4.0 Scary Pinging
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New User
Joined: Mar 2006
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From: Depew, NY
4.0 Scary Pinging
Hello fellow Aero owners. My first request for HELP. I have a 93 extd eddy w/4.0, auto & has 171000 miles on it from Fla.Trying to figure out cause of eng pinging when at operating temp & under load. When cold-no pinging. Example:Thruway on cruise control, get to abit of incline & starts pinging or if try to pick up speed, sounds like I'll be picking up pieces. Once when got off thruway & had to pull a 2mi hill at 60mph, 1/2 way started started lossing pwr. Accelerated & started the pinging,bucking & seemed like not running on all cylinders. Thought cat pluging. Got to top & ran fine. No back pressure in exhaust. If I accelerate when hot on level road, pinging starts & around 70mph it wants to start bucking.First thing I did was change fuel filter. Read some threads about trany modulator,no oil in hose but ready to change anyway. No ck eng light on & read about ox sensor & wondered. I'm going to chng plugs because I have no Idea how long in eng. I've been reading alot of threads & starting to totally confuse myself. I'm scraping a 92 extd awd w/4.0 & saving alot of parts to maybe help solve problem. Thanks in advance! for any sugestions.
Lead Driver
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 7,019
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From: SoCal
First order of business, run the EEC tests; KOEO, and then KOER, and see if there are trouble codes. You can either get a cheap code scanner, or a simple jumper wire across the test plug and use the CEL to read the codes. The procedures and error codes have been covered on this list, but post again if you can't find them.
Post Fiend
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 5,720
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From: Washington state
Hi dhoeh,
xlt has you covered with first most important step, diagnosis
like going to a doctor
some things that cause pinging in 4L
1. carbon buildup in combustion chambers
2.failed thermostat, plugged radiator or failed fan vicous clutch=running too hot
3. wrong plugs=too hot heat range
4. O2 sensor failed =too lean air/fuel mix
5. MAF failed/contaminated with dirt, causing too lean mix
6. air leak in air tube after MAF, TB seals, plenum gaskets, intake manifold gaskets, EGR gaskets and tubes or vacuum line tree
causing too lean mix
7. low fuel pressure causing too lean mix
8. timing off because of failed cam sensor or crank sensor
9. failed ECT or IAT sensor causing too lean fuel mix
do not drive a 4L that is pinging....weak design heads....will soon have cracked heads....hard on rod bearings and wrist pins=broken engine
pull octane plug in wiring loom harness against firewall above driver side valve cover to retard timing 3-6 degrees until problem found....will decrease horsepower and fuel mileage but may stop pinging and early engine death
xlt has you covered with first most important step, diagnosis
like going to a doctor
some things that cause pinging in 4L
1. carbon buildup in combustion chambers
2.failed thermostat, plugged radiator or failed fan vicous clutch=running too hot
3. wrong plugs=too hot heat range
4. O2 sensor failed =too lean air/fuel mix
5. MAF failed/contaminated with dirt, causing too lean mix
6. air leak in air tube after MAF, TB seals, plenum gaskets, intake manifold gaskets, EGR gaskets and tubes or vacuum line tree
causing too lean mix
7. low fuel pressure causing too lean mix
8. timing off because of failed cam sensor or crank sensor
9. failed ECT or IAT sensor causing too lean fuel mix
do not drive a 4L that is pinging....weak design heads....will soon have cracked heads....hard on rod bearings and wrist pins=broken engine
pull octane plug in wiring loom harness against firewall above driver side valve cover to retard timing 3-6 degrees until problem found....will decrease horsepower and fuel mileage but may stop pinging and early engine death
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New User
Joined: Mar 2006
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From: Depew, NY
Xlt4wd90 : I did run the koeo & only found an old stored code for fuel pump pwr interruption, cleared & retested next day after thruway drive to & from work. No codes! I will run the koer when I get scanner again. Thanks
Last edited by dkoeh; Oct 7, 2006 at 03:37 PM.
Lead Driver
Joined: Sep 2003
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From: SoCal
I keep forgetting, which years and what engines have the EGR? I know that 1990 and 1991 4 liter engines do not.
If the EGR is not activating, that will cause exactly the symptoms you mentioned; detonation under load, and when engine is warm. However, MOST failures of the EGR will trigger a trouble code that will be stored in the EEC. The EGR valve has a sensor that measures its position (EVP), so if its vacuum source has failed, or its valve is stuck, the EEC will know pretty quickly.
You can test the valve operation by attaching a hand vacuum pump to the valve and pump it down while the engine is idling. You can usually see the valve open up, and the exhaust gas fed into the engine should cause it to stall. (Of course, I don't really know where it is on those models that have it, so maybe you can't see it.)
If you don't have an EGR, then you need to check all the other things that 96 mentioned.
One of the side effects of retarding the timing is that the lost power goes into making more heat in the engine, which by itself can cause pre-ignition. So do keep your ears open for pinging even with the octane plug removed.
If the EGR is not activating, that will cause exactly the symptoms you mentioned; detonation under load, and when engine is warm. However, MOST failures of the EGR will trigger a trouble code that will be stored in the EEC. The EGR valve has a sensor that measures its position (EVP), so if its vacuum source has failed, or its valve is stuck, the EEC will know pretty quickly.
You can test the valve operation by attaching a hand vacuum pump to the valve and pump it down while the engine is idling. You can usually see the valve open up, and the exhaust gas fed into the engine should cause it to stall. (Of course, I don't really know where it is on those models that have it, so maybe you can't see it.)
If you don't have an EGR, then you need to check all the other things that 96 mentioned.
One of the side effects of retarding the timing is that the lost power goes into making more heat in the engine, which by itself can cause pre-ignition. So do keep your ears open for pinging even with the octane plug removed.
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From: Wichita
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Postmaster
Joined: Sep 2003
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From: Southern California
Hi dkoeh:
Welcome to our FTE forum
These guys are giving you all the things I could think of, but I would like to add one more thing. Check the vacuum line to the modulator for tranny fluid. If it's there, you are sucking tranny fluid into the engine causing it to ping under heavy load.
Welcome to our FTE forum
These guys are giving you all the things I could think of, but I would like to add one more thing. Check the vacuum line to the modulator for tranny fluid. If it's there, you are sucking tranny fluid into the engine causing it to ping under heavy load.
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New User
Joined: Mar 2006
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From: Depew, NY
Copper : I did pull hose to ck out after I read it in previous thread. No fluid.
aerocolorado : I have a new set of wires sitting next to the new set of plugs in the back of van. Just working up ambition to do them on the 4.0. I've done the 3.0 & that was a real riot. But now that I've had the 4.0 in the air, 5 plugs look better from under side & 1 from wheel well. guess wires will be interesting.
Thank you Both!
aerocolorado : I have a new set of wires sitting next to the new set of plugs in the back of van. Just working up ambition to do them on the 4.0. I've done the 3.0 & that was a real riot. But now that I've had the 4.0 in the air, 5 plugs look better from under side & 1 from wheel well. guess wires will be interesting.
Thank you Both!
Postmaster
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 4,452
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From: Southern California
Originally Posted by B-Aerostar
My pinging has stopped after changing the modulator. I also just hit the magic mark of 250,000 miles. Will be doing the front axles soon because of the chatter or clicking sounds when I turn
When you do the front axle, I suggest changing at least the outer bearings and seals. The bearings on my van were really worn out even after only 73K miles, and that was the source of my clicking noise.