Rockwells?
Post Fiend
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 8,238
Likes: 3
From: Oregon
Its in the works. I'm looking at getting some property either with a huge shop or building one. Once I have that its rockwells, coilovers, and a four link. Ivan may end up with the huge shop before me, so I may just have to take up occupancy in his parts loft. I wonder how long it will take the wife to realize I'm gone...
Post Fiend
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 11,945
Likes: 3
From: Spokane, WA
What advantage do you feel there will be to the 5 link vs. a triangulated 4 link? I don't like the trac bars because they actually shift you axle from side to side as you cycle your suspension and it would seem to me that there would also be a limitation to articulation with them. I could see using a 5 link in an application where you're not using much lift and a triangulated upper link is going to interfere with crossmembers and the like but that's obviously not going to be an issue with this.
Anyway, just curious. This is going to be a killer truck.
Anyway, just curious. This is going to be a killer truck.
Elder User
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 525
Likes: 0
I am afraid of running an opposing 4 link with crossover steering because it will have a tendency to shift the axle back and forth under the truck and it would have way more bumpsteer than it would with a track bar. I do have another possible setup i have been thinking about, Imagine your pitman arm attached directly to a hydraulic cylinder with the other end mounted solid to the frame, then use the same size cylinder on the tie rod. It would still return to center and you would still have road feel. The only downside would be if you blew a hose but if you used braided stainless aircraft lines it might be safe. Also I dont know how i could get both cylinders full with no air pockets.I might be crazy but it would let me run an opposing four link and not full hydro.
Post Fiend
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 11,945
Likes: 3
From: Spokane, WA
I'll have to do some checking on that but I didn't think the side to side shift was a big problem with the triangulated upper links . . . maybe I'm wrong. Keep in mind that if you run hydro assist and have it setup properly a good deal of your turning force will be between your axle housing and tie rod instead of all between your frame and axle. I wouldn't even think it would be a problem to run full hydro provided Texas doesn't have any laws stating you can't. The only reason I didn't go full hydro is I didn't want the expense. If I go to Rockwells down the road I'll be switching though.
Elder User
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 650
Likes: 0
Jesse- that steering idea is whacked!!!! I like that kind of out of the box thinking. Did you come up with that or did you "borrow" it from somewhere???? Also do your rotors have the proper bolt pattern in them already?? The only larger rotors I have seen have a big 5 lug pattern, although I havent really gotten serious yet about looking.
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Hotshot
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 18,423
Likes: 9
From: iowa
Jesse, just some thoughts on your steering, I like the idea you wouldn't have to worry about bump steer, and can run any lift without problems on steering component angles. And one thing you didn't mention but I think could be done is you could change your ratio, by running a larger cyl on the top ie 1.5" to a 1" on the bottom this would give you a 2:1 steering ratio approx for quicker steering or switch that, and make it lower the ratio, you would have to play with the volume numbers but you could change it easy enough, and with it bieng a closed system you could change it by pulling 4 pins, and swapping out a different set for different situations like road driving to trail running in a matter of minutes.
Post Fiend
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 11,945
Likes: 3
From: Spokane, WA
It's a pretty cool idea but I don't know that it would be any more effective than full hydro. Definitely out of the box though. The one problem I see with a closed system like this is a build up of pressure as the fluid heats up. There would be no way (that I know of) to build a resevoir in this so I have a feeling once you got using it a little you'd be blowing lines or seals.
Elder User
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 525
Likes: 0
wyldstallyn73 the rotors have the same pattern as the rockwells, And I came up with the steering idea a couple weeks ago, I have never seen anyone running anything like it, but I am having a hard time figuring out how to get all the air out of the system, so that may be the down fall of it. Have any ideas on how to bleed the air out? And Ivan you think the fluid woud build heat? I though the main source of heat was the pump no?
Last edited by jesse460; Nov 25, 2004 at 11:28 AM.
Post Fiend
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 11,945
Likes: 3
From: Spokane, WA
Heat is created in hydraulic fluid any time it is compressed. This is why it's very critical that all your hoses and fittings are sized correctly, to reduce the amount of heat buildup that will happen if inlets and hoses are undersized. In a normal system most of this happens in a pump but it also happens in the cylinder itself, which is why coolers are always recommended for hydro applications. Granted, a closed loop syster will not create AS MUCH heat as a pump but it will still create a fair amount and I think it would be enough to cause serious problems here.
That would be a really tough one to bleed as well. It would be a nightmare to get the air out but you'd also have to make sure that both cylinders are exactly centered as they're filled (and each side would have to be filled seperately). What you should do is take this idea to a hydraulic shop and see what they have to say. It would be cool if it worked but in my limited knowlege of hydraulics I can't see how it would. Then again I've been wrong before.
That would be a really tough one to bleed as well. It would be a nightmare to get the air out but you'd also have to make sure that both cylinders are exactly centered as they're filled (and each side would have to be filled seperately). What you should do is take this idea to a hydraulic shop and see what they have to say. It would be cool if it worked but in my limited knowlege of hydraulics I can't see how it would. Then again I've been wrong before.
Elder User
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 650
Likes: 0
If your cylinder on the top were to have ports on top and bottom(I have seen some like this) you could use the bottom ports for the lines and the top ports for "bleeders"- either temporary or permanent. hook a temp resovoir to each bleeder with a push on hose, fill res. with fluid and cycle both lower and upper cylinders independently of each other while keeping res. topped off untill there is no more air coming out, then set your steering box at center, set the tie rod at center and close the bleeders and remove resovoirs. Or replace "bleeders" with plugs- because bleeder ports are on top, fluid will stay in and air will stay out while you replace bleeders with plugs.