pointed that out to the seller!)
I'm open for new opinions on the new vs rebuilt!
Thanks again!
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Where? I've been hunting all over the internet and the best price I've found is fiveomotorsports for $339 new bosch. Local stores best price is $45 each
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I stayed with the five0 injectors, got them in this weekend and problem's solved. I'd like to know why you can't buy the upper to lower gasket only instead of the whole intake set for $31, seems like a waste since the job doesn't require pulling the lower intake. Oh well, can't complain too hard, it's NICE to be able to twist the key after coming out of the store and have the motor start immediately!
