Limited Slip
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Junior User
Joined: Dec 2004
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From: Greensboro, NC
Limited Slip
Would someone enlighten me on L/S? The other day I found a spot where I could get one side of the back wheels on the ice and the other side on dry pavement. I tried this with pass. side on ice and then drivers side on ice. Same resulet!
There is a tag on the rear-end that has 4.11/4.10 L.S. It's a dana 80 on a dulley. I would assume Limited Slip. I read here while back, jack up rear end, trans in netural, turned one side of wheels and the other side turned the oppisite direction, thus L/S?? Correct??
Question: With L/S if one side was to spin, shouldn't the other side start pulling?
On the ice, I let cut it loose and trans. shifted into second gear and still spinning with spedo increasing. Also I tilted the mirrors to see what was going on. Problem, the wheels on the dry pavement did not seem to be pulling, seemed the only forward movement was from spinning wheels.
What's up with this? I didn't put it in 4wd, but you shouldn't have to do anything with front axle to get rear axle to work...I wasn't stuck just playing around with the rear end...Thanks for taking the time with me.
There is a tag on the rear-end that has 4.11/4.10 L.S. It's a dana 80 on a dulley. I would assume Limited Slip. I read here while back, jack up rear end, trans in netural, turned one side of wheels and the other side turned the oppisite direction, thus L/S?? Correct??
Question: With L/S if one side was to spin, shouldn't the other side start pulling?
On the ice, I let cut it loose and trans. shifted into second gear and still spinning with spedo increasing. Also I tilted the mirrors to see what was going on. Problem, the wheels on the dry pavement did not seem to be pulling, seemed the only forward movement was from spinning wheels.
What's up with this? I didn't put it in 4wd, but you shouldn't have to do anything with front axle to get rear axle to work...I wasn't stuck just playing around with the rear end...Thanks for taking the time with me.
Posting Guru
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From: Morgantown WV
The tag should say limited traction. On monday I had to lock the hubs and go to 4wd in the same type of situation. One rear wheel in ice and one on pavement. My truck only has 60k on it. I guess I'll put a Detroit Locker in it.
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>turned one side of wheels and the other side turned the oppisite direction, thus >L/S?? Correct??
I'm not sure how a l/s would act in that test. But I can tell you that a open diff will that. I think limited slips have clutches that can burn up, if they are, that will leave you with basically a open diff. How many miles are on the rig?
I'm not sure how a l/s would act in that test. But I can tell you that a open diff will that. I think limited slips have clutches that can burn up, if they are, that will leave you with basically a open diff. How many miles are on the rig?
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Junior User
Joined: Dec 2004
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From: Greensboro, NC
Gary, I understand what you are saying, but i guess don't understand what a open rearend should do...and/or exactlly how a L/S should act...Even the stealership I visited before I replaced the wheel seals said it was a L/S and to add the additive. No the fluid did not get low enough to hurt anything, or at least I don't think so, 1/2" below plug, based on that there was fluid at the bearings when I changed seals. I'm going to jack it again tomorrow and spin the drivers side wheels to make sure I didn't have a case of the dislicska (spelling) or maybe it's alzhimmers...
Kawika, are you saying that with the ice under the wheel there wasn't enough traction for the L/S to work?
Think I'll take this to the Clutch, Trans. Diff. forum or what ever it is. Thanks alot for everybodys input and time!
Kawika, are you saying that with the ice under the wheel there wasn't enough traction for the L/S to work?
Think I'll take this to the Clutch, Trans. Diff. forum or what ever it is. Thanks alot for everybodys input and time!
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Senior User
Joined: Nov 2004
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From: Georgia
The limited slip differental is basicly held in a bind by a strong spring. It has has a set of clutches that will allow the differental to slip when the pressure on one side greatly exceedes the presure on the other side when while turning sharp or otherwise putting more force on one tire then the other. It doesn't help a lot in most situations and the clutches tend to wear out or burn up early on leaving you with what amounts to a standard open differental. They sell friction aditive to help extend the life of limited slips which may help some but the only real way to asure you will have both wheels under power is to install a spool or locking differental.
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From: sacramento
The way you described your axle is exactly how an open differential should act.
with the rearend jacked up and in park
for an open rearend when you rotate the tire the other tire will spin the other direction.
for an LS the wheels will both turn the same direction.
The spring provides an initial force to keep the slipping downand to help ramp up the clutches. the real work is done by the clutches once the wheels start going diffrent speeds. Theoretically the bigger the differential in speed the more pressure will be put to the slipping wheel.
LS are a help but no where near a locker. LS work okay in high speed low torque situations. (work great on mustangs and what not) put are pretty much useless on low speed high torque situation (like a jeep crawling in the rocks in lowrange)
You can measure the breakaway torque by leaving the car in gear jacking up one wheel and using a torque wrench to see at what point the wheel will start spinning on regular half ton rearends 50-70 ft lbs is normal. I didn't measure mine but I could not spin it just by grabbing onto the wheel and my truck has 190k miles on it.
with the rearend jacked up and in park
for an open rearend when you rotate the tire the other tire will spin the other direction.
for an LS the wheels will both turn the same direction.
The spring provides an initial force to keep the slipping downand to help ramp up the clutches. the real work is done by the clutches once the wheels start going diffrent speeds. Theoretically the bigger the differential in speed the more pressure will be put to the slipping wheel.
LS are a help but no where near a locker. LS work okay in high speed low torque situations. (work great on mustangs and what not) put are pretty much useless on low speed high torque situation (like a jeep crawling in the rocks in lowrange)
You can measure the breakaway torque by leaving the car in gear jacking up one wheel and using a torque wrench to see at what point the wheel will start spinning on regular half ton rearends 50-70 ft lbs is normal. I didn't measure mine but I could not spin it just by grabbing onto the wheel and my truck has 190k miles on it.
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Joined: Nov 2004
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From: Georgia
Gary E,
Bear with me, wanted to see if we were on the same page. The clutches and plates do not supply any energy or force. They are more of a contol or regulator in the set up, there to hold or slip depending on the torsion of each of the axles as compared to the force compressing the cluthes such as the spring or force generated by motion through the spider gears and axle gears. Sitting stuck on the ice your only hope is that the spring exerts more force compressing the clutches than the torsion wieght created by the tire with solid footing. Isn't this correct?
Bear with me, wanted to see if we were on the same page. The clutches and plates do not supply any energy or force. They are more of a contol or regulator in the set up, there to hold or slip depending on the torsion of each of the axles as compared to the force compressing the cluthes such as the spring or force generated by motion through the spider gears and axle gears. Sitting stuck on the ice your only hope is that the spring exerts more force compressing the clutches than the torsion wieght created by the tire with solid footing. Isn't this correct?
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From: Braham MN
Originally Posted by Gary E
With the rear off the ground if the tires spin opposite its an open rearend on an LS both will spin the same direction.
This will only hold true IF the truck is in neutral. IF it is in park, or in gear for a manuel then it will still spin in the oposite direction, L/s or open. The internal workings of the spiders, ring gear, and pinion will make it spin opposite directions.
There are clutches and spring packs that are constantly applying force to the spider gears on the axles, when you turn a corner, or one wheel spins faster then the other, the clutches heat up, causing more friction, more drag, and the spider attatched to the axle now has a "friction" binding to the carrier and it wants to spin the same speed as the carrier is. Like gary said effective, but not as good as a locker.
One other way and the easiest is to try and do a power brake on dry tar with both tires, with one on ice there is just to much friction difference between the two tires to get the L/S to work. with both on dry tar they both should spin, if its an open or burned out L/S the passenger side will spin only.
Diesel Rod
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From: Greensboro, NC
Diesel, like I said in the first post, I MUST have had my head up and locked...just jacked it up again, with it in Park engine off I could not turn either wheel by bear hugging them (Auto-trans). In Netural engine off, the rear wheels both turn the SAME direction. In Netural with engine idleing, guess it is the pressure from the pump in the trans, both rear wheels turn forward but can be stopped by hand.
Engine off in park one wheel jacked up, could not turn wheel by hand. Engine off in netural one wheel jacked up, could not turn wheel by hand.
Question, should I be able to spin a stock dulley on dry payvement by power braking?
Think I understand what you were saying about the ice not having enough resistance to make the other wheel spin, may be i need to take it somewhere on gravel or better yet not to throw rocks on the side of it in the mud? what ya think?
Engine off in park one wheel jacked up, could not turn wheel by hand. Engine off in netural one wheel jacked up, could not turn wheel by hand.
Question, should I be able to spin a stock dulley on dry payvement by power braking?
Think I understand what you were saying about the ice not having enough resistance to make the other wheel spin, may be i need to take it somewhere on gravel or better yet not to throw rocks on the side of it in the mud? what ya think?
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From: Braham MN
"Engine off in park one wheel jacked up, could not turn wheel by hand. Engine off in netural one wheel jacked up, could not turn wheel by hand."
Kinda sounds like you have a L/S. It has been so long since I got lucky enough to have a vehicle with a L/S
I forgot if you can turn the wheel by hand like you described. with both wheels on ice mine will just spin one, with both on gravel it will normally spin both for a while, but then it will one wheel, if I turn a corner on ice or gravel it will always one wheel, is pretty sad, open sucks.
I can easily spin my one wheel wonder on dry tar in a power brake, staight through third gear, thats the only cool thing about a one wheel wonder. I dont know about a dually with a L/S butI doubt it, thats alot of wheel on the ground.
Diesel Rod
Kinda sounds like you have a L/S. It has been so long since I got lucky enough to have a vehicle with a L/S
I forgot if you can turn the wheel by hand like you described. with both wheels on ice mine will just spin one, with both on gravel it will normally spin both for a while, but then it will one wheel, if I turn a corner on ice or gravel it will always one wheel, is pretty sad, open sucks. I can easily spin my one wheel wonder on dry tar in a power brake, staight through third gear, thats the only cool thing about a one wheel wonder. I dont know about a dually with a L/S butI doubt it, thats alot of wheel on the ground.
Diesel Rod
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