Why is Everything Auto These Days?
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Junior User
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 52
Likes: 1
Why is Everything Auto These Days?
I've found it pretty much impossible to get a diesel SD type pickup with a manual trans. If I can, it's an old model or it's a base model stripped out work truck.
Are the days of the manual trans essentially gone? I find it hard to believe given manuals are very much the standard in the heavy truck game. I really want the control of manual for off road work and better control when towing etc.
Take a look at our Aussie big car range - tow capacity for a manual is something like 2500lbs and the auto is double that at 4900lbs.
Are the days of the manual trans essentially gone? I find it hard to believe given manuals are very much the standard in the heavy truck game. I really want the control of manual for off road work and better control when towing etc.
Take a look at our Aussie big car range - tow capacity for a manual is something like 2500lbs and the auto is double that at 4900lbs.
Senior User
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 420
Likes: 0
From: Ohio
Though I am not sure, I have a funny feeling this has more to do with meeting emmissions, and so forth, than with anything else.
With electronic auto trannie and electronic engine controls, the ability of (any) manufacturer to achieve DOT and EPA requirements got MUCH easier.
My '03 SD (5.4 gasser) would shift 3-4 times upon gently flooring it at about 30mph on its way to 70 mph. The needle stayed between 1900-2300 rpm the whole time.
A buddy if mine that works at Ford indicated that the transmission map is taylored for EPA and DOT compliance, not, necessarily performance --- hence the aftermarket chip industry.
Many of the chips hit the transmission map more than the engine map. The engine is fine, just muffled by the trannie.
??
With electronic auto trannie and electronic engine controls, the ability of (any) manufacturer to achieve DOT and EPA requirements got MUCH easier.
My '03 SD (5.4 gasser) would shift 3-4 times upon gently flooring it at about 30mph on its way to 70 mph. The needle stayed between 1900-2300 rpm the whole time.
A buddy if mine that works at Ford indicated that the transmission map is taylored for EPA and DOT compliance, not, necessarily performance --- hence the aftermarket chip industry.
Many of the chips hit the transmission map more than the engine map. The engine is fine, just muffled by the trannie.
??
Elder User
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 626
Likes: 0
From: Orange Park, FL
This is just my opinion, but to me it seems like they stock the Dealer Lot they get only Automatics because the Torqshift is like an additional $1,800 option they can charge the customer. The other reason is a majority of buyers want an auto. I could not find a manual on a lot that had more than 40 SD PSD. So I ordered one...
Laughing Gas
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 858
Likes: 0
From: VA
.....the reason for more autos than manuals.....gotta have that right hand free to play with the 6-disc changer, the navagtion system, the moon room, the rear slider, the indash or overhead dvd player, ect, ect, ect. You can't shift and push all those buttons at the same time......
....oh year and the programmer to, that darn stick in the way can be a real hassle........lol
....oh year and the programmer to, that darn stick in the way can be a real hassle........lol
Postmaster
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 4,968
Likes: 3
From: So Cal
People are buying more autos than sticks. The manufacturers go where the money is.
I read a couple years back that the percentage of sticks is down around 5% of all vehicles sold now and most of the sticks were in low end vehicles. I don't think the diesels are anywhere near low end so that is probably why you don't see them much.
There is also probably some truth to the emissions claim. The manufacturers are trying as much as possible to remove the human from the equation. The computer can get lower emissions and better mileage than the human so better to let the computer do it. Least that is my thinking on it. Not that I like it.
Most of my cars thru 33+ years of driving have been stick, but the last 3 have been auto and of those, 2 did not have a stick option at all.
Just market economics. The mfgs build what they think the public will buy, and at least over the past 30 or so years, the public has migrated away from sticks.
Jim Henderson
I read a couple years back that the percentage of sticks is down around 5% of all vehicles sold now and most of the sticks were in low end vehicles. I don't think the diesels are anywhere near low end so that is probably why you don't see them much.
There is also probably some truth to the emissions claim. The manufacturers are trying as much as possible to remove the human from the equation. The computer can get lower emissions and better mileage than the human so better to let the computer do it. Least that is my thinking on it. Not that I like it.
Most of my cars thru 33+ years of driving have been stick, but the last 3 have been auto and of those, 2 did not have a stick option at all.
Just market economics. The mfgs build what they think the public will buy, and at least over the past 30 or so years, the public has migrated away from sticks.
Jim Henderson
Senior User
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 253
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From: Northwest OH
Sticks are more work than the average person (Especially in heavy traffic) wants to do. If I had the option, with all other things being equal, I would buy the automatic. I currently own a 6sp manual mind you - but it was on the only truck in its price (Good) & mileage (low) range. I am really happy with the mileage, too. I average 17.6+ mpg (Calculated) IN TOWN in my 99 SD Diesel! My previous 99 SD Diesel (Automatic) averaged in the ballpark of 13.5-14 mpg around town. The manual has its benefits and is much better for towing IMO, but the Auto is easier as a daily driver.
If you are looking new & really want your manual tranny, ORDER ONE!
If you are looking new & really want your manual tranny, ORDER ONE!
Elder User
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 853
Likes: 0
From: northern,california
Here in northern California the farmers and country boys like the sticks. So it wasn't to hard to find one to test drive. I then went to my fleet dealer and ordered one just the way I wanted it. He was from the city so he kept asking me if I was sure I wanted a stick. He said it would be nearly impossible to sell it off the lot. Everyone wants the auto. He also said 90% of drivers do not know how to drive a stick. One problem with sticks is driver error. With the auto you just press and go.
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Posting Guru
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 2,220
Likes: 2
From: CA
Originally Posted by Aussie Pete
I've found it pretty much impossible to get a diesel SD type pickup with a manual trans. If I can, it's an old model or it's a base model stripped out work truck.
Are the days of the manual trans essentially gone? I find it hard to believe given manuals are very much the standard in the heavy truck game. I really want the control of manual for off road work and better control when towing etc.
Take a look at our Aussie big car range - tow capacity for a manual is something like 2500lbs and the auto is double that at 4900lbs.
Are the days of the manual trans essentially gone? I find it hard to believe given manuals are very much the standard in the heavy truck game. I really want the control of manual for off road work and better control when towing etc.
Take a look at our Aussie big car range - tow capacity for a manual is something like 2500lbs and the auto is double that at 4900lbs.
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More Turbo
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 601
Likes: 86
From: Colorado Springs, CO
All 4 F-350s I own are 5-speeds. Granted they are older (1992-1997 style) but in my opinion they are way nicer. I drive in the city all the time, it is a little bit of a hassel, BUT ITS NOT THAT BAD!
One of my four trucks used to be an auto, but I converted it when the old auto burnt up.
I honestly got about 4-5mpg better, so I am happy. I don't like Fords auto, It has reliability issues, (I dont know about 1999-newer) but it seems that when they go, THATS IT. Then your out $900-$1500 and your fixed.
That is also the reason I converted mine was the cost to fix the auto. I completely converted mine for $800 with a low miles used 5-speed, much salvage parts (pedal cage, new clutch kit, crossmsmber, new driveshafts exc.....)
So needless to say, when/if I can ever afford a new '07 Superduty, it will be a
6-speed.
Just my $0.02 worth............
One of my four trucks used to be an auto, but I converted it when the old auto burnt up.
I honestly got about 4-5mpg better, so I am happy. I don't like Fords auto, It has reliability issues, (I dont know about 1999-newer) but it seems that when they go, THATS IT. Then your out $900-$1500 and your fixed.
That is also the reason I converted mine was the cost to fix the auto. I completely converted mine for $800 with a low miles used 5-speed, much salvage parts (pedal cage, new clutch kit, crossmsmber, new driveshafts exc.....)
So needless to say, when/if I can ever afford a new '07 Superduty, it will be a
6-speed.
Just my $0.02 worth............
Logistics Pro
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 4,221
Likes: 3
When I was looking for my truck (looking to buy used), I found this one that was everything I wanted except it was an auto tranny. Felt I couldn't pass it up so I bought it, but still wish it was a manual tranny sometimes.
Down the road if/when I ever buy a new truck and am able to order, I'll be getting a manual. Nothing quite like shifting your own gears.
Down the road if/when I ever buy a new truck and am able to order, I'll be getting a manual. Nothing quite like shifting your own gears.
Thread Starter
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Junior User
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 52
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It's interesting still. In Australia the Right Hand Drive thing kills the stick because the RH floor shape inhibits the clutch pedal so apparently it can't be done. Sad.
As for why people go auto I can't understand all this concern over economy when people say "I have my SD with a V8 TD and it's getting 13mpg..." when it is a proven fact stick is a HUGE benefit in economy on a TD.
I guess we get lazier every year we inhabit this earth....
As for why people go auto I can't understand all this concern over economy when people say "I have my SD with a V8 TD and it's getting 13mpg..." when it is a proven fact stick is a HUGE benefit in economy on a TD.
I guess we get lazier every year we inhabit this earth....
FTE Leadership Emeritus
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 18,787
Likes: 30
From: Melbourne, Aus
It's interesting still. In Australia the Right Hand Drive thing kills the stick because the RH floor shape inhibits the clutch pedal so apparently it can't be done. Sad.
??? You can get the Brazilian built models WITH a stick... Mine had one...
??? You can get the Brazilian built models WITH a stick... Mine had one...
Posting Guru
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 1,736
Likes: 1
From: Monroe, MI
I think it is laziness and convience. Not to mention everyone is fiddling with their hands cell phones, cd, dvd etc. I like the stick but dont want the hole in the floor keeping me from stretching out my legs on long trips.
Fleet Mechanic
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 1,815
Likes: 24
From: Houston
Originally Posted by Dsl Lover
Sticks are more work than the average person (Especially in heavy traffic) wants to do.