FE427TP I do realize there were 427's cast w/o cross bolts. But most of those were for Chris Craft. I.E. used as boat motors correct?

AnotherF150 There were 427 used in indutrial uses such as irrigation. They were also used as Boat Motors as previously stated. I ASSUMED (*** you me) that you had taken it out of a car. This brings me to believe once again you have a 427.

Sorry I am not more help. Seem to be more problem on this post anyway.


Scotty

 

[updated:LAST EDITED ON 12-Nov-02 AT 06:01 AM (EST)]The block is going in tomarow because I got my 77 150 2wd with a built 390 back so I can transport it with out having to throw it in a trunk like I had to do in the begining.I will get back to you than.

 

Look your new block over very carefully. Old guys like me have been out there looking for them in cars for the last 25yrs. Most of them in cars were grabbed long ago. Then we started after boats, and then we went after the apple orchards and farms. So the chance of finding one in a car are something between slim and none. And, the guts are gone from the one you found......why ? If the person who took it apart kept the insides, why didn't they keep the block ? It may be damaged and that is why it was thrown out. Look it over carefully before you part with any cash. You might also check the water jackets for 'hardblock'. Plenty of guys have bored out a 390 or 406 to 4.25 and raced it with the water jackets full of this stuff. It will be gray and look as though the water passages are full of concrete. Now, as to this two 427 thing......I'm not sure where this idea came from. The 406 engine was designed for nascar racing, and it recieved crossbolted main caps in late 61 or early 62. Memory fails me as to when exactly. Ford then stopped making 406s and made 427s instead ( bigger, bettter ). They were intended for racing. The reason Ford sold them in cars on the showroom floor was so they could race the same thing and claim they were 'stock' engines. Why would ford switch back to the 2 bolt main for the racing engine ? And the marine engines...All of the 427 marine engines I have seen have had the crossbolts.Some of them were cast as sideoliers but machined as top oilers, but all of them had the crossbolts. So, just because the Dinosaur hasn't ever seen one doesn't mean there aren't any, but be carefull. I'll tell you what I have seen about a half a dozen of...63,64 and 65 390 blocks bored out to 4.23 and offered for sale as 'two bolt 427s'. Lots of these 390s were cast with the ***** of iron where the crossbolts would go, if they were there. They will look alot loke the picture in this thread above. Write us back and tell us what you find. DF

 

I agree with Dino. I've been around a ton of 390's, 406's, 427's and never seen in person a real for live 427 that wasn't cross-bolted. From my experience, any claim of a 2 bolt 427 was a punched out 390 as Dinosaur said. Be very careful.

 

[updated:LAST EDITED ON 14-Nov-02 AT 00:12 AM (EST)] I put a dial bore guage on it is a punched out 390. But what I have found is a 406 in my buds shed and it is a real 406 that I am going to try and get out of him . As for the 390 my friend and I are going to skrew with it, tell me what you think.

Bred .060over
460 crank and rods
self built 4 bolt mains
zero decked
Ported and polished industrial FE heads with CJ rated valves

I have all the tools and machines to do this and if I can make it work it will be fun and if it doesn't oh well I can got the parts for a real good deal.
NO ONE HAS EVER SAID I'M SANE 140MPH 76 F150 WITH A 450HP 390.

 

Has any one herd of a casted 427 but bored to a 390 and put in a truck with industrial heads. A friend gave me that sugestion.

 

>Has any one herd of a casted 427 but bored to a 390 and put
>in a truck with industrial heads. A friend gave me that
>sugestion.

Huh? I don't get it. The 427's bore is 4.23", and the 390 is only 4.05". You couldn't bore a 427 to make a 390 -- you'd have to sleeve it (with some fairly thick sleeves).

Do you mean taking a raw casting and instead of finishing it with 4.23" bores, you finish it with 4.05" bores? I don't know if that could be done or not. It depends on how much material there is in the cylinders of the raw casting. Even if possible, why would Ford do that? You'd be wasteing a perfectly good 427 block to build a cheap industrial 390 with massively thick cylinder walls.

Keep in mind that 427's and 390's have a lot more to separate them than the bore size. The 427's were cast from a much stronger and more expensive alloy than the run-of-the-mill FEs. 427's were always in short supply, which is why many so-called "427" cars of the era actually came with 428s. Even most of the Shelby Cobra "427" cars actually had 428s under the hood.

 

>>. As for the 390 my friend and I are going to skrew with it, tell me what you think.
Bred .060over
460 crank and rods
self built 4 bolt mains
zero decked
Ported and polished industrial FE heads with CJ rated valves


460 crank won't work. Different bore spacing=different crank journal spacing. Besides, a 428 crank has more stroke.

As for the "self built 4 bolt mains", you would be better off to make use of the FE's Y-Block design and build your own Cross-Bolt mains. A much stronger way to contain the crank than any typical 4-Bolt setup, in my opinion, as the top of the cap (engine upside down) will be supported by the block where it is most needed. Then you won't have to pull-off the pan to show others the handy work you done to your 390 block!

 

As for the 427 cast and than bored to a 390. The individjual that told me this said that if the b;ock wasnt strong enough the would juat make a 390. Plus the casting #'s still bring up the question why does it still say it is a 427 when the bore is a 390?

 

Pull one of the freeze plugs and check for spacing between cylinders. This could give you an Idea if it MIGHT be a 390 cast as a 427. IF and I mean IF it was cast as a 427, but machined as a 390 then you could possibley make a 427 out of it. Sonic Check or at the very least do the drill bit in the freeze plug area test first. I can't remeber the size of drill bit that is supposed to be able to fit inbetween the 427 bore sleeves. It isn't very big I kow that. Like smaller than 3/16" I think. If a bigger one fits then you do not have a 427.


Scotty

 

I've been watching this thread for a while and now I'm going to put in my 2 cents. Ford made and marketed the 427 to many different applications. Of course, we all look for the car engine, but they are scarce. In my area they were used for irrigation engines and sold as industrial motors. Most of these were cast as side oilers and drilled as center oilers. Most of these were NOT crossbolted but they were 427s with FT heads, intakes and flywheel housings. I have 5 of these in my shop at this time and one in my 66 Ranger. The one in the 66 has a 428 crank in it also. We had custom pistons made by Jahns and it uses 454 Ch##y rings. The pickup is lively, to say the least. The quickest way to tell a 427 is a true 427 is to knock out a freeze plug and stick a drill bit between the cylinders. If a 3/16 bit fits, it's probably not a 427. We had a lively discussion on www.fomoco.com about a year ago about these noncrossbolted 427s. I ended up taking pictures and sending them to 'shoe' and he posted them. The nasayers finally capitulated and agreed that Ford probably did make this engine. If I were to located a supposed 427 for sale and it wasn't crossbolted, you can bet that I'll use the drill bit test. There are lots of guys who tried to hog out a 390 and make a 427 and found out it wouldn't work and just laid the block aside, only to be found later. Be very careful with a 'found' 427 and check it out. They bring enough money that the counterfeiters are at work. Oh yeah, those 5 engines are not for sale.

 

Thank you this is the sort of info I have been looking for. The block is sitting in my shop just as a bare casting and beed blasted ( it looks like new ) I will check out the cylinder spacing on monday when I get back to the shop and will keep all of you posted than.

 

390

 

While I certainly agree that there were anomolies within FE production, I also believe that Ford never produced non-crossbolted 427 engines as the 427's were machined on their own line using special tooling. With that said however, I also believe as one pster said that he has non-crossbolted 427 engines. Actually what he has is 390's cast with 427 cylinder bores. I understand that these would be unusual and that he might want to keep them but in the market place I don't think there would be a lot of desire for these. Heck, you put a 427 decal on your car and the FIRST thing everybody does is look down there for the crossbolts!!! Finding a non-crossbolted 427 should make you about as excited as finding that your GT500 actually came from the factory with an 'S" code 390 instead of a 428 (yes, that has happened too.
And No, the non-crossbolted 427 was NOT intended for marine use. The engines used in the marine program were the "CAST AS SIDE OILERS-MACHINED AS CENTER OILERS". This program allowed FOMOCO the ability to produce as bunch of 427s from the new side oiler tooling (keeping the accountants happy ammortizing the tooling costs over a large production run) without putting them in cars (to keep warranty costs down). Again, did some boats get side oilers? Probably, are there 390' with 427 cylinders? probably, are there 360's with 390 cranks and rods? Yes, were there 427 Cobra's with 428's Yes, were there GT500 that actually had 390's? Yes.

 

You are entitled to your own opinion, but, I know what I'm talking about when I say that Ford made a bunch of 427 side oiler blocks drilled as center oilers and NO crossbolts. There were literally hundreds of them used for industrial applications and marine applications. Go to fomoco.comm and check the FE forum. Ask "Shoe". You will find out that I am correct, BUT you are entitled to your own opinion.