Heavy Scale - spa problem
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From: Racine county, WI
Heavy Scale - spa problem
All summer long I use the hot tub on the deck. I've had hard water to fill it and this year that problem should be fixed. I've used the testers, keep it in range and I still always end up with HARD scale in areas. Last year I used a scale reducer and it helped some but when I went to remove last years scale today so I can fill the tub and start using it I found myself having a real hard time. Several soakings of CLR wouldn't even budge the stuff. The only thing that worked was a scotch brite pad and the little I did was obviously hurting the tubs coating.
Anybody ever deal with this before? Any ideas other then CLR, abrasives and power washing (tried that too). Thanks
Anybody ever deal with this before? Any ideas other then CLR, abrasives and power washing (tried that too). Thanks
Post Fiend
Joined: Jun 2003
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What is your PH, Total Alkalinity, Calcium Hardness, and Water Temperature? (You cannot get TA, and CH without a more comprehensive water test kit.) Bottom line is that the PH of saturation differs depending on water temperature. Also, are you using the strips or titration (drops)?
Finally, if you are scaling, PH is too high, caused by high Calcium Hardness as evidenced by high TA. Acid is your friend.
Finally, if you are scaling, PH is too high, caused by high Calcium Hardness as evidenced by high TA. Acid is your friend.
Hotshot
Joined: Apr 2004
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From: NW burbs of chicago
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From: Racine county, WI
Originally Posted by hkiefus
What is your PH, Total Alkalinity, Calcium Hardness, and Water Temperature? (You cannot get TA, and CH without a more comprehensive water test kit.) Bottom line is that the PH of saturation differs depending on water temperature. Also, are you using the strips or titration (drops)?
Finally, if you are scaling, PH is too high, caused by high Calcium Hardness as evidenced by high TA. Acid is your friend.
Finally, if you are scaling, PH is too high, caused by high Calcium Hardness as evidenced by high TA. Acid is your friend.
So I have a tester that uses drops but I've only been using the CL part of it. I guess then new questions are 1) Do I need to start testing for TA and CH along with Ph and CL? 2) Sounds like I need acid, do I still use CL with the acid? 3) Any ideas how to get the concrete like scale off the tub now or should I just fill it and let the acid or other chemicals get rid of it?
Thanks a ton for the help. Looks like I have a lot to learn.
Originally Posted by jake00
we use this product with good results
http://www.focuspools.com/products/R...PA-METAL-X.asp
http://www.focuspools.com/products/R...PA-METAL-X.asp
Jäger
Joined: Jan 2005
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From: Northern Arizona
OS, are you using Chlorine tablets, granular or liquid? Liquid chlorine has a very high pH (approx 13) granular is close to neutral (around 7.2) and tabs are more acidic (around 3 to 4). This will affect your pH greatly in a spa.
Sounds like the water in your area is 'hard' so proper balance will certainly help. If there's a Leslie's Pool Supply in your area, they can test your water for free including calcium hardness and total dissolved solids. I would guess the water in your area is 'hard' right out of the faucet.
Sounds like the water in your area is 'hard' so proper balance will certainly help. If there's a Leslie's Pool Supply in your area, they can test your water for free including calcium hardness and total dissolved solids. I would guess the water in your area is 'hard' right out of the faucet.
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From: Racine county, WI
Originally Posted by Kepler4
OS, are you using Chlorine tablets, granular or liquid? Liquid chlorine has a very high pH (approx 13) granular is close to neutral (around 7.2) and tabs are more acidic (around 3 to 4). This will affect your pH greatly in a spa.
Sounds like the water in your area is 'hard' so proper balance will certainly help. If there's a Leslie's Pool Supply in your area, they can test your water for free including calcium hardness and total dissolved solids. I would guess the water in your area is 'hard' right out of the faucet.
Sounds like the water in your area is 'hard' so proper balance will certainly help. If there's a Leslie's Pool Supply in your area, they can test your water for free including calcium hardness and total dissolved solids. I would guess the water in your area is 'hard' right out of the faucet.
Postmaster
Joined: Mar 2001
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From: So Cal
We had a spa in a very hard water area, including iron, yuck. I never had problems with scale. I think this was because I cleaned out the spa 2 or 3 times a year and whenever I cleaned it out I waxed all surfaces with a good automotive wax with carnuba wax in it, not that silicone stuff.
I didn't use a lot of chemicals other than chlorine and sometimes baking soda(pH adjustment that is cheap). I did clean any scum up right away, easy with a shop rag, and cleaned the filter frequently, every week or so I think.
Don't know if this helped too but we often used spa oil which left the surfaces with a light coating of oil and smelled nice.
Doing all this, the insides of our spa always had a nice shine and the steel was polished too. Wasn't a lot of work, just a little here a little there.
Good Luck,
Jim Henderson
I didn't use a lot of chemicals other than chlorine and sometimes baking soda(pH adjustment that is cheap). I did clean any scum up right away, easy with a shop rag, and cleaned the filter frequently, every week or so I think.
Don't know if this helped too but we often used spa oil which left the surfaces with a light coating of oil and smelled nice.
Doing all this, the insides of our spa always had a nice shine and the steel was polished too. Wasn't a lot of work, just a little here a little there.
Good Luck,
Jim Henderson
Last edited by jim henderson; Apr 20, 2006 at 10:49 AM.
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Jäger
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 5,491
Likes: 5
From: Northern Arizona
Originally Posted by jim henderson
We had a spa in a very hard water area, including iron, yuck. I never had problems with scale. I think this was because I cleaned out the spa 2 or 3 times a year and whenever I cleaned it out I waxed all surfaces with a good automotive wax with carnuba wax in it, not that silicone stuff.
I didn't use a lot of chemicals other than chlorine and sometimes baking soda(pH adjustment that is cheap). I did clean any scum up right away, easy with a shop rag, and cleaned the filter frequently, every week or so I think.
Don't know if this helped too but we often used spa oil which left the surfaces with a light coating of oil and smelled nice.
Doing all this, the insides of our spa always had a nice shine and the steel was polished too. Wasn't a lot of work, just a little here a little there.
Good Luck,
Jim Henderson
I didn't use a lot of chemicals other than chlorine and sometimes baking soda(pH adjustment that is cheap). I did clean any scum up right away, easy with a shop rag, and cleaned the filter frequently, every week or so I think.
Don't know if this helped too but we often used spa oil which left the surfaces with a light coating of oil and smelled nice.
Doing all this, the insides of our spa always had a nice shine and the steel was polished too. Wasn't a lot of work, just a little here a little there.
Good Luck,
Jim Henderson
Good old Arm & Hammer baking soda will raise the pH just fine.
If you own a fiberglass gelcoat spa then you'll need to drain and wax it at least every 4 months. Acrylic spa surfaces are more tolerant of mineral buildup but it's still a pain to scrub it off. Minerals are much more likely to precipitate out in a spa than in a pool because of the higher temperatures.
I use Bromine tabs in a floater in my 450 gallon spa. Bromine is a little more expensive than chlorine but it's also a more effective sanitizer in hot water. Bromine tablets will also help to maintain the pH in the proper range, which is especially important with hard water. pH in the 7.4 to 7.6 range is perfect. Don't let any pool store clerks tell you that range is unsafe. 7.0 is neutral on the pH/Alkali scale, you want to maintain the pH balance just above neutral because the sanitizer will perform more effectively at the proper pH, 7.4 being ideal. If it's at 7.0 for a day or two it won't fry your spa heater element or burn your skin off!
I was in the pool and spa biz for many years so I'm happy to help if I can.
Russ
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