My newest dealer "gossip" is from the big "D"; because of their co-op works with MB they are going to be working on switching out the Cummins in the future to go with one of "their own" diesels from Germany and Cummins "will "or might be looking to bid against International for Ford's contract...anyone else heard this? ( Yes I was in pricing the new D-diesels).

 

That theory has been brought up again and again ad nauseum. I'm one who used to advocate use of the Cummins diesel in Ford pickups for awhile. I'm also one who (among many others) helped to demonize the 6.0 PSD at around the same time.
I'll never ask how it is that the 6.0 has recieved such a bad reputation amongst the internet forums - I already know. HERESAY.

I've been there. I've propagated it. That's primarily what it is. I'm sure there have been many more problems with the 6.0 than there were with the last generation of 7.3's - no doubt. But that's the nature of a new product - it's almost bound to be less reliable, it cannot be expected to have the same reliability as a product which has been refined for over a decade by way of trial and error in real world uses of many varied types.

Even now the 6.0 has'int got a stellar reputation. The combination of real life failures and mass unrelated heresay had tainted this engine's reputation from early on. It remains under a cloud of suspicion to this day. This is unfortunate really. Now that I've actually been around so many of them for over a year and a half, I've had a change of heart. The 6.0PSD is a good engine IMO. A very good engine. It may not last as long as a properly maintained Cummins ISB and it may not be so mod friendly as a 7.3PSD has proven to be, but it dosent need mods the way a 7.3 did for extra power either. Stock for stock theres nothing else out there - not even the Cummins 600, which will lay down so much power so quickly off the line - with or without a load. And if left stock, I can see no chronic reliability problems being realistically related to this engine.

I bring all this up because I really do think the 6.0PSD to be a great engine. I've never seen anything with such hellacious power right out of the box. Most of the 6.0 trucks with which I'm personally aquainted are commercial trucks outfitted with heavy service type bodies. I see these trucks coming and going day in and day out - day after day with loads upon loads of materials, equipment, and crews. They go into some of the muddiest, and filthiest job sites you'd ever imagine - and I keep seeing the same trucks all the time - with no reported problems from their owners - most of whom I've grown very aquainted with (and I do ask).

This engine has gotten such an unfair reputation, that even many Ford guys won't defend it anymore. They'll defend their 7.3's or any other Ford product zealously come hell or highwater, but bring up the 6.0 and their enthusiasm for bringing a good arguement turns to dismissive gibberish along with making many unrelated comparative remarks. The truth is - these guys just don't know how good this engine really is, and have been taken in with all the negative hype on the internet themselves!

I sometimes invariably end up writing books when a two line sentence could suffice as a viable answer to the question, but I thought it really important to clarify how I feel before going into my answer.....lol, man...

First, let me say, I don't believe there is any truth to this rumor at all. BUT, and this is a BIG but - IF this rumor turned out to be true, I would think Ford foolhardy to not try to aquire the Cummins ISB for the Super Duty pickups. Not as a replacement to the Powerstrokes - not at all, but to supplement them. By offering both of these diesels at the same time, Ford would practically guarantee their number one position in diesel sales FOREVER. Ok, maybe a bit overdone there - but I do believe it.

What would be the point? Anyone who simply can't bring themselves to live without the notion that a true diesel is an inline six cylinder would buy the Cummins. Those who just have to have what they percieve to be the longest lasting diesel would buy the Cummins. Those who use their trucks for lots of low speed farm work could arguably be better off with the Cummins. Those who want to make cheap power
with a very mod friendly motor may choose the Cummins. No doubt the Cummins is a great motor and offers some potential advantages in certain areas. In a Super Duty, the Cummins would finally make it's way into what amounts as practically the strongest pickup ever manufactured.

So who would be left to buy the Powerstroke? Everyone else. Primarily the type of people who are not interested in modification but do want the most bang for their buck in terms of overall stock performance (towing, hualing, hauling ****) - this includes the majority of contractors I know, and also the V8 aspect of it helps to sell people on it having better performance as well.

Just as GM has Chevy and GMC and owns it's own competition in that way, Ford could do the same with two diesel engines - cost would be practically nil, as all other major components could be interchangeable,( transmissions, diffs, transfer cases, springs, axles, etc.)

 

very eloquant (sp)...and I too have a 6.0 and so far am happy and yes the power is far more than enough for me; I dont have short mans syndrom. i have driven tham all and they each have aspects that i enjoy. as for the rumor the dealer was very well versed in that i'm sure he's saying that to everyone, although i don't know why yet. i apologize for re-beating a dead horse, but the idea was new to me. i live in a heavily ag area; both cattle and farming and a lot of new construction so, i too, know a lot of people in the business and you can hear anything you want if you look for it. perhaps this was a case of that; although i don't really want to see Ford give up on something i like. which leads me to believe that the new 6.4 is a reaction to "bigger and better" vs. meeting emmissions by virtue of the fact that neither of the other two are changing their displacement...among other things.

 

I've heard that GM is going to a 6.9L Duramax. The two engines that they offer right now are already larger displacement. The 6.0L is the smallest diesel out of all of them. When it goes to 6.4L, it will still be the smallest diesel.
I truely doubt that Ford will be using the Cummins engine anytime soon. Although, I wonder what kind of sales each would generate if Ford offered both.

 

engine size doesnt really matter. what matters is hp/torq per liter. ford can make just as much power if not more with a 10% smaller engine than GM (isuzu) can. and cummins is even better at that, but the chassis the engine is in just sucks. and i have seen the official new-wave diesel shootouts, the ford diesel can beat the GM or dodge-diesel equipped trucks at anything. empty drags, empty 0-60, empty 1/4, loaded to max GVWR 1/4 mile. max GVWR 0-60, the ford won over 90% of the shootouts.

 

It does matter. Although the Ford has dominated with the smallest engine, to be able to keep up, the displacement must be increased for emmissions.
The Cummins is actually the biggest engine of the bunch. 5.9L of straight 6. Only 6 cylinders.

 

The Cummins is the smallest one 5.9 liters
Then the PSD at 6.0
Duramax is the largest right now 6.6? 6.9?
If you are measuring just one combustion chamber then, yes, the Cummins is the largest.

 

well see there could be something to this. a few years back the worked on the jeep liberty clean diesel. at the same time they were exploring the option of bigger clean diesel engines to use in the durango and dakota. well the cummins is only good til 07 then they must find something else it won'y comply with the new laws. so a clean inline mb diesel could be the repalcement.

 

True, especially when you look at the numbers. The Cummins has 5.9L spread into only 6 compared to 8 chambers, so that of course is true about the combustion chambers. The Cummins is just bigger in size; think overall size. The 7.3L is even smaller then the Cummins engine in overall size. You have to see them side by side, the 5.9L and the 7.3L to believe it, believe me I wouldn't if someone told me that either, until I saw them side by side.

 

the big d just may pull it off as they allready have a 5 clyinder mb/man diesel in the freightliner/dodge highbody vans.
my wife drives a liberty and the last time i took it in for service i asked the service adviser who is some one i have known for a long time, and he said the same thing. get ready for a very hot running man/mb made motor to replace the the cumapart.
i have also heard that story from my detroit shop when i go in for parts for my boats 8v71 tia that mb wants to use their own motors to cut costs in the crysler brand lines. some thing like they allready have done. the 4.7 gas v8 is a mb design motor dating back to the 70's. the 3.7 v6 is a mb engine. and a few other motors are fleet brands.
i think any way the only crysler made design motor left is in the viper and they even want to replace that with their own v12 motor.
as to how they run. and i mean the man brand diesels . they do run almost forever, are strong. smooth running and very low noise level motors.
i'm not a big dcx lover but have run many machines and boats powered by man brand motors they are great motors, check out their web site and see what they have and the specs

 

I've driven a Dodge Sprinter with the 5 cyl M/B engine in it.
Very impressive drivetrain, smooth, quiet, powerful.....

 

funny thing is that is 100% correct. i have asked many who own them how they feel about them all say great. the one i drove was to say it again great and smooth.
if there is one thing the germans can build great it's a diesel motor.
the one boat i run has 10000 hours on a set of man v12 engines and they are just to the point of being pulled for the first rebuild. another boat i know of is 125 feet has 4 v12 mans. ever see a party boat of 125 feet run 30 knots?