351 Marine reverse Rotation
Thread Starter
|
New User
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 8
Likes: 0
351 Marine reverse Rotation
I recently converted a auto 351W for marine use, reverse rotation. Everything went well until I got to the rear main seal and saw the oil groving done just ahead of the seal to promote oil removal in front of the seal.
I installed a "speedy sleeve" and went ahead and installed the standard 2 piece rubber seal. This seal failed within a short time. Tear down showed that part of the seal had transfered itself on to the journal, and the remaining lip of the seal was roughened up.
A second rubber seal was installed, with extra lubrication, thinking that the first seal ran dry. It too failed in a short time.
I am considering using the old style rope seal-
Question- is this seal still available and would you recommend it as a cure? I can handle a few drips-but not the deluge I am getting now.
Thanks
Dave, with way too much oil in the bilge.
I installed a "speedy sleeve" and went ahead and installed the standard 2 piece rubber seal. This seal failed within a short time. Tear down showed that part of the seal had transfered itself on to the journal, and the remaining lip of the seal was roughened up.
A second rubber seal was installed, with extra lubrication, thinking that the first seal ran dry. It too failed in a short time.
I am considering using the old style rope seal-
Question- is this seal still available and would you recommend it as a cure? I can handle a few drips-but not the deluge I am getting now.
Thanks
Dave, with way too much oil in the bilge.
Hotshot
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 11,141
Likes: 25
From: south louisiana
The knurling on the reverse crank is running the oil into the seal on your std rotation, I don't think the rope seal will help in that case. The knurling shouldn't be contacting the seal period, even if the crank's turning backwards of what it was designed to do.
Thread Starter
|
New User
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 8
Likes: 0
I have installed a speedy sleeve that covers the knurling. I believe that the increased diameter is causing too tight of fit with the rubber seals- thus the reason to try a rope seal. Speedy sleeves are about the thickness of a beer can, made out of stainless.
The marine application is double tuff, as on bringing the boat up on plane, the engine angle gets ugly.
Shuffster
The marine application is double tuff, as on bringing the boat up on plane, the engine angle gets ugly.
Shuffster
Hotshot
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 11,141
Likes: 25
From: south louisiana
In that case, I'd try and remove the knurling and leave the speedy sleeve off and use the rope by itself, if you can get one. If not get a std rotation crank. With the stroker kits out there now, the stock stroke cranks should be cheaper than you'd expect.
Thread Starter
|
New User
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 8
Likes: 0
Let me clarify: This engine was an auto engine. It is now a marine engine, running opposite rotation. I did find reverse rotation cranks thru NAPA, but I will only do this change as a last resort. Thanks for the suggestions.
Postmaster
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 2,656
Likes: 1
Trending Topics
Thread Starter
|
New User
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 8
Likes: 0
FTE Stories
Ford Trucks for Ford Truck Enthusiasts
Top 10 Most Expensive Ford Trucks Ever Sold on Bring a Trailer
Joe Kucinski
2027 Ford Super Duty Buyer's Guide (Every Model, Engine, & Package)
Brett Foote
Top 10 Ford Truck Tragedies
Joe Kucinski
AEV FXL Super Duty - the Super Duty Raptor Ford Doesn't Make
Brett Foote
Lobo Vs Lobo: Proof the F-150 Lobo Should Be Even Lower!
Michael S. Palmer
Ford's 2001 Explorer Sportsman Concept Looks For a New Home
Verdad Gallardo
10 Best Ford Truck Engines We Miss the Most!
Joe Kucinski
2026 Shelby F-150 Off-Road: Better Than a Raptor R?
Brett Foote
2027 Super Duty Carhartt Package First Look: 12 Things You NEED to Know!
Michael S. Palmer
Hotshot
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 11,141
Likes: 25
From: south louisiana
The knurling just forward of the seal surface that guides the oil excess away is reversed. I've only seen one of these pieces and the machinist that had it pointed that out to me. Otherwise I think it's the same casting unless the oil passages are also reversed.
Tuned
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 289
Likes: 0
From: So. Cal.
May be that the speedy sleve is starving the lip seal somehow. I think if it wasn't so much trouble to try it, That may work. All that would happen is lots of oil will be directed at the new seal and it still should drain away before it blows out the seal.
Good luck whatever you do.
Good luck whatever you do.
Fleet Mechanic
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 1,575
Likes: 11
From: Puyallup, WA
You need to either run the correct crankshaft or speedi sleeve it and run the correct reverse rotation rubber lipped seal. (the little grooves are reverse cut on the actual seal lip) The only problem with the rubber seal is that it is not available for all engines, so you may be forced into installing the correct reverse rotation crank.
There is no other work around that will last.
I have 33+ years of training and experience in the pleasure boat as well as light duty commercial marine fields, and I wish I had better advice.
I would also advise that if this is a automotive engine, you pull the heads and have the sodium filled exhaust valves installed, if not already installed. Otherwise your exhaust valve life may not be up to your expectations either.
Good luck, David
There is no other work around that will last.
I have 33+ years of training and experience in the pleasure boat as well as light duty commercial marine fields, and I wish I had better advice.
I would also advise that if this is a automotive engine, you pull the heads and have the sodium filled exhaust valves installed, if not already installed. Otherwise your exhaust valve life may not be up to your expectations either.
Good luck, David
Last edited by dmanlyr; Jul 4, 2007 at 02:34 PM.
Post Fiend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 14,325
Likes: 14
From: Island Southeast Alaska
I believe the reverse rotation engine takes a different seal. And the speedy sleeve Makes no difference. Like dmanlyr said. I also have around 30 years in marine inboards. The standard seal isn't letting oil to it. It's not the sleeve. But I do sleeve a standard crank when reversing. JMHO
Thread Starter
|
New User
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 8
Likes: 0
Arctic Y Block/ Dmanlyr - I actually used the reverse rotation seal on the first round and it left a rubber trail around the sleeve. I used a std. Rotation seal on the second try and it is leaking. I need to tear it down to examine and see what happened to it. Perhaps I didn't get a good pan seal this last time. Obviously as the boat goes on plane, there is significant oil to the rear.
By the way, the engine is in a old Century Resorter, seldom sees much load, mostly taken out for Cocktail cruises on Payette Lake, McCall, Idaho.
Do you know if rope seals are available for early 351 W ? I may wind up ordering a new crank for next year, but would like to make one last try now to enjoy the boat for a couple of months.
Thanks
By the way, the engine is in a old Century Resorter, seldom sees much load, mostly taken out for Cocktail cruises on Payette Lake, McCall, Idaho.
Do you know if rope seals are available for early 351 W ? I may wind up ordering a new crank for next year, but would like to make one last try now to enjoy the boat for a couple of months.
Thanks