O/D Blink - P0741 code
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O/D Blink - P0741 code
I have a 96 Explorer with Trans code T (4R55E ?) and 115k.
About a week ago the O/D light started to blink and trans started shifting hard.
I took it to all the auto places and no codes
After lots of reading on this board I figured out that it was most likely T/C lockup issue. A scan by transmission place confirmed this. Code was P0741 Torque Converter Clutch Circuit Performance or Stuck Off . This doesn't mean a whole lot to me.
I have read from the previous posts that it could possibly be a solenoid, bad valve body or a new T/C. I am hoping for the first 2 which I can possibly do myself.
I also saw others with VCC and TPS problems that would cause something similar. I don't have any of the symptoms of either.
My question is where do I start? The transmission place is of course recommending a new T/C and transmission.
H E L P!
About a week ago the O/D light started to blink and trans started shifting hard.
I took it to all the auto places and no codes
After lots of reading on this board I figured out that it was most likely T/C lockup issue. A scan by transmission place confirmed this. Code was P0741 Torque Converter Clutch Circuit Performance or Stuck Off . This doesn't mean a whole lot to me.I have read from the previous posts that it could possibly be a solenoid, bad valve body or a new T/C. I am hoping for the first 2 which I can possibly do myself.
I also saw others with VCC and TPS problems that would cause something similar. I don't have any of the symptoms of either.
My question is where do I start? The transmission place is of course recommending a new T/C and transmission.
H E L P!
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From: Willamette Valley, Oregon
there are two very common problems that could be causing your concern.
one: these transmissions have a problem with blowing out the valve body gaskets and causing all kinds of shift concerns.
second: The intermediate and o/d servos cause these issues also.
I would drop the pan and see if anything is in the pan. then inspect the valve body closely (with out removing it) and see if youcan see if the gasket has pooched out specially around the solenoids and rear servo.
then let us know what you find.
one: these transmissions have a problem with blowing out the valve body gaskets and causing all kinds of shift concerns.
second: The intermediate and o/d servos cause these issues also.
I would drop the pan and see if anything is in the pan. then inspect the valve body closely (with out removing it) and see if youcan see if the gasket has pooched out specially around the solenoids and rear servo.
then let us know what you find.
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Thanks for the reply!
Pulled the pan this morning.
Fluid looks good. No metal or anything in the pan. Just a little grey matter attached to the magnet.
I inspected the gasket around the perimiter of the valve body. No pooching.
There is 1 solenoid (closest to the rear) that seems to move aorund a tad more than the others.
I did some further reading and saw something that says the P0741 code is set after the PCM tries to engage the lockup clutch 5 times unsuccessfully. Anyone know how it determines whether it is not engaging the solenoid at all, or if it is just slipping. I don't feel it even try to engage the lockup so I am leaning toward the lockup not even getting engaged.
Where to go from here? I was thinking about changing the lockup solenoid. But I need to figure out which one it is first.
Pulled the pan this morning.
Fluid looks good. No metal or anything in the pan. Just a little grey matter attached to the magnet.
I inspected the gasket around the perimiter of the valve body. No pooching.
There is 1 solenoid (closest to the rear) that seems to move aorund a tad more than the others.
I did some further reading and saw something that says the P0741 code is set after the PCM tries to engage the lockup clutch 5 times unsuccessfully. Anyone know how it determines whether it is not engaging the solenoid at all, or if it is just slipping. I don't feel it even try to engage the lockup so I am leaning toward the lockup not even getting engaged.
Where to go from here? I was thinking about changing the lockup solenoid. But I need to figure out which one it is first.
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I paid the money for ALLDATA and figured out which solenoid it is. Since it is only $62 I figured i would go ahead and replace it.
Now my question is... do I have to remove the valve body to replace this?
what is the best method to replace? ALLDATA is kinda weak in that area.
anything else I should do while I got the pan down and Im in the mood to replace things?
Now my question is... do I have to remove the valve body to replace this?
what is the best method to replace? ALLDATA is kinda weak in that area.
anything else I should do while I got the pan down and Im in the mood to replace things?
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From: Willamette Valley, Oregon
make sure and look closely at the gasket. it also can be blown out around the area of the solenoid and you would not see it only if you removed the valve body. removal can be a messy job, but if the gasket is blown out it is worth it. if you do, when reinstalling the valve body the updated torque spec is 100 inch pounds and there are different lengths of bolts for it. so if you install four bolts and let the assembly hang, then you can try each bolt and make sure they are in the right hole.
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I got the solenoid and gasket. Now for the big question. When I take down the valve body, is anything (besides fluid) going to come out? I don't want to end up with a pile of parts flying out that I have no idea where they go.
Do I also have to take off the reverse servo cover when removing the valve body? If so.. guess I will be needing another gasket.
Thanks for the heads up about the new torque specs.
FYI... for anyone else attempting this, the ALLDATA info gives a photo with the lengths for each bolt and tightening sequence so that should go easy.
Do I also have to take off the reverse servo cover when removing the valve body? If so.. guess I will be needing another gasket.
Thanks for the heads up about the new torque specs.
FYI... for anyone else attempting this, the ALLDATA info gives a photo with the lengths for each bolt and tightening sequence so that should go easy.
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From: Willamette Valley, Oregon
yes on the reverse servo, the bolts hold part of the metal plate that is sandwiched by the valve body gaskets. take off the servo cover first. just make sure and lower the valve body assembly down flat. I usually leave one bolt snug tight in the middle and remove the rest, then hold the valve body with one hand and remove the last bolt with the other.
you will need a reverse servo, separater plate to case, separater plate to valve body, and trans pan gaskets and a trans filter.
there are alignment pins that help align the valve body to the case. I think that you can use the bolts to align it, but have never done it without the pins. Take car when removing the wiring connectors they will be brittle.
you will need a reverse servo, separater plate to case, separater plate to valve body, and trans pan gaskets and a trans filter.
there are alignment pins that help align the valve body to the case. I think that you can use the bolts to align it, but have never done it without the pins. Take car when removing the wiring connectors they will be brittle.
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Well after what seemed like an eternity, I go the thing back together.
I tried to order the servo from NAPA and they got 2 different ones. Neither was right and the dealer wanted $180 so I just ended up replacing the valve body gasket.
Now that I got it all back together it still has the same problem.
I took it over to the transmission shop to inquire about replacing the Torque Converter and the guy there spent the better part of an hour trying to convince me that a torque converter wasn't going to fix the problem and that I need to have the transmission overhauled to the tune of $2400. He said that it is most likely the pump seal that is causing the problem and there is a TSB on it.
Is he trying to pull a fast one on me?
How much should it cost to overhaul the transmission?
And is that what needs to be done?
According to ALLDATA it should be 13 hours. At $80 hour that is about $1050. How much can parts be? Im guessing at $80 hr. I cant imagine it is more than that.
I tried to order the servo from NAPA and they got 2 different ones. Neither was right and the dealer wanted $180 so I just ended up replacing the valve body gasket.
Now that I got it all back together it still has the same problem.
I took it over to the transmission shop to inquire about replacing the Torque Converter and the guy there spent the better part of an hour trying to convince me that a torque converter wasn't going to fix the problem and that I need to have the transmission overhauled to the tune of $2400. He said that it is most likely the pump seal that is causing the problem and there is a TSB on it.
Is he trying to pull a fast one on me?
How much should it cost to overhaul the transmission?
And is that what needs to be done?
According to ALLDATA it should be 13 hours. At $80 hour that is about $1050. How much can parts be? Im guessing at $80 hr. I cant imagine it is more than that.
Last edited by fishdick; Mar 10, 2005 at 05:42 PM.
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From: Willamette Valley, Oregon
I'd still look at the two servos on the passenger side like I mention earlier. I would change those out before I got an overhaul. The servos you will need are the intermediate and over drive (basic Ford part #7D021) you will need two and they are available from Ford. they are external and are the same servo for both applications. If the over drive servo has hardened then it isnt sealing and will not function as designed.
So after this, you will have done all the external repairs that should have fixed the problem. Solenoid, valve body gasket, servos.
So after this, you will have done all the external repairs that should have fixed the problem. Solenoid, valve body gasket, servos.
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I can't see how the intermediate or overdrive servos would affect the torque converter lockup.
Have you checked the wiring to the lockup solenoid? It could be an open circuit. It could also be a stuck valve in the valve body. The lockup solenoid controls a valve, and if this valve won't move it will set a P0741.
Have you checked the wiring to the lockup solenoid? It could be an open circuit. It could also be a stuck valve in the valve body. The lockup solenoid controls a valve, and if this valve won't move it will set a P0741.
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From: Willamette Valley, Oregon
yeah true, I was getting tired and helping another guy with an OD problem. I should have had him check the valve in valve body when it was out. Those servos are just a weak point in that transmission family and are easy to replace so I always suggest it.
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From: Willamette Valley, Oregon
Hey Fishdick, take the pan down and the front soleniod on the drivers side is the TCC soleniod, is that the one you replaced? if so, there is a piston type valve behind it. See if that valve moves SMOOTHLY in and out. If it does then you probably have an internal problem, but probably doesnt need a full on overhaul. I remember the seal problem and you can get to it by pulling the transmission and removing the torque converter. The seal is on the snout of the pump and when Ford built the transmissions they were not careful about installing the torque converters and would gall the seal. Then after time it would wear down and quit sealing. do you have the capabilities to remove the trans?
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I did not end up replacing the TCC solenoid.
I ordered 2 from NAPA and neither were the right one.
I went to the dealer and they wanted $180. (Solenoid was $35 from NAPA) so I never changed it.
Let me give you bit more background and a recap. Last year I had a power flush done (no pan drop). After that the TCC started slipping so I then changed the filter and the problem went away as long as I didn't get on it too hard when it was trying to lockup.
Last month the O/D light started blinking with P0741.
I dropped the pan changed the filter. Didn't fix
Then I changed the valve body gaskets. Didn't fix.
I was still thinking about changing the TCC solenoid. IS there a generic OEM part I can use? The part # I have is E5TZ7F037A which is supposed to be $62.
I ordered 2 from NAPA and neither were the right one.
I went to the dealer and they wanted $180. (Solenoid was $35 from NAPA) so I never changed it.
Let me give you bit more background and a recap. Last year I had a power flush done (no pan drop). After that the TCC started slipping so I then changed the filter and the problem went away as long as I didn't get on it too hard when it was trying to lockup.
Last month the O/D light started blinking with P0741.
I dropped the pan changed the filter. Didn't fix
Then I changed the valve body gaskets. Didn't fix.
I was still thinking about changing the TCC solenoid. IS there a generic OEM part I can use? The part # I have is E5TZ7F037A which is supposed to be $62.
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From: Willamette Valley, Oregon
It sounds like the "power flush" flushed some particles into the valve body and maybe is causing your trouble. I never recommend the flushes. I always would do a full transmission service so that you can see if anything is in the pan. I do not think that it is the seal problem but a dirty valve body. there is a possibilty that the TCC soleniod could have been affected and might have a particle in it causing it not to completely operate as designed. I would try the TCC solenoid, I dont know if there is any other options for purchase except Ford but you might check and while the old one is out, gently insert into the hole a blunt rod and see if the valve moves smoothly in the bore. To remove the solenoid, you will need to remove the metal bar that hold it in place. when you put it all back together, it will take aroung 4-6 quarts of fluid but start with 3 and check the level. I hope this ends your troubles