my 87 stop running! Help!!
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my 87 stop running! Help!!
Hi I need some help PLEASE! I have a 1987 Ford F150 with the 4.9 inline 6cyl and I was coming from work and the engine stop running. We have check everything in the truck. It has fuel but no spark. I replace the coil, module, rotor,dist.cap, wires, NEW distributor too and still no SPARK. I even replace the computer and still cant get it to run. There is power to the Coil but no spark going to the spark plugs. I check all the wiring going to the coil and the module and everything looks fine. When I try to crank the engine the Rotor move so I really dont know what else to check. Is been in a mechanic shop too and they still cant get it to run(charge lot of money but not running LOL). I will really appreciated any help from you guys. Thanks in advace.
Also I was wondering if there is any way to put straight power to the distributor like using an aftermarket MSD or something like that. " I just need to get it running" Help Please, thanks
Also I was wondering if there is any way to put straight power to the distributor like using an aftermarket MSD or something like that. " I just need to get it running" Help Please, thanks
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Joined: Feb 2002
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From: Saddle Brook United State
Check the ignition module on the distributor, I believe you have the TFI-VI system, if not -well --forget the following. The modules went bad with no notice. If the module is the original Ford module you might have one of the bad ones. There was a recall on the modules. The module is screwed to the dist and the wire harness plugs into it. It can be removed without removing the distributor if you have the tool ($5 from autozone) or a deep 1/4 inch drive 1/4 inch socket and the socket wall are THIN enough. If you do get the screws out be careful how you remove the module (gently) as there are three spade connectors in the module that mate to three female connectors in the distributor. As for the MSD system. You need a functioning system to start with, then you can use an MSD 6A system. The 6A uses the distributors electronics (there are no points in your distributor) as well as the ignition module on the distributor.
stractor
stractor
Last edited by stractor; Aug 17, 2005 at 02:59 PM.
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Thanks for your reply. Yes I have replace the Module and I also replace the Distributor and I still cant get it to run. Im desperate. Im staring to give up on my truck but I dont want to man, i love my truck.
Is there anyway that i could switch to a carburator and have an aftermarket distributor or something like that so I could eliminated the all the wires???
Please any help. Thanks
Is there anyway that i could switch to a carburator and have an aftermarket distributor or something like that so I could eliminated the all the wires???
Please any help. Thanks
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Joined: Feb 2002
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From: Saddle Brook United State
Search the posts , there have I believe some people who have changed to earlier distributors (duraspark). I am not a fan of backdating. If you change to a carb you will most likely have to go the 4bbl route and then that is no good without a cam of some kind, so now you started the snow ball rolling down hill and your wallet will feel it. You don't want to revert to the stock carb system, I had a new 85 with a carb and I could walk faster then that truck would go. If you have EFI keep it. Note try changing the EEC (electronic engine control)Relay ($15 from Ford), it supplies the power for the computer and dist and will cause the engine to stop and not run.
stractor
stractor
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From: Saddle Brook United State
On my 90 it is on the drivers side fender apron,near all the wire harness plugs from the engine. it is a small 1x11/4" steel cased relay all by itself. I don't know where it is on your 87.
stractor
stractor
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From: Danville, Pa
I had something simmilar happen in my 88. Turned out to be a fuse link. However I didn't know this and being 17 at the time, I did the hit and miss thing. Added power to various wires until it started.(duh, can't belive it worked) Funny thing is, once I had it started, I could shut off the key and the truck would keep on running. No charge to the battery but it wouldn't stop unless I killed the power.(via single pole 120v house toggle switch, complete with cover, mounted in kick panel. Ahh, when I was young)
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From: Saddle Brook United State
What kind of system does your engine have--Duraspark (engines with carb)
or TFI-VI (EFI engines)??? The way it sounds you have a bad connection , broken wire ,open fusable link (not sure about the link) in a wire harness or a corroded or backed out pin in a harness plug or socket in the ignition system or the wiring from the ignition components to the computer. You seem to have replaced most of the ignition system. The starter relay in some of the ignition systems (duraspark) supplies voltage to the coil when starting (start bypass) if the relay is bad ---no volts to the coil when cranking.However you stated the engine was running and died --correct??? so that rules out the starter relay as the ignition switch supplies voltage while running. In the EFI system it looks like the ignition switch runs the whole show. I only have Ford wiring diagrams for a 1990 EFI system. There are several tests but I need to know the type of system you have. Checking for voltage is misleading as electronic devices including ignition systems switch ground signals to make things work--there fore the ignition coil will have voltage on it and the system will not work, because it requires the computer ground the coil to make it spark.
stractor
or TFI-VI (EFI engines)??? The way it sounds you have a bad connection , broken wire ,open fusable link (not sure about the link) in a wire harness or a corroded or backed out pin in a harness plug or socket in the ignition system or the wiring from the ignition components to the computer. You seem to have replaced most of the ignition system. The starter relay in some of the ignition systems (duraspark) supplies voltage to the coil when starting (start bypass) if the relay is bad ---no volts to the coil when cranking.However you stated the engine was running and died --correct??? so that rules out the starter relay as the ignition switch supplies voltage while running. In the EFI system it looks like the ignition switch runs the whole show. I only have Ford wiring diagrams for a 1990 EFI system. There are several tests but I need to know the type of system you have. Checking for voltage is misleading as electronic devices including ignition systems switch ground signals to make things work--there fore the ignition coil will have voltage on it and the system will not work, because it requires the computer ground the coil to make it spark.
stractor
Last edited by stractor; Aug 19, 2005 at 01:18 AM.
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From: Black Hills South Dakota
There's voltage, but how about any current? A wire that's badly corroded may show normal volts till you place a load on it, then it'll drop to nothing. Meter your coil, then add a load, like cranking it, while you continue to read the coil's input voltage.
The same could apply to a weak and failing battery.
-Smoky
The same could apply to a weak and failing battery.
-Smoky
Elder User
Joined: Feb 2002
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From: Saddle Brook United State
Doesn't quite work like that. You would need to put an amp meter in the line feeding the coil to see any current drop or no current draw at all. If you put a voltmeter across the coil and cranked the engine you will see the meter drop( if the coil is working correctly) because you are measuring only the voltage drop across the coil, as if the coil was a big resistor.
Here is the way to test the primary of the coil. The Voltage winding is the primary and the winding that generated the high voltage is the secondary.
1. Insert a small straight pin in the wire which runs from the coil negative terminal(-) to the TFI module, about 1inch from the module.
WARNING--WARNING WILL ROBINSON DON'T TOUCH GROUND WITH THE PIN OR POOF GOES THE MODULE.
2. connect a 12volt test lamp between the pin and an engine ground.
3. crank the engine watching the bulb
A. If the lamp flashes the primary is working == OK The flashes are the pluses that fire the plugs.
B. If the lamp does nothing , you have a primary problem.
C. If the lamp stays lit and no flashes--well that is another test.
stractor
Here is the way to test the primary of the coil. The Voltage winding is the primary and the winding that generated the high voltage is the secondary.
1. Insert a small straight pin in the wire which runs from the coil negative terminal(-) to the TFI module, about 1inch from the module.
WARNING--WARNING WILL ROBINSON DON'T TOUCH GROUND WITH THE PIN OR POOF GOES THE MODULE.
2. connect a 12volt test lamp between the pin and an engine ground.
3. crank the engine watching the bulb
A. If the lamp flashes the primary is working == OK The flashes are the pluses that fire the plugs.
B. If the lamp does nothing , you have a primary problem.
C. If the lamp stays lit and no flashes--well that is another test.
stractor
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From: Black Hills South Dakota
Yes, that would be a better test of the coil, but my point was if a wire was nearly parted inside by corrosion, that in itself would act like a resistor. If the voltage dropped to say 8 or below from 12, something's suspect. "Normal" drop might only be a volt or a fraction. The starter might cause it to drop farther, down to 10 maybe, but a big drop indicates some sort of loose connection, very high current draw (which would be pretty noticeable in other ways, like "hot!") or very weak battery. The wire itself may heat up at the point where it is weakest.
It just sounded to me like about everything else has been checked but the wiring itself, plus I just read a similar story on another site last night where 6" of the 12-volt wire feedig the ignition was all green inside and soft and weak outside but otherwise looking perfect and passing normal voltage - until they put a load on it, when it dropped down to only 3 volts.
-Smoky
It just sounded to me like about everything else has been checked but the wiring itself, plus I just read a similar story on another site last night where 6" of the 12-volt wire feedig the ignition was all green inside and soft and weak outside but otherwise looking perfect and passing normal voltage - until they put a load on it, when it dropped down to only 3 volts.
-Smoky
Elder User
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From: Saddle Brook United State
smokey---you are absolutely correct. I used to service microfilm processor cameras and we constantly had trouble with the fix solution corroding the brass molex pins in wire harness connectors and causing just what you described.As a matter of fact the computer in Fords will crap out at less than ten volts. It sounds to me like an open connection some place, and that will require some tracing with a meter and a wiring diagram. He should do the coil test first and see what the results are , it is an ease enough test.
stractor
stractor