Sloppy steering on an E350
#1
Sloppy steering on an E350
The steering on my 89 E350 is pretty funky. I've told people that it's scary to which they reply oh it's probably just loose like an old truck. Then they take a turn in the seat and after a couple white knuckle miles finally admit that yes, it is scary, it's possessed.
I don't think it's going to fall apart or anything and if you're going under 35mph you don't even notice, but pick up the speed and get ready for some fun. It's much like sawing at the wheel of an old tractor.
What it feels like to me is that one wheel is allowed to rotate a bit as it pleases causing the van to steer side to side as it sees fit. A different tilt to the road, or horizontal breeze or just a change in the alignment of the stars causes the van to change directions. So while you're driving down the highway you're busy correcting the van over and over again. You want to go straight, van wants to take a left, you steer right a bit. Van wants to go right, you steer left a bit, and repeat. Add a trailer to this mix and you have some serious fun. It doesn't pull to the side, it doesn't just wander a bit, it wants to turn. Getting passed by a Semi is also fun.
It has a king pin front end which I'm told might be the problem, but I'm not really sure of how that all works. If it requires work on the king pin can I do it without taking it to a shop?
Any experience with wacky wandering fords out there? Please don't make me the race car driver the only person on my crew who can drive the 7 hours back home after 2 races earlier that day.
Thanks
I don't think it's going to fall apart or anything and if you're going under 35mph you don't even notice, but pick up the speed and get ready for some fun. It's much like sawing at the wheel of an old tractor.
What it feels like to me is that one wheel is allowed to rotate a bit as it pleases causing the van to steer side to side as it sees fit. A different tilt to the road, or horizontal breeze or just a change in the alignment of the stars causes the van to change directions. So while you're driving down the highway you're busy correcting the van over and over again. You want to go straight, van wants to take a left, you steer right a bit. Van wants to go right, you steer left a bit, and repeat. Add a trailer to this mix and you have some serious fun. It doesn't pull to the side, it doesn't just wander a bit, it wants to turn. Getting passed by a Semi is also fun.
It has a king pin front end which I'm told might be the problem, but I'm not really sure of how that all works. If it requires work on the king pin can I do it without taking it to a shop?
Any experience with wacky wandering fords out there? Please don't make me the race car driver the only person on my crew who can drive the 7 hours back home after 2 races earlier that day.
Thanks
#2
My '82 E350 used to wander around somewhat also. Doesn't sound like it was as bad as yours, though.
Check for play in the power steering gearbox and other steering components.
In Park with the parking brake on and motor running, have someone turn the steering wheel back and forth while you look at it from underneath in front. This will allow you to see where the play is. Chances are, your helper will be able to turn the steering wheel a ways before you see the wheels actually turning. The reverse is happening as you drive down the road: the wheels are turning without the steering wheel...
I ended up replacing the power steering gearbox. you may have other issues requiring replacement of bushings or kingpins...
Check for play in the power steering gearbox and other steering components.
In Park with the parking brake on and motor running, have someone turn the steering wheel back and forth while you look at it from underneath in front. This will allow you to see where the play is. Chances are, your helper will be able to turn the steering wheel a ways before you see the wheels actually turning. The reverse is happening as you drive down the road: the wheels are turning without the steering wheel...
I ended up replacing the power steering gearbox. you may have other issues requiring replacement of bushings or kingpins...
#3
#4
I just replaced the steering knuckle, along with the king pin, the bearings and just about everything else related to the front wheel assembly. It's not a difficult task to remove the kingpin (but time consuming), although I couldn't imagine it causing your problems. You'll need pretty basic tools like a hammer, some wrenches, a clamp, possibly a sledgehammer (i needed it for the control arm), and most importantly a dowel rod to hammer out the king pin. Chances are if you don't have those tools, then maybe it's not quite a job for you. I'm a novice at working on cars and I didn't have a problem...although I did have a Haynes manual.
#5
Oh, yeah. It's sloppy all right. I was looking to buy my father in law's 1986 29ft E350 Winnie Minnie and one trip down the road put me off, it reminded me of the old Fairmont steering with about a half wheel play in both directions. Good thing the newer vans/trucks (and cars) are improved/cured. Or I'd be driving any other brand.
#6
I would agree with the above statements on the power steering box. If you can have someone move the steering wheel very slowly in both directions while you watch the steering arms etc. If you can move the steering wheel while parked more than 1 to 1 1/2 inches then more than likely a new steering box is needed. You can get a rebuild at a autoparts store. Good luck hope this helps.
#7
Originally Posted by benracin
The steering on my 89 E350 is pretty funky. I've told people that it's scary to which they reply oh it's probably just loose like an old truck. Then they take a turn in the seat and after a couple white knuckle miles finally admit that yes, it is scary, it's possessed.
I don't think it's going to fall apart or anything and if you're going under 35mph you don't even notice, but pick up the speed and get ready for some fun. It's much like sawing at the wheel of an old tractor.
What it feels like to me is that one wheel is allowed to rotate a bit as it pleases causing the van to steer side to side as it sees fit. A different tilt to the road, or horizontal breeze or just a change in the alignment of the stars causes the van to change directions. So while you're driving down the highway you're busy correcting the van over and over again. You want to go straight, van wants to take a left, you steer right a bit. Van wants to go right, you steer left a bit, and repeat. Add a trailer to this mix and you have some serious fun. It doesn't pull to the side, it doesn't just wander a bit, it wants to turn. Getting passed by a Semi is also fun.
It has a king pin front end which I'm told might be the problem, but I'm not really sure of how that all works. If it requires work on the king pin can I do it without taking it to a shop?
Any experience with wacky wandering fords out there? Please don't make me the race car driver the only person on my crew who can drive the 7 hours back home after 2 races earlier that day.
Thanks
I don't think it's going to fall apart or anything and if you're going under 35mph you don't even notice, but pick up the speed and get ready for some fun. It's much like sawing at the wheel of an old tractor.
What it feels like to me is that one wheel is allowed to rotate a bit as it pleases causing the van to steer side to side as it sees fit. A different tilt to the road, or horizontal breeze or just a change in the alignment of the stars causes the van to change directions. So while you're driving down the highway you're busy correcting the van over and over again. You want to go straight, van wants to take a left, you steer right a bit. Van wants to go right, you steer left a bit, and repeat. Add a trailer to this mix and you have some serious fun. It doesn't pull to the side, it doesn't just wander a bit, it wants to turn. Getting passed by a Semi is also fun.
It has a king pin front end which I'm told might be the problem, but I'm not really sure of how that all works. If it requires work on the king pin can I do it without taking it to a shop?
Any experience with wacky wandering fords out there? Please don't make me the race car driver the only person on my crew who can drive the 7 hours back home after 2 races earlier that day.
Thanks
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#8
OK, assuming your E350 is similar to my '87 E150:
1. Most of the time this is just because you didn't lube the front end. Silly as it sounds, it'll start wandering around on the road because that type of steering system has some slack inherent to its design but it's not bad if the front end is lubed. The steering will still center itself. If it's binding due to poor lube it wanders all over! Just get a grease gun and hit the tie rod pts (4 I think) and the 4 kingpin pts. While you're at it hit the 2 fittings on the drive shaft u-joints btw.
2. Warning- the gearbox has a preloading adjustment on the side. Do not touch it! It won't pick up gearbox slack, can't be readjusted without removing it and doing some tricks with torque wrenches, and if you mess up the adjustment it WILL break the box in short order.
3. Look at the flex coupler between the box and the steering column. That one IS replaceable and has been known to wear out.
1. Most of the time this is just because you didn't lube the front end. Silly as it sounds, it'll start wandering around on the road because that type of steering system has some slack inherent to its design but it's not bad if the front end is lubed. The steering will still center itself. If it's binding due to poor lube it wanders all over! Just get a grease gun and hit the tie rod pts (4 I think) and the 4 kingpin pts. While you're at it hit the 2 fittings on the drive shaft u-joints btw.
2. Warning- the gearbox has a preloading adjustment on the side. Do not touch it! It won't pick up gearbox slack, can't be readjusted without removing it and doing some tricks with torque wrenches, and if you mess up the adjustment it WILL break the box in short order.
3. Look at the flex coupler between the box and the steering column. That one IS replaceable and has been known to wear out.
Last edited by Dannym; 07-18-2005 at 08:41 PM.
#9
My 82 E100 felt like that at first expecially with over correcting although it does not "hunt" and tracks straight. Better now with new tires all around. The steering box had been checked out after I first got it and there is some wear but not bad. The steering wheel was tightened down as it was looser than what I liked.
But I was not used to driving a "truck" and felt like I was overcorrecting too much compared to my 79 Cordoba. Have two and neither have the same steering "feel". That and feeling every wind gust/shift as it is an empty "box" to begin with. Felt "hairy" at first driving it but was determined. Finally learned it's "feel" and how not to overcorrect. Matter of lowering the hand position to feel the steering wheel's "catch" better. Became more accustomed to the wind blowing against the Van's slab sides at different angles when it blows hard out here.
However, most of the problem came from extremely worn out wheelbearings and no grease. Actually both outer ones were shot....completely (no needle bearings in one and the other was half a race with short "teeth")
Went ahead and replaced both inner and outer anyway along with the brake hose. Greased the front end. Feels ALOT better driving down the highway now. Even when the Big Rigs pass and the winds blow.
But I was not used to driving a "truck" and felt like I was overcorrecting too much compared to my 79 Cordoba. Have two and neither have the same steering "feel". That and feeling every wind gust/shift as it is an empty "box" to begin with. Felt "hairy" at first driving it but was determined. Finally learned it's "feel" and how not to overcorrect. Matter of lowering the hand position to feel the steering wheel's "catch" better. Became more accustomed to the wind blowing against the Van's slab sides at different angles when it blows hard out here.
However, most of the problem came from extremely worn out wheelbearings and no grease. Actually both outer ones were shot....completely (no needle bearings in one and the other was half a race with short "teeth")
Went ahead and replaced both inner and outer anyway along with the brake hose. Greased the front end. Feels ALOT better driving down the highway now. Even when the Big Rigs pass and the winds blow.
#11
#12
So can the steering box cause it to kind of turn in random directions? I can understand the loose steering causing it to wonder a bit, but what I get is a quick pull to a side direction every now and then. It's not enough to pull you off the road but it's a bit of a suprise to those who are not expecting it. With a little bit of training you do kind of learn to do tiny corrections to keep it from going back and forth but you still get a suprise every now and then.
And since the steering box is the most expensive part, would simply doing the tie rod ends do something? I noticed they offer both inners and outers, does a guy need to buy all 4? That's a bit-o-cash!
And since the steering box is the most expensive part, would simply doing the tie rod ends do something? I noticed they offer both inners and outers, does a guy need to buy all 4? That's a bit-o-cash!
#14
According to the Haynes manual that I used to replace my steering knuckle, the kingpin is the 7 or 8 inch rod that holds the steering knuckle in place. It has a notch in it where a bolt screws through it to hold it there. It weighs about 5 lbs or so. I couldn't find any good pics of it though.
When i want to find an image of something (for instance, if I have the word but don't know what it looks like) I go to www.google.com, then click the "images" button above the search bar. This searches the internet for picture only, not text. It's great.
When i want to find an image of something (for instance, if I have the word but don't know what it looks like) I go to www.google.com, then click the "images" button above the search bar. This searches the internet for picture only, not text. It's great.
#15
I should mention this steering box technology has play in it even when new. This is the hard lesson I learned. Thus you can look at it all day and still have no idea whether it's the problem or not. You'll see play but without a calibrated measure it means nothing.
Just do this- lube the entire front end before considering anything else. It's no trouble and there's a good chance it will make it better.
Problem I had was say it was drifting to the left- you pull to the right, need to pull like 2-3" of turn on the steering wheel before it affected it, then it popped over and was drifting to the right. Repeat until you get tired of it. On the positive side, you will never fall asleep at the wheel of a vehicle doing this.
Just do this- lube the entire front end before considering anything else. It's no trouble and there's a good chance it will make it better.
Problem I had was say it was drifting to the left- you pull to the right, need to pull like 2-3" of turn on the steering wheel before it affected it, then it popped over and was drifting to the right. Repeat until you get tired of it. On the positive side, you will never fall asleep at the wheel of a vehicle doing this.