MORE HP! & Better Diff.
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Laughing Gas
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 794
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MORE HP! & Better Diff.
Imma die hard for man...
I have a 97 4x4offroad 4.6 w/ 185k miles
Still runs and operates like a champ!
My dad has a 2004 5.4 2wd f150 and let me just say that is one strooooong motor!
But the horse power is only 300...
And the 4.6 in 97 had 210 and now has 231...
I think chevy's 4.8 has like 285 or somethin and their 5.3 has 295 i think...
I have only drivin my dads 5.4 a little bit but it hasnt ever felt underpowerd when I have driven it.
But my 4.6 is EXTREMLEY! unerpowerd as big as my truck is w/ the 265x70x17 tires and rims and the 3.55 gears it is way toooo slow.
When can We expect to start seein some more horsepower from ford to compete w/ the 345 hemi?
Does anyone know if Ford has any plans for any type of Locking Differential?
I have a 97 4x4offroad 4.6 w/ 185k miles
Still runs and operates like a champ!
My dad has a 2004 5.4 2wd f150 and let me just say that is one strooooong motor!
But the horse power is only 300...
And the 4.6 in 97 had 210 and now has 231...
I think chevy's 4.8 has like 285 or somethin and their 5.3 has 295 i think...
I have only drivin my dads 5.4 a little bit but it hasnt ever felt underpowerd when I have driven it.
But my 4.6 is EXTREMLEY! unerpowerd as big as my truck is w/ the 265x70x17 tires and rims and the 3.55 gears it is way toooo slow.
When can We expect to start seein some more horsepower from ford to compete w/ the 345 hemi?
Does anyone know if Ford has any plans for any type of Locking Differential?
FTE Leadership Emeritus
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 42,561
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From: Long Island USA
Forget thinking about HP.
Look at the torque curves.
For any car, truck, motorcycle, you name it, the torque curve means more in terms of acceleration than any HP #.
Hemi's put out more HP than a 2-valve V10 - but guess who wins in a race even in a heavier truck?
The 5.4L seems stronger than your 4.6L because of the longer stroke - that helps torque over all RPMs.
(caveat: I now, motor spinup has a lot to do with acceleration too, but discussing that was out of the scope of this thread
)
art k.
Look at the torque curves.
For any car, truck, motorcycle, you name it, the torque curve means more in terms of acceleration than any HP #.
Hemi's put out more HP than a 2-valve V10 - but guess who wins in a race even in a heavier truck?
The 5.4L seems stronger than your 4.6L because of the longer stroke - that helps torque over all RPMs.
(caveat: I now, motor spinup has a lot to do with acceleration too, but discussing that was out of the scope of this thread
)art k.
Thread Starter
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Laughing Gas
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 794
Likes: 3
I understand torque and hp and how they relate.
I also understand why I can beat other trucks in a race ... until about 25 mph when their horsepower takes over and my 210 hp is left in the dust.
I have about the same torque as the chevy and dodge 4.8, and 4.7 in races I stay right with them until about 23 or 30 when their 70 or 80 more hp leaves me stranded.
I also understand why I can beat other trucks in a race ... until about 25 mph when their horsepower takes over and my 210 hp is left in the dust.
I have about the same torque as the chevy and dodge 4.8, and 4.7 in races I stay right with them until about 23 or 30 when their 70 or 80 more hp leaves me stranded.
FTE Leadership Emeritus
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 42,561
Likes: 421
From: Long Island USA
Originally Posted by zman764
I understand torque and hp and how they relate.
I also understand why I can beat other trucks in a race ... until about 25 mph when their horsepower takes over and my 210 hp is left in the dust.
I have about the same torque as the chevy and dodge 4.8, and 4.7 in races I stay right with them until about 23 or 30 when their 70 or 80 more hp leaves me stranded.
I also understand why I can beat other trucks in a race ... until about 25 mph when their horsepower takes over and my 210 hp is left in the dust.
I have about the same torque as the chevy and dodge 4.8, and 4.7 in races I stay right with them until about 23 or 30 when their 70 or 80 more hp leaves me stranded.
Again, look at the torque curve, the other motors carry the torque further up the RPM range...
I didn't mean you're wrong, I just mean that you have to look at more than peak HP numbers. HP is derived from RPM and torque. Peak HP only tells you when the torque falls off enough vs rising RPM
art k.
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Laughing Gas
Joined: Nov 2003
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Likes: 3
Yes I understand that also.
And the new 5.4 365 torque and 300 hp
compared to the
5.7 375 torque and 345 hp
...
I was mearly asking if there were any plans to try and compete in the hp market.
Yes I know there is more than hp when looking at engines.
365 is very respectable torque from that size engine.
And the new 5.4 365 torque and 300 hp
compared to the
5.7 375 torque and 345 hp
...
I was mearly asking if there were any plans to try and compete in the hp market.
Yes I know there is more than hp when looking at engines.
365 is very respectable torque from that size engine.
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Laughing Gas
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 794
Likes: 3
Ha ha its cool, I understand where you are coming from I was just looking for information on Ford's future plans.
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Moderator
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 22,436
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From: Louisville,Ky.
Check out the 2007 Mustang Cobra GT500. Over 450hp 5.4L 
True, the Hemi will outrun the 5.4L empty, but put 6000# behind it and see what happens. The variable cam timing of the 3V 5.4L has 85% of its torque at 1000rpm. These trucks are heavy and the engines are tuned for being used as a truck, not a car.
And lets not forget the ever so impressive Lightning trucks with 380hp.
If you want speed, you need to lose about 1500lbs and get a Mustang
But I agree, there is alot of power potential in these engines, but Ford is holding out on us. I have also never figured out why these Ford engines usually have less HP then the other brands but Ford has to use 2 precats and 2 cats to get emissions down when the others can make more power and get better mileage while only using 1 cat. Ever heard a Hemi truck with a Flowmaster? It's much louder than a Ford because the exhaust isn't so choked down.
As for gearing, I would go with 4.10's. I too have the 265/70R17's on mine and it is nowhere near low enough. If I ever get the money, I will be ditching the 3.55's for 4.10's.
True, the Hemi will outrun the 5.4L empty, but put 6000# behind it and see what happens. The variable cam timing of the 3V 5.4L has 85% of its torque at 1000rpm. These trucks are heavy and the engines are tuned for being used as a truck, not a car.
And lets not forget the ever so impressive Lightning trucks with 380hp.
If you want speed, you need to lose about 1500lbs and get a Mustang
But I agree, there is alot of power potential in these engines, but Ford is holding out on us. I have also never figured out why these Ford engines usually have less HP then the other brands but Ford has to use 2 precats and 2 cats to get emissions down when the others can make more power and get better mileage while only using 1 cat. Ever heard a Hemi truck with a Flowmaster? It's much louder than a Ford because the exhaust isn't so choked down.
As for gearing, I would go with 4.10's. I too have the 265/70R17's on mine and it is nowhere near low enough. If I ever get the money, I will be ditching the 3.55's for 4.10's.
Last edited by LxMan1; Oct 27, 2005 at 12:22 AM.
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Thread Starter
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Laughing Gas
Joined: Nov 2003
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Yeah when I was buying this truck I was upgrading from a 2wd ex cab 3.0 ranger...
it was a Dog and this truck felt very powerful. It took me a very long time to find my truck in this good of condition and I never even saw a 5.4 like it for sale and now it feels underpowered after driving it so long and knowing how it reacts in all situations...
I won't be wasting money on gears or lockers on this truck I will wait until I have a 5.4 F150 or a 6.0 F250 before I do any fun stuff to it
it was a Dog and this truck felt very powerful. It took me a very long time to find my truck in this good of condition and I never even saw a 5.4 like it for sale and now it feels underpowered after driving it so long and knowing how it reacts in all situations...
I won't be wasting money on gears or lockers on this truck I will wait until I have a 5.4 F150 or a 6.0 F250 before I do any fun stuff to it
Fleet Mechanic
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 1,546
Likes: 46
From: Kemmerer, Wyoming
LXMan is right... my buddy has an '04 Dodge with the Hemi... he has way more top end acceleration than my truck does. But when we go on a camping trip, towing our RVs... I constantly have to slow down to let him catch up after rolling over some hills!
It really ticks him off too... his is a 3/4 ton and he thinks just because of that it should pull better than mine...
It really ticks him off too... his is a 3/4 ton and he thinks just because of that it should pull better than mine...
Freshman User
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 35
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From: Flowood, MS
A guy that i work with has a buddy who was going to trade his powerstroke F-250 for a Hemi 1/2-ton Dodge, but changed his mind on the test drive because he said it felt like it was nosing over after 80 mph. Granted, a diesel is a different story all together, it just shows that the peak numbers don't tell the whole story.
People at work wonder why I didn't buy a Titan or a Silverado when I bought my '05 F-150 since they get getter gas mileage and can outrun me, but since the driver's seat didn't hurt my back and the 5.4 3V seems to pull my 24' pontoon boat around with as much gusto as when I drive around town empty, I'm glad that I bought the Ford. Also, I'm so used to Frod controls layout that even changing models or years doesn't confuse me as jumping to another brand.
People at work wonder why I didn't buy a Titan or a Silverado when I bought my '05 F-150 since they get getter gas mileage and can outrun me, but since the driver's seat didn't hurt my back and the 5.4 3V seems to pull my 24' pontoon boat around with as much gusto as when I drive around town empty, I'm glad that I bought the Ford. Also, I'm so used to Frod controls layout that even changing models or years doesn't confuse me as jumping to another brand.
FTE Leadership Emeritus
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 42,561
Likes: 421
From: Long Island USA
It's rather amazing that Ford can put together supercharged 5.4L's and they hold together... at least, as far as I know
So when is Dodge going to supercharge their Hemi's? Did they make any yet?
I have this sneaking suspicion that the Hemi's rotating and reciprocal weight is a lot less than a 5.4L or a V10. So, the Fords put out more torque which is obvious when you're pulling something. But, the Hemi can win a race with a 5.4L because the motor spins up so fast.
Their timing is probably pretty advanced, but the Ford's isn't. That equates to lots of pulling power, but crappy acceleration.
It comes down to doing "work" - sure, HP in the strictest sense is "work" but it somehow doesn't completely describe what an engine can do.
So when is Dodge going to supercharge their Hemi's? Did they make any yet?
I have this sneaking suspicion that the Hemi's rotating and reciprocal weight is a lot less than a 5.4L or a V10. So, the Fords put out more torque which is obvious when you're pulling something. But, the Hemi can win a race with a 5.4L because the motor spins up so fast.
Their timing is probably pretty advanced, but the Ford's isn't. That equates to lots of pulling power, but crappy acceleration.
It comes down to doing "work" - sure, HP in the strictest sense is "work" but it somehow doesn't completely describe what an engine can do.