I need to replace the wall heater at my grandmother's house. An option that seems very viable are these "ventless" gas wall heaters. My first question about these are how does the heater deal with Carbon Monoxide and other gases released from the burning of fossil fuels without venting?
A problem I face with this option is these heaters legally cannot be sold in California. Would anyone happen to know why this is? Is it something to do with my first question? Any response will be greatly appreciated. Thanks!

 

My suggestion without specific knowledge would be that this is one place California is smarter than the other states. I have been around several ventless heaters and I don't like them.

 

My understanding is that they have CO sensors built in and will shut themselves off should the CO level get too high. Cal is just weird on what they do and don't allow sometimes; I'd suspect the building officials don't have faith in the technology. Moisture may be a concern but I'm not sure on that one. There may be an occasional slight oder. At any rate, the poor homeowner foots the bill and the contractor profits. If I were there I'd hesitate to install the ventless simply because when the property is sold it may become an issue that needs to be fixed. Next, do you need a building permit to install it? If so the ventless will not pass. Finally, a few more things to consider 1) if you proceed to install it, tell the neighbors nothing 2) If it breaks, will a local contractor fix it given it's prohibited? 3) Can you buy parts for it since you can't buy it there to begin with. 4) If you sneak it in without a permit and there is a fire, will insurance pay?

Just a little food for thought.

 

Ventless heaters when operating correctly don’t produce any carbon monoxide. CO is produced from unburned gas. The major issue with these heaters is they need combustion air and in a tightly built home they can burn up the available air for combustion quickly. This causes the flame to produce CO. Most heaters detect this but not before they produce other harmful gasses like nitrogen oxide which will make your eyes burn.

I don’t know why they are not sold in CA but I would guess it’s for these reasons. They are very safe to operate though if they are installed correctly. They need a good supply of combustion air, which most houses already have just from air leakage. If your house is tightly constructed you can add a small air duct for outside air.

If you are removing a wall space heater that already has a flue ran, I would just install another one like it.


Gregg

 

Towtruck has it right. We use wall "infrared" heaters here in the area where I live with no problems. Most homes are not air tight so combustion air is no problem.

 

I used a ventless propane heater to heat my boat for the three winters I lived aboard (in Michigan). They don't have a CO sensor, but they do have an oxygen depletion sensor. It put out plenty of heat, but moisture was a huge issue. If you can install another vented heater, I would go that route.

 

My two cents

I do weatherization work and my take on this is really quite simple. No matter what type of combustion appliance it is it is going to create moisture and CO. I refuse to do any type of insulation work if one of these is installed because you are taking a huge risk on tightening up a home and having a potential CO problem. I know your question isn't regarding adding insulation but lets face it that sould be something that will happen in the future. I truely believe these were invented to be installed into like a seasonal porch or something that has a constant draft/air movement source. Putting this into a home is just a problem waiting to happen. Almost as good as setting a bomb but not knowing when it will go off.
Basically I would say go a different route.

 

Another point. How often can you count on your grandmother to get the unit cleaned or the room that it's in. Dirt can also play an important roll in causing CO. Usually elderly aren't up to date when it comes to cleanings/evaluations on the unit or keeping the room the unit is in clean.
Incase you can't tell I'm trying to talk you out of this!

 

I have a chimney in my kitchen that is exposed. I was thinking of using on these in there attched to the chimney and vented out through there as it is not being used for anything anymore. Would there be any suggestions on what type to use. My furnace is really old and I was thinking that I could use somthing like this. Also I have only one vent in my entire upstairs and would be looking to do somthing up there as well any suggestions would help.

 

Hi,

I have a ventless heater in my garage. I got it free from a friend just over a year ago (he bought a house where it was installed in the basement ... they didn't like that and pulled it). The price was right and the plan was for the garage so I wasn't worried about problems with a "tight" house. Having said that, I made it a point to put a good Carbon Monoxide detector in the garage, "just in case."

Here's what I like about it:

1. It's simple and does the job.
2. It had a built-in thermostat so I didn't have to add any external controls.


Here's what I don't like about it:

1. It would be more effective if I added an accessory blower fan (which IS possible), but without it I don't get effective circulation of the warm air, which generally leaves the area from the floor up to about 3 feet much colder than the rest of the room. Do the math ... working on my motorcycles, etc., guess where I spend most of my time?
2. Despite the fact that it's a "clean-burning" device, there is a distinct "smell" that is survivable in a garage, but I wouldn't tolerate in the house.


Other issues...

DO NOT install the gas lines or the heater yourself -- have a professional do it and make sure you get a proper permit from the authorities (if required) to do it right. The reason is twofold:

1. Your life is worth whatever it costs for proper installation.
2. If the heater causes a fire, insurance WILL NOT cover the damage or loss of life.

3. See reasons 1. and 2.

Hope this is helpful. I'm happy with mine, but if I knew then what I know now I probably would have sold the ventless and had a fan forced vented installed instead. A buddy of mine has a really slick unit that is almost flush with the wall and does a great job of heating a three bay garage very quickly.

Best Regards,
Steve

 

Is an electric heater an option??

 

That is all is have used to heat my house with for 15 years. It is a small propane ventless heater and I have a Co dector and it has never registered a level of more than 1! It cost me about $200.00 a year to heat my house and it stays warm. The plus is it does not require and electric and I have heat the 1-3 weeks the power is out from snow and ice each winter. I would never use anything but this!
With that said you need to check local code and laws plus check your insurance policy. Some will let you install a unit for emergencies and other will not insure you or local code will not permit the use. Some places and insurance does not care.