& I don't like it either 
Dealer service rant
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Elder User
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 547
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From: Northwest Indiana
Dealer service rant
Ok so I take my daughers 00' Cougar in to the only local LM dealer for a trans fluid flush. It's one of those jobs you can't very easily do yourself and I took it to the dealer in the hopes that they will at least manage to put the correct fluid in it. They call back about an hour later saying the front sway bar is loose and it needs all new rotors and pads -- please add $1000 to the $160 for the trans flush.
NOT!
Loose sway bar??? bushings $115???
Brakes $800 +.
First off it dosen't need brakes yet, I keep a close eye on those. Second, even if they replaced all the rotors and pads their cost for parts is likely less than $200 and the poor tech that does the work might get $50. I know their is a lot of overhead to running a business but ~ $850 for brakes?
Plus now I have to re-torque the lugs so the rotors don't warp.
Ok, rant over.
NOT!
Loose sway bar??? bushings $115???
Brakes $800 +.
First off it dosen't need brakes yet, I keep a close eye on those. Second, even if they replaced all the rotors and pads their cost for parts is likely less than $200 and the poor tech that does the work might get $50. I know their is a lot of overhead to running a business but ~ $850 for brakes?
Plus now I have to re-torque the lugs so the rotors don't warp.
Ok, rant over.
Post Fiend
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 6,940
Likes: 2
From: Eastern WA
Simply tell them you will come down and look at it, then drive off in the car. Before leaving, tell the service dept manager that you brought it in for a tranny fluid flush and not an inspection of the items they called you about. Don't return to the crappy shop that tried to scam you.
Elder User
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 575
Likes: 0
From: Western Pa
Something similiar happened to my uncle, but he let it slide because he's good buddies with the owner. The shop had a good reputation with my uncle, so he couldn't just switch. However, being that it's a dealer in your case, and they don't take the time to get friendly, don't go back.
Senior User
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 138
Likes: 0
From: Wisconsin
dealer service
Ok heres my take on the situation. I am a dealer tech so i have some background on this. First you brought your car in for a trans flush. Alone
with the flush the R.O. had a multi-point inspection attached to it. Ford pushes all dealers to do multi-points free of charge to the customers. The
reason is to help increase bussiness but it is also a customer service. Do you
want to know if you have a nail in a tire. If we didn't catch this and you had
a flat you might be back asking about it. My dealer does a multipoint on every
vehicle and we tell the customer before hand that we are going to look the
vehicle over. If you dont want this tell them. you problely have loose sway bar links. This can cause noise and handling issues. When they say
you need brakes they are not metal to metal they are most likely getting close
to needing replaced. usually you don't wait tell metal on metal before you replace them. I don't know your milage but most likely the pads are close to worn out and the way they make rotors so thin they can't cut them even once. Motorcraft prices off the internet Front rotors $80 ea Front pads $70 Rear rotors $70 Rear pads $75. Parts total $375 We charge 1.5 per axle at $90. labor= $270 Total $645. sway bars are $50 each = $100 total. 1 hour to install $90 total for all repairs =$ 850 + tax. Not that far off. You pay for quality parts and ford certified tech. Sure the Zone sell rotors for $20 and there warped out of the box. Summary dealer service
expensive YES. Are we scams and rip offs NO!
with the flush the R.O. had a multi-point inspection attached to it. Ford pushes all dealers to do multi-points free of charge to the customers. The
reason is to help increase bussiness but it is also a customer service. Do you
want to know if you have a nail in a tire. If we didn't catch this and you had
a flat you might be back asking about it. My dealer does a multipoint on every
vehicle and we tell the customer before hand that we are going to look the
vehicle over. If you dont want this tell them. you problely have loose sway bar links. This can cause noise and handling issues. When they say
you need brakes they are not metal to metal they are most likely getting close
to needing replaced. usually you don't wait tell metal on metal before you replace them. I don't know your milage but most likely the pads are close to worn out and the way they make rotors so thin they can't cut them even once. Motorcraft prices off the internet Front rotors $80 ea Front pads $70 Rear rotors $70 Rear pads $75. Parts total $375 We charge 1.5 per axle at $90. labor= $270 Total $645. sway bars are $50 each = $100 total. 1 hour to install $90 total for all repairs =$ 850 + tax. Not that far off. You pay for quality parts and ford certified tech. Sure the Zone sell rotors for $20 and there warped out of the box. Summary dealer service
expensive YES. Are we scams and rip offs NO!
Thread Starter
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Elder User
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 547
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From: Northwest Indiana
A follow-up. The dealer calls and said they screwed up and gave me a 30K mi service worth $400. The service was free since I didn't request it and the service writer is acting like she hopes she dosen't lose her job over it... I got the feeling she wanted me to say -- hey that's ok I'll pay for it. Hum...No. So what does a $400 30K service include. Well... Inspect brakes, tires, hoses etc. oil & filter, fuel filter, air filter, maybe cabin filter, rotate tires. That's all well and good but the tires are new, about 2K on them, I just changed the oil about 1.5K ago, fuel filter had about 35K on it, cabin filter???? whatever. Now I have to re-torque the lugs because every place I've ever been ( Execet the Tire Rack ) dosen't use a torque wrench on them.
And the brakes. The acted like OMG you better get those done soon!. If you saw them you would laugh. The disks look fine and there is more than half of the pad. Maybe there is not enough thickness to turn the rotors but they are not badly worn or warped or cracked.
Oh well, I never feel good about taking one of my cars in for service. I have a few horror stories. This was nothing just irritating.
P.S. I have a lot of respect for the techs. Those guys more than earn their money. There was a sign on the wall that the hourly labor rate was $83 / Hour. I'm guessing the techs are lucky to see a forth of that. I don't blame the techs for this bad experience -- it's the dealer / service dept.
And the brakes. The acted like OMG you better get those done soon!. If you saw them you would laugh. The disks look fine and there is more than half of the pad. Maybe there is not enough thickness to turn the rotors but they are not badly worn or warped or cracked.
Oh well, I never feel good about taking one of my cars in for service. I have a few horror stories. This was nothing just irritating.
P.S. I have a lot of respect for the techs. Those guys more than earn their money. There was a sign on the wall that the hourly labor rate was $83 / Hour. I'm guessing the techs are lucky to see a forth of that. I don't blame the techs for this bad experience -- it's the dealer / service dept.
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Joined: Jan 2005
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I agree with 4.6 ranger I work for a dealership as a tech for over 5 years the service adviser wasnt looking for you to say ill pay probly waiting for you to flip on her wanting to talk to the service manager etc.. you have to understand they get yelled at all day long some one will come in for a noise and needs an engine and some people blam us yelling at them and saying the tech dont know anything but at the same time they havent changed there oil in 15k or never come in for work but now want us to buy the motor tranny or what ever it my be. Also we are libale if your car comes in and the wheel or noise appears its our fault so we do a check to make sure every thing is on the up and up to avoid law suit but most importantly to keep good customer relations sorry for draging on but most of you techs should agree there is to much bashing of dealers cause no mader how had we try to do something right it gets turned right around and people bash the dealers i will agree there are a few hacks out there just tring to get money not careing but the odds are like 3 to every 100 dealers and there are a lot more used car scum out there not to bash them cause there are a few good ones but it all just gets a bad name for our buisness and i appreciate the respect for the techs ok im done
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Posting Guru
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Originally Posted by smokem331
I agree with 4.6 ranger I work for a dealership as a tech for over 5 years the service adviser wasnt looking for you to say ill pay probly waiting for you to flip on her wanting to talk to the service manager etc.. you have to understand they get yelled at all day long some one will come in for a noise and needs an engine and some people blam us yelling at them and saying the tech dont know anything but at the same time they havent changed there oil in 15k or never come in for work but now want us to buy the motor tranny or what ever it my be. Also we are libale if your car comes in and the wheel or noise appears its our fault so we do a check to make sure every thing is on the up and up to avoid law suit but most importantly to keep good customer relations sorry for draging on but most of you techs should agree there is to much bashing of dealers cause no mader how had we try to do something right it gets turned right around and people bash the dealers i will agree there are a few hacks out there just tring to get money not careing but the odds are like 3 to every 100 dealers and there are a lot more used car scum out there not to bash them cause there are a few good ones but it all just gets a bad name for our buisness and i appreciate the respect for the techs ok im done
I was told by a dealer I needed a coolant flush even though it was done just a few thousand miles earlier.
Another time they told me I needed rear brakes and my wheel cylindars were shot. A second opinion showed that both were abject lies.
Non-dealers have tried to scam me also, and of course some dealers are fine and honest but some are clearly not.
Post Fiend
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 13,873
Likes: 3
From: Atlanta GA
>you have to understand they get yelled at all day long
When people are yelling at each other (either employees or customers), turn around and leave. The place is a poor place to work or get your car serviced imo. Unhappy employees generally do lousy work.
I can only remember once having a customer yell at me (which was not my fault since I was taking over a mess after the service manager was fired) and never by management. The Chevy dealership were I worked we specialized in hard to solve problems and the zone manager sent us all the "lemons" to fix them and make people happy.
When customers yell it is because either people are not listening to them, do not inform the customer well ahead of time of problems or price increases, do not treat the customer like they themselves want to be treated if it was their own car, show no respect for the customer, keep them waiting forever, answered the phone instead of waiting on them, and/or are trying to stick it to them. Usually the last one.
To the original poster, they had absolutely no reason to take your wheels off to inspect your brakes unless you readily agreed to it. You do not remove parts from a customer's car, look in the trunk, play with stereo settings, or search the glovebox without cause and express prior permission.
They were trolling for work and trying to scam you, plain and simple. If I knew a customer needed work that was not an immediate threat to life, health, or would result in a mechanical breakdown, I would not call them up on the phone and suggest an additional $850 worth of work when they came in for something simple. I would say you might need minor additional work and I will leave the information with the bill.
I would leave a written estimate with the work order/bill, with cost and the next available date with a note to call and schedule an appointment without pressuring them.
On a brake job, I would have left the measurements of the pads (say 4 mm left. min is 2mm, new is 8 mm, you have about 5k miles left) and if the rotors can be turned or not, or if I would suggest just changing the pads and leave the rotors as is.
A good service department would leave you with two estimates. One for Motorcraft parts and one with parts from Autozone/Napa/AdvanceAuto and let YOU decide what you want to pay for parts cost and not try to ram $70+ rotors down your throat.
Chevy use to have a program in the 80s called
I.D.E.A.L.
I Demonstrate Extremely Astute Listening
Anyone that calls a customer up with an additional $850 was not listening to the customer when he said he expected a $160 bill for a tranny flush.
Those things are a useless scam anyways, imo, that benefits the service manager's own pocket. There is almost no car made that is not better off having the pan dropped and the filter changed. But, if they did that then the service manager would not get his "spiff" for every can of flush sold.
When people are yelling at each other (either employees or customers), turn around and leave. The place is a poor place to work or get your car serviced imo. Unhappy employees generally do lousy work.
I can only remember once having a customer yell at me (which was not my fault since I was taking over a mess after the service manager was fired) and never by management. The Chevy dealership were I worked we specialized in hard to solve problems and the zone manager sent us all the "lemons" to fix them and make people happy.
When customers yell it is because either people are not listening to them, do not inform the customer well ahead of time of problems or price increases, do not treat the customer like they themselves want to be treated if it was their own car, show no respect for the customer, keep them waiting forever, answered the phone instead of waiting on them, and/or are trying to stick it to them. Usually the last one.
To the original poster, they had absolutely no reason to take your wheels off to inspect your brakes unless you readily agreed to it. You do not remove parts from a customer's car, look in the trunk, play with stereo settings, or search the glovebox without cause and express prior permission.
They were trolling for work and trying to scam you, plain and simple. If I knew a customer needed work that was not an immediate threat to life, health, or would result in a mechanical breakdown, I would not call them up on the phone and suggest an additional $850 worth of work when they came in for something simple. I would say you might need minor additional work and I will leave the information with the bill.
I would leave a written estimate with the work order/bill, with cost and the next available date with a note to call and schedule an appointment without pressuring them.
On a brake job, I would have left the measurements of the pads (say 4 mm left. min is 2mm, new is 8 mm, you have about 5k miles left) and if the rotors can be turned or not, or if I would suggest just changing the pads and leave the rotors as is.
A good service department would leave you with two estimates. One for Motorcraft parts and one with parts from Autozone/Napa/AdvanceAuto and let YOU decide what you want to pay for parts cost and not try to ram $70+ rotors down your throat.
Chevy use to have a program in the 80s called
I.D.E.A.L.
I Demonstrate Extremely Astute Listening
Anyone that calls a customer up with an additional $850 was not listening to the customer when he said he expected a $160 bill for a tranny flush.
Those things are a useless scam anyways, imo, that benefits the service manager's own pocket. There is almost no car made that is not better off having the pan dropped and the filter changed. But, if they did that then the service manager would not get his "spiff" for every can of flush sold.
Thread Starter
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Elder User
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 547
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From: Northwest Indiana
Originally Posted by rebocardo
>
...
To the original poster, they had absolutely no reason to take your wheels off to inspect your brakes unless you readily agreed to it. You do not remove parts from a customer's car, look in the trunk, play with stereo settings, or search the glovebox without cause and express prior permission.
...
On a brake job, I would have left the measurements of the pads (say 4 mm left. min is 2mm, new is 8 mm, you have about 5k miles left) and if the rotors can be turned or not, or if I would suggest just changing the pads and leave the rotors as is.
...
To the original poster, they had absolutely no reason to take your wheels off to inspect your brakes unless you readily agreed to it. You do not remove parts from a customer's car, look in the trunk, play with stereo settings, or search the glovebox without cause and express prior permission.
...
On a brake job, I would have left the measurements of the pads (say 4 mm left. min is 2mm, new is 8 mm, you have about 5k miles left) and if the rotors can be turned or not, or if I would suggest just changing the pads and leave the rotors as is.
I agree on the brakes. I never have rotors turned anymore. First there is usually not enough thickness on the newer rotors and most places do it on a machine similar to a lathe. The finnish they leave is so rough it just eats half of the new pad breaking in. If the rotors are warped, gouged, or have cracks I just buy new ones.
Post Fiend
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 14,947
Likes: 6
From: Topsfield, MA
Can't we all get along? lol...
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Please read our forum guidelines (link in my sig) and get to know them if you havn't already.
From the guidelines...
Ford Truck Enthusiasts (FTE) is a Family Friendly web site. Do not
post mean-spirited, badgering, foul language, sexually explicit,
racial epithets, derogatory or defamatory content, in any form.
Good day...
Post Fiend
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 13,873
Likes: 3
From: Atlanta GA
Yea, I agree on the rotors, I never have people turn their rotors. Turning costs $10-$15 each and considering new ones are about $30 for anything except hd trucks, it is not worth it, especially when you count the labor and replacing the seals. I have never had people with daily drivers complain about brake problems putting pads on unturned rotors as long as they are not deeply grooved. Especially knowing the cost$.