burning oil
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burning oil
I have a question about a pickup I bought about a month ago. I only paid $50 for it so this does not get me to bad.
I know this is a Ford site too. But an engine is an engine.
I have a 84 Dodge with a 225 slant six.
I will burn about four quarts of oil each tank of gas.
It smoke constantly, while it isn't to bad until you sit for a while or rev it, it smokes from startup to shut down. That leads me to think that it would be the piston rings. I don't think it is the valve guides (may be part) because it is no worse at start up then shut down after it is warmed up and has been running. What I am confused about is that I don't see any oil under it, (parked in the same spot every night) Their is no oil in the coolant, and I have been driving it for about a month, not every day. Would the spark plugs be able to fire if it was the rings? I have not had to change them yet? I want to try to fix this as cheap as possible. But I have no idea what it would be. My thought would be the rings are bad but the oil isn't getting high enough to foul the plugs. They are getting bad though. Covered in white deposits.
Just curious to know if anyone has had a similar problem or could give a possible diagnosis.
Thank You
Joe
I know this is a Ford site too. But an engine is an engine.
I have a 84 Dodge with a 225 slant six.
I will burn about four quarts of oil each tank of gas.
It smoke constantly, while it isn't to bad until you sit for a while or rev it, it smokes from startup to shut down. That leads me to think that it would be the piston rings. I don't think it is the valve guides (may be part) because it is no worse at start up then shut down after it is warmed up and has been running. What I am confused about is that I don't see any oil under it, (parked in the same spot every night) Their is no oil in the coolant, and I have been driving it for about a month, not every day. Would the spark plugs be able to fire if it was the rings? I have not had to change them yet? I want to try to fix this as cheap as possible. But I have no idea what it would be. My thought would be the rings are bad but the oil isn't getting high enough to foul the plugs. They are getting bad though. Covered in white deposits.
Just curious to know if anyone has had a similar problem or could give a possible diagnosis.
Thank You
Joe
Fleet Owner
Joined: Jul 2004
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From: NM
I would say you're right, it's rings. Usually when the valve guides are bad, you get spark plug fouling (because the oil goes into the cylinder as droplets). I doubt you are burning 4 qts in a tank tho (is this a 20 gal +/- tank? or some big 34 gallon tank?). A single qt in 500 miles is a major mosquito fogger, 4 qts per 200 miles (tankful) is a leak, almost certainly. I don't think it would even fire the plugs at that rate.
White deposits are usually gas, maybe you are just running way too rich? washing oil off the cylinders (which may be why the rings are bad?)
White deposits are usually gas, maybe you are just running way too rich? washing oil off the cylinders (which may be why the rings are bad?)
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What do you mean when you say washing oil off the cylinders? I haven't heard that yet.
It is a 20 gal tank. I would say it is leaking too. But their is no oil on it, and nothing running off of the engine. A little moist, but not enough to lose that much.
That is why I am so confused.
I think the rings may be bad because it sat for the years, then I put a battery and gas in it. Wouldn't you know it started. 3 or 4 time. But it did. I think it may have had some rust in the cylinders. 3 years is a long time.
It is a 20 gal tank. I would say it is leaking too. But their is no oil on it, and nothing running off of the engine. A little moist, but not enough to lose that much.
That is why I am so confused.
I think the rings may be bad because it sat for the years, then I put a battery and gas in it. Wouldn't you know it started. 3 or 4 time. But it did. I think it may have had some rust in the cylinders. 3 years is a long time.
Postmaster
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 4,190
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From: Riverside, So Cal
Joe -
Your truck's story is a puzzler. As Albuq said - that's a LOT of oil. I once had a car that went trhough oil like that, but the rear main seal was shot and it LEAKED that much out. Burning that much seems like it would foul the plugs for sure.
The best test I know to find out if the problem is rings (most likely) or valve guides/seals is to do a compression check, then squirt some oil in the hole and compression test it again. If the second reading is higher, the oil has temporarily sealed the leaky ring. If it is the same, the problem is valve guides/seals.
Good luck.
Your truck's story is a puzzler. As Albuq said - that's a LOT of oil. I once had a car that went trhough oil like that, but the rear main seal was shot and it LEAKED that much out. Burning that much seems like it would foul the plugs for sure.
The best test I know to find out if the problem is rings (most likely) or valve guides/seals is to do a compression check, then squirt some oil in the hole and compression test it again. If the second reading is higher, the oil has temporarily sealed the leaky ring. If it is the same, the problem is valve guides/seals.
Good luck.
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Thank you
I appreciate your imput.
I will say this, I am a mech, ( in the Army, little bit different than civilan world, but I am learning) and like Albuq said he agreed with me that makes sense, and you saying a compression test, (don't get me wrong) I will not argue with hearing something like that twice, lets you know it works. I like to have a lot of imput. Kinda like the old saying two heads are better than one, and I am a firm beliver in that. And I do agree it sound unreal to burn that much oil, It may be leaking but if it is I have absolutley no idea where it is going.
Like I said I am still learning, espcially the older Fords like my 49. I wish I could do more to that right now. But money is a little tight at the moment and I have no place to keep it here so it is 445 miles away in my parents back yard. I am supposed to be going to Iraq sometime. But when I get back it's on.
Anyway thank you for your imput I apreciate it all weather repeat info or not.
I appreciate your imput.
I will say this, I am a mech, ( in the Army, little bit different than civilan world, but I am learning) and like Albuq said he agreed with me that makes sense, and you saying a compression test, (don't get me wrong) I will not argue with hearing something like that twice, lets you know it works. I like to have a lot of imput. Kinda like the old saying two heads are better than one, and I am a firm beliver in that. And I do agree it sound unreal to burn that much oil, It may be leaking but if it is I have absolutley no idea where it is going.
Like I said I am still learning, espcially the older Fords like my 49. I wish I could do more to that right now. But money is a little tight at the moment and I have no place to keep it here so it is 445 miles away in my parents back yard. I am supposed to be going to Iraq sometime. But when I get back it's on.
Anyway thank you for your imput I apreciate it all weather repeat info or not.
Fleet Owner
Joined: Sep 2005
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From: Lake Tahoe, Nevada
In addition to the above advice about the wet-dry compression/leakdown test, I would suggest that you change the PCV valve pronto. This could account for some of the oil disappearance.
Post Fiend
Joined: Mar 2004
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From: San Francisco, Ca.
kcb37, I had a '65 Dart with 225 slant six with a bad rear main leak, but it wasn't as bad as your truck.
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Fleet Owner
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From: NM
If your carb is dumping large quantities of gas into the cylinders, it will actually thin the oil on the cylinder surfaces enough to burn it off. The rings then run dry and wear quicker. If I recall, MoPars of the period used Carter carbs with metering rods? I wonder if the pistons that operate the rods are stuck or leaking, making the mixture really rich.
To give you some perspective on this consumption; a firend of mine in high school installed new rings upside-down in a Chev 235 6-holer. So the rings were actually pumping oil up into the combustion chamber. This produced huge amounts of smoke, but it only burned a qt in 1,000 miles. I question your 4 qts/tank -- maybe it is just a fluke?
To give you some perspective on this consumption; a firend of mine in high school installed new rings upside-down in a Chev 235 6-holer. So the rings were actually pumping oil up into the combustion chamber. This produced huge amounts of smoke, but it only burned a qt in 1,000 miles. I question your 4 qts/tank -- maybe it is just a fluke?
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Brett Foote
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From: Augusta, ME
Does the engine have a remote oil cooler on it by any chance? I'm wondering if there is an oil line with a pinhole or a crack that is only leaking when you're driving, with the engine at higher rpm's and oil pressure higher than idle? Just a thought.
Scott
Scott
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From: Seattle WA.
I once bought an engine that had the oil control rings seized to the pistons. I pulled the pistons soaked them in Marvel Mistery oil and got them freed up. Put the engine back together and it ran great for as long as I had it.
Rod 51F1
Rod 51F1
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When I got it I chaged oil,air, breather, and fuel filters, oil, and pcv valve.
The smoke is blue.
I do need to look to see if it has a remote cooler, having a pin hole would be a very good explination. But I don't think it does.
I will try to do a comppression check this weekend and see how it does.
I really don't know what else it could be.
The smoke is blue.
I do need to look to see if it has a remote cooler, having a pin hole would be a very good explination. But I don't think it does.
I will try to do a comppression check this weekend and see how it does.
I really don't know what else it could be.
