2007 High Sulfur
Lead Driver
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 7,782
Likes: 221
From: Huntington Indiana
I checked with my fuel supplier for the farm and he told me that the high sulfur and the low sulfur fuel is unavailable in Michigan from any supplier for either on or off road fuel because of the possiblity of cross contamination in the pipeline. EPA has huge fine for being over the 15PPM for pipeline operators.
Postmaster
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 3,207
Likes: 0
From: Kearney, Nebr
hmmm.. I forgot to mention that we've ran our share of High Sulfur in the Powerstrokes on the farm. They run just like they always do. No difference. Now, running the UL in mine once, I strongly think my milage was down.
Lead Driver
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 7,782
Likes: 221
From: Huntington Indiana
I ran it also but when the warranty said if red fuel was used and it caused a problem "no warranty" we went to on road fuel, pay the tax , get it back later. It helped a lot with fuel consumption on the farm and on the road by my going to a premium fuel with B5 soydiesel. Got to burn what I grow-I feel. The transportation dept where I work part time heard I was using this fuel. Had one of the mechanics try it in his pickup (dmax). He said it was like adding racing fuel. His truck had more power than it ever had. A few weeks later they ordered a tankerload for the buses. Guess I was onto something here.
Elder User
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 804
Likes: 0
From: Edmonton, AB
Bio-D has a few advantages. The Bio adds alot of lubricity, making it so you dont need to run additives, it also has a higher cetaine rating too, which is why it made you guys feel you were running racing fuel.
Lead Driver
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 7,782
Likes: 221
From: Huntington Indiana
Originally Posted by fly360
What would happen if a person was to add a quart or less of used filtered vegetable oil to the older (pre '07) trucks as a lubricity additive? i've heard of some running straight vegetable oil in the trucks.
Cargo Master
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 2,789
Likes: 5
From: Sand GAp, KY
The diesel and veggie oil will not mix and stay mixed. It will seperate in the tank.Go to the bio diesel forum and do a search.
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Posting Guru
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 2,096
Likes: 0
I believe there are lots of people who think they are getting high sulfer fuel when they get dyed "off road" fuel, the reality is that most suppliers can't afford to supply all the differant fuels because of contamination concerns and most dyed fuel that is delivered is actually low sulfer fuel and the dye just says the road tax has not been paid.
Postmaster
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 3,207
Likes: 0
From: Kearney, Nebr
That just depends what part of the country you live in. For example, where I'm at (Iowa), the demand for offroad for is so high why would resort to the lower sulfur? I can see this happening in some non rural agriculture areas. Most of the supppliers around here are big buys. I would hate to think what UL would do in a 30 yr old diesel.
Posting Guru
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 2,096
Likes: 0
Originally Posted by FARM69
That just depends what part of the country you live in. For example, where I'm at (Iowa), the demand for offroad for is so high why would resort to the lower sulfur? I can see this happening in some non rural agriculture areas. Most of the supppliers around here are big buys. I would hate to think what UL would do in a 30 yr old diesel.
My supplier also tells me when all this change over shakes out, that most likely when you order the premium grade of fuel you will recieve ULSD and if you order standard #2 you will recieve low sulfer.
Logistics Pro
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 3,952
Likes: 117
From: Upper Left Coast
It won't be long until ALL diesel on road, off road, heating oil, etc will ALL be 15ppm fuel. It's not going to matter. The refiners only want to make one type of fuel anyway.
The difference between red and NON-red fuel will be tax. The EPA will mandate ultra low sulfur for everything in the future just like UN-leaded fuel is now (except AVGAS AND they want that unleaded asap also!).
Diesel engines can be properly designed run on JET fuel which is very low sulfur already(it doesn't meet the 15ppm rating yet though.......but you can bet they will require it in the future).
Packard had a diesel aircraft engine in the late 1920's!!
http://home.earthlink.net/~ralphcooper/pimagf30.htm
http://www.aopa.org/pilot/features/future0008.html
http://www.wilksch.com/
http://www.dair.co.uk/
http://web.thielert.com/typo3/index.php?id=513&L=1
http://www.deltahawkengines.com/
http://www.zoche.de/
Regards,
Rick
The difference between red and NON-red fuel will be tax. The EPA will mandate ultra low sulfur for everything in the future just like UN-leaded fuel is now (except AVGAS AND they want that unleaded asap also!).
Diesel engines can be properly designed run on JET fuel which is very low sulfur already(it doesn't meet the 15ppm rating yet though.......but you can bet they will require it in the future).
Packard had a diesel aircraft engine in the late 1920's!!
http://home.earthlink.net/~ralphcooper/pimagf30.htm
http://www.aopa.org/pilot/features/future0008.html
http://www.wilksch.com/
http://www.dair.co.uk/
http://web.thielert.com/typo3/index.php?id=513&L=1
http://www.deltahawkengines.com/
http://www.zoche.de/
Regards,
Rick
Last edited by HT32BSX115; Oct 30, 2006 at 11:18 AM.
New User
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 7
Likes: 0
Ulsd
I drive an 18 wheeler over the road. In OOIDA magazine article said that truckstops would start using ULSD in Oct. I saw ULSD sold in Iowa a couple weeks ago, the reason being that it would flush their tanks out for the Jan 07 mandate. I drive an 05 Freightliner with a Series 60 Detroit 515 hp cut back to 430 hp so it's sick to start with & I can't really tell any difference between LSD & ULSD.
It's going to be interesting to see what happens this time. I the 90's when they changed the fuel, The O'rings in the fuel pumps on the older models let go. So I'll hold off buying my Dually I'm wanting so bad [ I think it's a sickness] I'm afflicted with]
I've reading all the posts on Super Duty & the diesel & the beat I can tell even with the problems that Ford is having, GM & Dodge have just as much if not more. I learned that when I was a so called Service manager at a Dodge dealer ship. Just couldn't BS the customers like they wanted & they say truckdriver lie a lot. LOL
I have never been on a more informative forum, JJ BEAGLE
It's going to be interesting to see what happens this time. I the 90's when they changed the fuel, The O'rings in the fuel pumps on the older models let go. So I'll hold off buying my Dually I'm wanting so bad [ I think it's a sickness] I'm afflicted with]
I've reading all the posts on Super Duty & the diesel & the beat I can tell even with the problems that Ford is having, GM & Dodge have just as much if not more. I learned that when I was a so called Service manager at a Dodge dealer ship. Just couldn't BS the customers like they wanted & they say truckdriver lie a lot. LOL
I have never been on a more informative forum, JJ BEAGLE
Fleet Mechanic
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,741
Likes: 3
For what it's worth, my 1996 Series 60 runs marginally better on LSD versus ULSD. It's not a night-and-day difference, but at certain times, it's a little smoother, at least.
Mine's one of the "voluntary retrofit" engines that was subject to the '02 Consent Decree. The attempt to manage NOx emissions makes the engine almost unusable in certain operating modes... Before the rebuild, when it was "new" to me, I could out-pull just about anyone on long grades. Now, I'm stuck in the slow lane with the castrated company trucks.
My '07 F250 PSD has an '06 engine, and a sticker that says either fuel may be used.
As I was given to understand, any vehicle manufacturer could build '07 vehicles after 1/07 that were subject to '06 requirements as long as the '06 engines held out; but once the '06 engines were gone, they were subject to the requirements.
Most class-8 manufacturers have laid off between 30% and 50% of their workforces in anticipation of the buying fall-off of new vehicles; given the abysmal repair records of the '04 engines, that's not entirely surprising. Everyone I know with an '04+ motor has reported problems with them; some worse than others.
-blaine
Mine's one of the "voluntary retrofit" engines that was subject to the '02 Consent Decree. The attempt to manage NOx emissions makes the engine almost unusable in certain operating modes... Before the rebuild, when it was "new" to me, I could out-pull just about anyone on long grades. Now, I'm stuck in the slow lane with the castrated company trucks.
My '07 F250 PSD has an '06 engine, and a sticker that says either fuel may be used.
As I was given to understand, any vehicle manufacturer could build '07 vehicles after 1/07 that were subject to '06 requirements as long as the '06 engines held out; but once the '06 engines were gone, they were subject to the requirements.
Most class-8 manufacturers have laid off between 30% and 50% of their workforces in anticipation of the buying fall-off of new vehicles; given the abysmal repair records of the '04 engines, that's not entirely surprising. Everyone I know with an '04+ motor has reported problems with them; some worse than others.
-blaine
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