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PROPS! green1969!!!!

 

[QUOTE=kotzy]I see in muddyaxles post the oil which was 30w/30 was a remanufactured oil. The engine failed because of an improperly blended lubricating oil, not its viscosity.
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Yes, he said that, but I had never seen a 30W-30 before, which I guess is a spec for a remanufactured oil.

Since I never have used a remanufactured oil, that is why I never saw it before. I mean, what's the difference in price? Was it worth it?

Since he blew up his 327, one less Chevy on the road, because of his bad decision. What a waste. Unneedlessly.

Ed

 

Well I've seen 20W-20, which most folks around here ran in their vehicles back in the 40's & 50's & straight 30 & 40 weight went into the mechanically challanged & oil burner engines & lawn & garden equipt. Don't think I ever remember seeing 30W-30 around here.

Back in the 80's & 90's when GM & Ford began specifying 5W-30, it was rare to find it in the stores, but by the time I bought my 94 Taurus 3.8L, it was to be had almost anywhere & 10W-30, which had been the mainstay multi-vis crank case lube, since the mid 50's, was on the wane, as the 5W-30 had proven itself.

Now when Ford began specifing the 5W-20, it was very difficult to find around here & most folks, including most Dealers, didn't trust it & still put in 5W-30 or 10W-30.

Most have now come to accept 5W-20, if specified by the mfgr, as ok & safe to use.

Ford has back specified most but not ALL engines to use the 5W-20. My 94 Taurus 3.8L, is ok to use it, but not my 99 Ranger 4.0L pushrod engine!!!! So I just continue to use 5W-30 Havoline in both of them, along with Motorcraft filters.

It's getting so danged complicated now days to know what's safe to use, because of all the different engine designs & oil recipe's, & changes thereto, so imo just stay with what your vehicle manufacturer specifies & recommends, for the service grade, viscosity range & OCI, that fits your driving conditions, drive cycle, & driving style.

If you want to safely go outside those guidelines, then establish a base line with several UOA's to determine how the engine, oil & filter are doing, in your particular engine, under your conditions!!!!
Everyones conditions will likely be different & a particular oil or filter may not safely bridge all those conditions, thus the UOA baseline.

Just some some thoughts for pondering.

 

If the oil were placed in the ball bearing load test it would have probably have failed. This test is where steel ***** are placed on precision steel plates and rotated under load with lubricants to test the failure points of the film strength. Remember to lubricate the oil must maintain the film strenght. Additives added to the oil increase the film strength. It must be able to flow, (pour point at a specific temperature cold and hot) and maintain film strength (ball bearing load test). Not to mention the flash point. There are many test a "good" oil must pass. The latest oils have made some compromises and should not be used in engines that don't have roller tappet camshaft systems. Normal cam ground lifters will quickly wear out. So for those with older engines and cam ground lifters, I would stay away from the new oils. Just my $.02. Jim

 

When I took those initial readings, I dont think I had the engine warm enough. After a 20 miles drive my pressure is now about 6psi at idle and 20-25 on the highway.

Does that change anyones mind set?


BTW, Ill be adding Lucas Oil Stabalizer soon and probably change to 10w-40 or 20w-50 for my next oil. (whcih do yall think? Coldest start will probably be above 50 degrees)

 

20 to 25 psi at highways speeds does sound a bit low and/or sounds like 5w20 or lower viscosity. Try the higher visc. oils and see what happens. Can't hurt.

Jim

 

Given the new lower pressures, definitely 10w40 (14 cSt vs 10w30's 10.5 cSt)and depending on how that does, maybe half 20w50 on that (a mix of 10w40 and 20w50 would give you about 17cSt, which is a very thin 50 weight, vs a full 20w50 which is around 20 cSt).

Might also consider a heavy duty engine oil, one of the dual rated (gas / diesel, SL/CI-4) oils, like Valvoline Premium Blue, Shell Rotella, or Mobil Delvac. They come in gallon jugs at all the parts stores in 15w40. Will be more robust and probably around 15 cSt. Easy year round use in TX I would think.

I would be more inclined to run Valvoline Synpower Oil Treatment (VSOT) than the Lucas stuff. Not sure how good Lucas is. Some discussion at the oil guy site. Full bottle of VSOT or even the Maxlife Engine Protector (on clearance at some Big Lots) will raise you 2 cSt to about 12.5 or borderline between 30 and 40 wt.

 

I kinda like TallPauls idea about tryng a 15W-40, seeing as how the hot pressures are so low.

I'd kinda sneak up on the viscosity change, rather than jump right into a BIG change.

Are you hearing any untoward, cold or warm noises from this engine????

If you change to a heavier weight lube, let us know what it was changed to & how it goes.

 

The Lucas is already paid for, but if all else fails Ill try some of the Valvoline.

No noises to speak of.

Ill deff. keep yall posted.

Thanks for the help!

 

LESS MPG = fuel guage getting to EMPTY, SOONER rather than later. That is a fact. Again, if his MPG is 15 max. (a made up number) he will not achieve 16.6 MPG using a higher viscosity oil. Duh! Please, don't attempt to talk down to me! It's not the way to go.

I never said mpg would go up using a more viscous engine oil (yes, I do recognize that you are using the term "thicker" for effect, but that effect is lost on me because "thicker" = more protection at full operating temperatures to me, sir. Also, Multi-viscosity oils have much less difference in "thickness" at full operating temperatures than you would imagine). On the other side of that coin is the fact (I have proven it to myself, anyhow) that the increase in mpg using "thinner" (less viscous) engine oils is miniscule to nothing over the long haul and there are risks which are not openly addressed.

I will give you that if you never fully warm your engine driving mostly short trips of less than ten minutes, then you might enjoy a tenth or two increased mpg. But if you are like the majority of drivers whose trips last 30 minutes or more, the savings in energy taper off as the engine approaches full operating temperature and may even reverse to increased energy losses due to substandard lubrication if sustained full temperature highway driving in warm to hot temps is necessary.





Pawpaw: Just remember that the middle ranges of both oils are the same, the end points are different, which only have an effect when engine temps reach the extremes...which seems to me is what we are looking for.

This is sort of like playing doctor/druggist. If the patient was healthy, we wouldn't be talking here. What is good for a healthy patient is not necessarily what's good for the suffering patient. Instead of high blood pressure we're dealing with low oil pressure.

Try the 15W-40 or 20W-50 if it is hot outside or you're working it hard.

 

I never said you wrote that fuel mileage would go up, but was simply using that as an example. (Which was correct of course).

If you don't want me to say the oil viscosity you prefer is "thicker", "thick", "heavier" "heavy" ect. then what term do you prefer that I use? I don't say anything for "effect", I simply post what I feel, and know to be closer to the truth than not.

You seem to think that "thick" (is that okay to say?) Wait... You seem to think "your preferred oils" offer better protection in hot weather. That is dated thinking, and I even thought so back in the 60s, and 70s. It simply is not true. In fact, the new Mustang GT500 calls for a 5w20. Those engines are made to run extremely hot, and the 5w20 oil can and will handle the heat. Otherwise, Ford would have oil related engine failures left and right in desert states, ect.

Once you get your dated thinking abolished, you'll realize your mistakes when it comes to modern engines and today's oils.

 

Ed, (comments above were added after this was written):
You're talking thicker, thinner, etc.,etc.,etc. You are using 10w-30 and 5w-30! These are today's THICKER oils compared to the 5w-20 and 0w-whatever, unless you're talking about a diesel engine or oil for "high-mileage" engines, like Americanmade's situation. (I haven't even seen 10w-40 on the shelf for maybe ten years.) 10w-30 is not a lightweight, like I said many posts ago, it has been the industry standard since multi-vis oils were originated.
Oh, the remanufactured oil was cheap, I should have known better, but that was 35 years ago, and I didn't know then what I know now. The reman oil followed your precious "thin" design and I knew it wasn't right, but I needed an O.C., so I did it (on site while I waited for a load) just to get home so I could get some better oil. The cheap stuff wrecked that engine in just seven or eight miles. (That was before I "switched" to Fords.)
I have a brand I prefer and you will probably never find it on a retail shelf. You've ticked me off, Ed, so I'm done playing with you. Research my posts if you really want to know.

 

I surrender,, I will assume you guys can sort it all out,, tired of all the yelling . Out Jim

 

One thing that was never asked is are these readings from a factory electric gauge. May be worth testing it with a mechanical gauge. A bad sending unit or a bad constant voltage regulator could have been the cause of all this fussing and fuming .

Kotzy

 

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Where have I ever said that I consider 5w30 and 10w30 "heavy oils"? I have not. Any energy conserving certified oil, I have absolutely no problem with. I would not use a 5w20 oil in my 440, and have found a quality 10w30 delivers peak performance in the big block Mopar. This is a car built prior to cats being used, but the valves on a '73 Dodge were being prepped to run on low lead or unleaded gasoline, even though I used leaded gasoline in it until around '85 or so. By then even leaded gasoline contained very few lead particles in it, until it was completely outlawed in the USA.

10w30 is fine, and my preferred oil of choice in a 60s or 70s era I-6 or V8. You'll never need 10w40, 15w40, 20w50 oils, unless you want to waste gasoline, overwork starter when starting the engine cold, or overworking your oil pump, when it tries to pump those heavy oils, cold. Not winter conditions, either. Summertime too. Those oils are simply making your engine work harder, the crankshaft work harder as the engines tries to make power but has much more internal friction to overcome.

Now if you have a worn engine, high mileage with blowby issues, piston slap, oil burning, all of the above is off. Thick, heavy oils are needed to help seal worn rings, worn bearings, ect. That is when 15w40, 20w50 oils work their magic and do what they are intended to do. In a tight engine, your thick oils are the same as pulling a sparkplug wire off of the plug. Fuel mileage drops. Engine power is reduced. Sure the engine will still start. However, it will not be running at peak efficiency.

That is where I differ from you. I want my engines to run at the best of their ability, whether it's a Briggs and Stratton lawnmower or a full race motor, and everything in between. You seem to settle for close effiency, because your logic is dated with "old thinking" that has become obsolete for the most part.

You might enjoy watching TV on your 13" black and white portable. I'll watch TV on my 13" color plasma TV. Both of us will watch the same program. One of us will be more up to date with modern technology, and will enjoy a sharp, clear color picture. You enjoy a sharp, clear, black and white picture. At one time, I watched black and white TV and b&w TV shows as well. Soon, I discovered I liked color TVs better, while you continued to enjoy the dated TV with black and white technology.

Same premise for motor oil.

Ed