Rebuilt 4R100 overheating!!
Senior User
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 371
Likes: 0
Originally Posted by Casey
It isn't a thermal bypass. It's a pressure bypass. It is a ball and a spring. If the pressure in to the cooler gets too high, like from a plugged cooler, the bypass opens to keep oil flowing to the rear line. The rear line supplies lube oil to the rear half of the trans.
They do stick open sometimes.
They do stick open sometimes.
Warren
Senior User
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 371
Likes: 0
Originally Posted by forddork
the proper time and amount recomended by ford is to run the truck for 15 sec you should get at least 32 oz. of fluid.
Warren
Thread Starter
|
Freshman User
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 32
Likes: 0
Warren, I did the test and the bypass valve is failing, it is stuck wide open. Looks and fells like spring is broke.
I want to thank everyone that posted, you have all been a great help.
I am very upset that my trans guy that was highly reccomended did not discover this problem. Last time I took it in he said he was going to do a flow test, I guess he didn't because I had almost no fluid traveling through coolers. How much damage occurred by running trans to 250 for several weeks? His warranty is for 12k miles I have about 5k on it now. What should I ask of him?
Thanks again guys,
Scott
BTW I just pinched bypass line shut for now and will replace valve tomorrow
I want to thank everyone that posted, you have all been a great help.
I am very upset that my trans guy that was highly reccomended did not discover this problem. Last time I took it in he said he was going to do a flow test, I guess he didn't because I had almost no fluid traveling through coolers. How much damage occurred by running trans to 250 for several weeks? His warranty is for 12k miles I have about 5k on it now. What should I ask of him?
Thanks again guys,
Scott
BTW I just pinched bypass line shut for now and will replace valve tomorrow
Thread Starter
|
Freshman User
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 32
Likes: 0
Okay guys,
I did the test and it failed, bypass is wide open, almost no fluid to coolers.
I pinched bypass line shut and will replace tomorrow. I am expecting to run at about 210 max tomorrow better than the 250+ I have been seeing.
I am very upset that my trans guy did not come up with this solution, I even asked him last week about the bypass and he didn't even repond to the possibilty. How much damage occurred by running at those temps for several weeks. What should I ask of him? Last time he had it he said he would run a flow test, either he did not remember or he lied as almost no fluid was going thru coolers.
I am very upset with this shop an to make it worse he is out of town until next week.
His warranty is 12k I have about 5k on it now?
Again what would be fair for me to ask for? I have taken it back twice called several other times only to be told "everything is okay"
Anyways, thanks to all involved, would not have found problem without this forum.
Scott
I did the test and it failed, bypass is wide open, almost no fluid to coolers.
I pinched bypass line shut and will replace tomorrow. I am expecting to run at about 210 max tomorrow better than the 250+ I have been seeing.
I am very upset that my trans guy did not come up with this solution, I even asked him last week about the bypass and he didn't even repond to the possibilty. How much damage occurred by running at those temps for several weeks. What should I ask of him? Last time he had it he said he would run a flow test, either he did not remember or he lied as almost no fluid was going thru coolers.
I am very upset with this shop an to make it worse he is out of town until next week.
His warranty is 12k I have about 5k on it now?
Again what would be fair for me to ask for? I have taken it back twice called several other times only to be told "everything is okay"
Anyways, thanks to all involved, would not have found problem without this forum.
Scott
Thread Starter
|
Freshman User
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 32
Likes: 0
FTE Stories
Ford Trucks for Ford Truck Enthusiasts
10 Things Every Truck Owner NEEDS (2026 Edition)
Michael S. Palmer
Rezvani's Latest Post-Apocalyptic Monster Is a Ford F-150 Raptor Underneath
Verdad Gallardo
Top 10 Most Expensive Ford Trucks Ever Sold on Bring a Trailer
Joe Kucinski
2027 Ford Super Duty Buyer's Guide (Every Model, Engine, & Package)
Brett Foote
Top 10 Ford Truck Tragedies
Joe Kucinski
AEV FXL Super Duty - the Super Duty Raptor Ford Doesn't Make
Brett Foote
Lobo Vs Lobo: Proof the F-150 Lobo Should Be Even Lower!
Michael S. Palmer
Ford's 2001 Explorer Sportsman Concept Looks For a New Home
Verdad Gallardo
10 Best Ford Truck Engines We Miss the Most!
Joe Kucinski
Senior User
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 371
Likes: 0
Originally Posted by scottnofx
Okay guys,
I did the test and it failed, bypass is wide open, almost no fluid to coolers.
I pinched bypass line shut and will replace tomorrow. I am expecting to run at about 210 max tomorrow better than the 250+ I have been seeing.
I am very upset that my trans guy did not come up with this solution, I even asked him last week about the bypass and he didn't even repond to the possibilty. How much damage occurred by running at those temps for several weeks. What should I ask of him? Last time he had it he said he would run a flow test, either he did not remember or he lied as almost no fluid was going thru coolers.
I am very upset with this shop an to make it worse he is out of town until next week.
His warranty is 12k I have about 5k on it now?
Again what would be fair for me to ask for? I have taken it back twice called several other times only to be told "everything is okay"
Anyways, thanks to all involved, would not have found problem without this forum.
Scott
I did the test and it failed, bypass is wide open, almost no fluid to coolers.
I pinched bypass line shut and will replace tomorrow. I am expecting to run at about 210 max tomorrow better than the 250+ I have been seeing.
I am very upset that my trans guy did not come up with this solution, I even asked him last week about the bypass and he didn't even repond to the possibilty. How much damage occurred by running at those temps for several weeks. What should I ask of him? Last time he had it he said he would run a flow test, either he did not remember or he lied as almost no fluid was going thru coolers.
I am very upset with this shop an to make it worse he is out of town until next week.
His warranty is 12k I have about 5k on it now?
Again what would be fair for me to ask for? I have taken it back twice called several other times only to be told "everything is okay"
Anyways, thanks to all involved, would not have found problem without this forum.
Scott
Sorry for the delay. Been out of town.
First, the tranny guy has to admit he was wrong.
Second, have him immediately change out the fluid again; what you have is damaged. Make sure he gets the fluid out of the torque converter. This is on him.
Third, go looking for a competent tranny shop, even if it is a ford dealer. Tell them whole story and ask them to evaluate tranny system. If it is mechanically damaged, get it in writing, then get 1st shop to agree to install rebuilt tranny at no cost. Do not let them repair it; they are incompetent.
Finally 200+ is still too hot. Do the flow test again and verify enough flow as per ford in earlier post. If fails, you have a partially plugged cooler; find and clear or replace. If passes, you may need to add a Tru-cool cooler.
Good Luck
Warren
Senior User
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 371
Likes: 0
Originally Posted by scottnofx
**Also posted in Clutch, Transmission forum**
Okay guys,
I own a 2003 f-550 crewcab 7.3 PS, 4r100, 4.88, Gear Vendor with an 11' service bed and HD rack. With tools, my truck weighs in about 12,500 lbs.
I drive up a grade everyday back from the Palm Springs area (very hot).
When the truck was new I put a trans temp gauge in and it would peak at about 225 during the summer. I then installed a deep Mag pan and cooler with a fan. The max temp seemed to drop about 20 degrees, awesome!
At 33k Ford found overdrive slip codes, and rebuilt tranny for free (lucky me) still no problems.
At about 65k I had trans flushed and requested the correct fluid (Mercon V or Mercon, can't at the moment remember which is correct)My truck seemd to run abut 20 degrees hotter after being flushed. I found out they used a bulk fluid with additives that were supposed to equal the "wrong Mercon fluid"
I took it back, they then flushed it with the correct Mercon, tranny still ran hotter than before.
At 70k the truck was getting a bad vibration and growl on the freeway, (possible U-joint), By the time I got back it was blowing fluid. I had a local transmission shop (highly recommended) rebuild it with a shift kit and a heavy duty TC installed. The trans body had been cracked so it was also replaced (crack was so hairline they actually rebuilt trans before finding crack and then had to replaced body.
On the road I felt a slight shudder, then a vibration. The shop then replaced a U-joint and that corrected problem. Still can't stop thinking that a U-joint cost me about $3300.00 (U-joint killed tranny?)
The rebuilt trans works fine (fine for a soft shifting, gear changing, TC unlocking 4r100, just like the stock trans)
It does run hot though, I am reaching temps of 245 to 250 at the end of that long grade (outside temp is 112-120+).
It also takes a long time to for trans cool down (maybe 15 degrees after a 10 minute decent)
Trans guy checked fluid, said it looks fine, agrees that is hot, but assured me that the temp gauge was in the hottest location and that everything was fine.
I do trust the tranny guy, he seems very professional.
Truck also seems too shift funny (shifts too soon, maybe slip?) after trans is hot
What do you think?
Why is it running hotter than stock trans.
I do run double overdrive on grade, but I always did.
Tranny also seems to take longer to shift into reverse ( is that becuase of the new Heavy Duty TC?)
Sorry for the book, but thought I should tell all if I am asking for complete answers.
Thanks to all
Scott
Okay guys,
I own a 2003 f-550 crewcab 7.3 PS, 4r100, 4.88, Gear Vendor with an 11' service bed and HD rack. With tools, my truck weighs in about 12,500 lbs.
I drive up a grade everyday back from the Palm Springs area (very hot).
When the truck was new I put a trans temp gauge in and it would peak at about 225 during the summer. I then installed a deep Mag pan and cooler with a fan. The max temp seemed to drop about 20 degrees, awesome!
At 33k Ford found overdrive slip codes, and rebuilt tranny for free (lucky me) still no problems.
At about 65k I had trans flushed and requested the correct fluid (Mercon V or Mercon, can't at the moment remember which is correct)My truck seemd to run abut 20 degrees hotter after being flushed. I found out they used a bulk fluid with additives that were supposed to equal the "wrong Mercon fluid"
I took it back, they then flushed it with the correct Mercon, tranny still ran hotter than before.
At 70k the truck was getting a bad vibration and growl on the freeway, (possible U-joint), By the time I got back it was blowing fluid. I had a local transmission shop (highly recommended) rebuild it with a shift kit and a heavy duty TC installed. The trans body had been cracked so it was also replaced (crack was so hairline they actually rebuilt trans before finding crack and then had to replaced body.
On the road I felt a slight shudder, then a vibration. The shop then replaced a U-joint and that corrected problem. Still can't stop thinking that a U-joint cost me about $3300.00 (U-joint killed tranny?)
The rebuilt trans works fine (fine for a soft shifting, gear changing, TC unlocking 4r100, just like the stock trans)
It does run hot though, I am reaching temps of 245 to 250 at the end of that long grade (outside temp is 112-120+).
It also takes a long time to for trans cool down (maybe 15 degrees after a 10 minute decent)
Trans guy checked fluid, said it looks fine, agrees that is hot, but assured me that the temp gauge was in the hottest location and that everything was fine.
I do trust the tranny guy, he seems very professional.
Truck also seems too shift funny (shifts too soon, maybe slip?) after trans is hot
What do you think?
Why is it running hotter than stock trans.
I do run double overdrive on grade, but I always did.
Tranny also seems to take longer to shift into reverse ( is that becuase of the new Heavy Duty TC?)
Sorry for the book, but thought I should tell all if I am asking for complete answers.
Thanks to all
Scott
I went back and reviewed your original post (above). I believe the flushing at 65K and the rebuilding at 70k may well have flushed debris into your coolers and partially plugged them. You need to repeat the flow test after replacing the bypass.
The other possibility is that your radiator fan clutch, or the serpentine belt tensioner, is bad, so the fan is not adequately cooling the radiator. Remember, the first tranny fiuid cooler is in the bottom radiator tank which will get pretty hot up that grade. What can fool you is that the engine coolant temperature guage is controlled by the computer, and is set to stay at mid-range on the guage until the radiator temp gets to maybe 220, then the computer sends the guage up to hot. If the radiator is that hot, the tranny fluid coming out of that first cooler will be at least that hot, and the second cooler is pretty small and may not cool it down enough.
You could have Ford check out the fan clutch, serpentine belt and tensioner. There is a technical service bulletin on the subject you should remind them of, and a replacement kit which they would install under warranty. A clue if you noticed is that you can hear the fan clutch cycling every few seconds when pulling up the grade hot.
Good Luck and keep us informed.
Warren
Ps: I towed this weekend, 12000 lb trailer. Tranny temp never exceeded 180, and there is one tough grade. Tranny temp runs about 55 above outside air temp towing on freeway 60mph, fairly level. got to 110 above at the very maximum, outside was 75, tranny about 180. The hottest in general occured in the city after being on the highway; stop and go, not much chance for the fan and coolers to work. Tranny cools down 20 or so in 5 minutes after stopping.
I have 3 tranny coolers, the 3rd one a Tru-cool 40,000 lb without the bypass.
Thread Starter
|
Freshman User
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 32
Likes: 0
Thanks Warren,
actually I do have the belt issue, it does cycle when AC is on and climbing a grade. I wil check with Ford on trans condition and serpintine belt.
thanks again, you have been a great help.
scott
actually I do have the belt issue, it does cycle when AC is on and climbing a grade. I wil check with Ford on trans condition and serpintine belt.
thanks again, you have been a great help.
scott
Thread Starter
|
Freshman User
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 32
Likes: 0
bypass
Should I install a new bypass valve? Right now I just have it pinched off. Should I omit it altogether? I will check flow test again, but last time it checked out fine after I pinched bypass line.
Do you think Ford dealer will find anything as far as tranny damage?
scott
Do you think Ford dealer will find anything as far as tranny damage?
scott