I posted here a few days ago. I asked if you could take the thermostat out and never put one back (MINE WAS BROKEN). You guys said it's a bad idea to do so. It was stated that the engine would run rough and it wouldn't pass emissons. So I bought one and put it in. The engine was running at the R sometimes M in NORMAL wuth the new thermostat in place. Since my old one was alwys stuck at half it would run cool unless I'm on the freeway. I guiess with the new thermostat that is the temp the truck should run. I don't like it that hot. i took tthe thermostat out and the truck ran really cool. It barely go's to the N in NORMAL!!! The truck runs great. It seems that it has more power. It is known that a cool engine is a happy engine. SO no need for thermostat!!!!!

P.S. I would only suggest to take out the thermosat if you live in a warm climate where it doesn't get below freezing. I live in AZ!

....... The truck does take about 15 minutes to get to operating temperature!

 

You mean no one told you that a cooler engine increases wear faster too?

Ford engineered the engine's to run at the 195* F temp.

I would think 180* F be minimum.

It's your truck though,so good luck.



Dennis

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I agree with Dennis. Mine runs great with the 195 degree thermostat in. That is what FORD recommends ! Wierd thing though, mine never runs past the N in Normal with my 195. I just replaced mine @ 230,000 miles. It's the AZ replacement to the OEM original.

 

about 2000 miles ago i had my EFI 302 overhauled. new thermostat installed. runs much cooler than it did before. 65 mph on the highway it runs on the bottom edge of normal to the "n". doing backroads and such in the lower gears it gets up to the mid point of the guage. just thought i would add my 1 cent (i'm broke, the other cent went for rent). :-)

 

Mil1o who told you a cold engine increaes wear. It's the other way around!

 

>Mil1o who told you a cold engine increaes wear. It's the
>other way around!

U might wanna get your facts straight before making yourself look like an idiot any further. Both your engine and tranny (if auto) have an "operating temp," perhaps similar to the human body. Too cold is not good, and too hot is not good.

I don't recall what year your Bronco is, but if it's EFI it's definitely designed to operate at a certain temp. If your water temp doesnt' hit 195 the ECT knows this, and the ECM will cause the truck to run rich. Best case is just worse gas mileage, worst case is increased wear on the motor.

And for god's sake install a real temp gauge with numbers. "R" and "N" don't mean a thing, even when comparing from one Ford to the next.

 

First, 38 years of automotive experience I guess.

Try reading these > The WHOLE page about cooling.

http://www.autoeducation.com/autoshop101/cooling.htm

http://tpub.com/eqopbas/14.htm


BTW <> You can't go by a Ford gauge,They've always sucked.



Dennis

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[updated:LAST EDITED ON 08-Dec-02 AT 04:59&nbsp;AM (EST)]I don't normally stoop to this type of thing but considering how many people responded to the last post who were absolutely right and number of people who responded to this post with the exact same answers, I just have to chuckle. I mean, its not like we are sitting around doling out misinformation and for each of us who may not be clear on one point or another, someone else has it right. If posting means nothing more than getting advice, ignoring it and then telling us we are all wrong, then why post in the first place. ok, I've worn out my soapbaox. I'll shut up.

 

Amen greystreak92

 

Well, when summer comes, and the engine has strange symptoms of overheating, but the temp gauge doesnt match, refer this post again,lol. The thermostat also acts as a restrictor, slowing the flow of coolant down. If it passes thru the engine too fast, it wont extract the all the heat it can, and allow the engine to overheat. If its not warming up enough, like in winter, you dont get heat for the heater, and in many cases, your computer thinks the engine hasnt reached operating tempatures and it will make the engine run rich. Like the one man pointed out, the factory temperature gauges are far from consistant. One gauge will read diffrent from the next. Another factor is how clean is the core on the radiator. Do as you want, not my repair bill!.lol

 

In a nutshell, oil has to reach an operating temperature that allows it to thin and properly lubricate bearing and component parts with a minimum of friction or those parts wear more rapidly from tighter tolerances. 180-degrees has long been considered the minimum temperature for most cast iron engines. 190-210 is even better as the oil creates less friction, which allows better performance.

Current engine management control systems, in a quest for reduced emissions and performance, don't even turn on the electric fan(s) until 220-225 degrees as the increased heat provides a more complete burn in the combustion chamber and exhaust system. That's the reason you now see factory trans and engine oil coolers on big SUVs and pickups. Short track racers don't even use a fan as hot oil makes hp and pit coolant temps reach 240-250 degrees. Maximum oil operating temperature is limited by oil shear, when the oil will no longer provide a solid lubricating surface, 260-280 degrees for dino, 320+ degrees for synthetics, way below possible damage to steel or aluminum parts. That's one of the reasons virtually all high-end performance cars now come from the factory with synthetic oils in the engine and drive train.

The thermostat serves a very important function that goes way beyond just control of the coolant temperature.

 

I agree with everything about the benefits of having a thermostat, EXCEPT the part about slowing the coolant down. As anyone who's studied thermodynamics will agree, the primary concern for heat transfer is temperature gradient; not the speed of flow for either fluid (air, water, oil; whatever's passing over/thru the heat exchanger). If the coolant flowed only in a pulse and had big air pockets between each pulse, then you would want each pulse to travel thru the engine slowly (to pick up lots of heat) and thru the radiator slowly (to lose lots). But it's a continuous flow, so it the faster you push fresh-cooled coolant thru the engine, the higher you keep the gradient there, and the same is true of heated coolant going thru the radiator.

If there's a reason for the thermostat being restrictive, it's not so much to change the speed of the coolant (they could just have designed the pulley & impeller differently for that), it would be to create a pressure head inside the engine so the coolant is less likely to boil there, and a similar low-pressure (relatively speaking) zone inside the radiator that might promote boiling, thereby releasing the latent heat of vaporization from a small fraction of the coolant.

 

Thanks for all your responses!! I understant now that it will take much longer for my truck to now get up to operating temp, I timed it it takes about 15 minutes at idle 10 at 1500 RPM! The reason I took it out was because my truck seemed to run above 195 according to the gauge. Now it stays to 175 to 180. I had my mechanic run a test to see if it's running rich. The test was negative. The truck ran geat. He said thve lower temp gave me a 3 HP increase!!! So do you think that the final operating temp which is just 15 to 20 degrees cooler will cause wear.

Also if cooler engines cause wear then why do they sell a 165 degree thermostat for my truck?
THANKS GUYS!!:-X12

 

I assume you missed reading the part about the Actual operating temperature of your engine.

Please read both articles.

The Thermostat only Opens at 195 or 180.
The actual operating temperature of the engine is higher than that.

I imagine the 165* T offering that you are refering to, is for operating in places like Texas & Arizona where the ambient temperature can hit 110-115*F no problem.

There are so many factors involved > ratio of coolant to water <> Fan Shroud <> No Fan Shroud <> Rad slowly getting plugged up <>Water slowly wearing out.

Maybe do some further research ?

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That is precisely the reason I removed it I live in Arizona where it does get well over 100 Degrees!!