What I want to know is if all of our dealers are comitting fraud?

They charge us for 15 quarts, yet they only drain out 13.5 qts and refill with 13.5 - 14 qts... (either on purpose or on accident)?

Yes, the capacity is 15, but only 13.5 drains out... yet they charge you for oil they NEVER put in... or did and it is overfilled.

Per FTE rules, I am not looking to talk about lawsuits or start one... but it raises a very pertinent question of why Ford does not send out a "Broadcast message" and Service update to only charge for oil actually drained.

Anyone have any thoughts??

Thanks,

Jeff

 

I started changing my own oil two changes ago. The first time, I put in 15, just like Ford says they were doing. The oil level always was at the extreme upper tip of the dipstick, just about 1/16 of an inch from the wire,sometimes it was on the wire,how far I can't tell. I used 14 quarts last time, and it is still very high on the dipstick, about 1/8 inch, about where the plastic tapers to go to the wire. This is after letting it drain until a slow drip, filling, then running it around the block, letting it cool for 30 minutes, then checking the level. Next time, I'm going to try 13 qts. to see if I can get it to mid way on the stick. I get an occasional romping idle after a cold start, but no driveability problems. My 6.0 auto CC FX4 is '03, 1-3-03 engine build, got 28,000 miles,motor is stock,except for the replaced #8 injector and turbo rebuild at 1100 miles.

 

Because they can charge for that, how many people know the amount drained out of the pan, they only know...and few do...the amount that is in the manual.

 

I have changed my oil 5 times now, each time I have put in 14-14.5 quarts of fresh oil. Level is not quite up the the upper hash marks on dipstick. No romps, no leaks, just a great running motor. Now about the bulletin on oil level. No where does it say that you add a certain amount of oil and then check for level on hashmarks. What this bulletin is referring to is when you check your oil on a regular basis (to see if you are using any, leaking any, or gaining any) then do not add if level is between the hashmarks. I repeat, nowhere does it say to add oil to the lower level and just leave it when changing oil. Come on people, a little brain thinking will work for all of us. If 13 or 13.5 or whatever is working for you, then use it. If 15 is working for you, then use it. I use 14 or 14.5 (I think my difference is due to small differences either in angle of vehicle, or just my eyesight). I always try to fill back to same place on dipstick every time, that is why sometimes I add 14.5 quarts, I did just that on last oil change at the beginning of this month.

 

Is that the last hash mark UP the dipstick

 

Now that is a good question for the panel.... Are the fluid dynamic properties more conducive to remove residual particles from the pan when the oil is hot, warm or cold.

In my layman's opinion, unless the oil is gelled up, the removing capacities is relatively similar between all states of the oil (thinking along the lines of the grim you find at the bottom of the frier), HOWEVER, the speed at which it drains out of the pan may indeed positively affect the removal process???? Any takers???

Where is Einstein when we need him???

 

luckeydr,
I read/understand the bulletin language the same way you do.
Ford says the difference between MAX and MIN, on the 6.0 PSD dipstick is 2 qts.
What I don't understand, and probably never will, is why Ford is saying that if your dipstick shows your oil is as much as 2 qts low, don't add any oil.
I wonder if people who don't read internet truck forums are happier not facing these dilemmas? More importantly, would I be happier, just driving my truck in blissful ignorance?

 

luckeydr,

Since you have the brains, tell us where in the summary of the bulletin, that it says this is for checking your oil on a regular basis and not after doing an oil change? Do you have the full service bulletin? If so, what does it say?

If you put 15 quarts back in and it works for you, good for you. It has been the experience for many of us that adding 15 quarts during an oil change causes some irregular idle performance.

Yes, acccording to the owner manual diesel supplement, it does read that there is two quarts between "Min" and "Max". So if according to the bulletin, you check your oil and see you are just above the "MIN" one would think to add a quart, but no you shouldn't. Do you think that the engineers might have found what some of us did, that simply "MAX" line might cause problems?

 

Hot is best for removing particles because the viscosity has been reduced and the dirt collected. Thus when it flows out the dirt goes with it.

Warm would work as well, just stay away from cold changes.

 

Never thought about that one; I've always just assumed it was because the oil flows easier. Hmm

Doesn't do too much good when the *particles* are too big to pass through the drain plug (see gallery)

I've always drained mine at a "lukewark" level. I'll keep that in mind next time I give it a change...

 

I am not sure that piston skirts and other miscellaneous parts are considered particles, well at least we know for normal folks it is not…..You might be tester for Ford…if your….

 

Post deleted due to duplicate

 

SBV45

Yes I do in fact have a lot of brains, got numerous sheep skins to prove it (you could almost call me Doctor, but not quite, but you can call me Professor as I use to teach college courses in computers). Now let’s talk common sense, something I also have, given I have lived quite a while and gained much knowledge from my mistakes/experiences. The bulletin you refer to does not state after an oil change. It is written in such a way as to apply to all instances of when one checks the oil.

The question presented here is how much to oil to refill after draining it. Some have better luck at the lower end of the dipstick markings, some in the middle, some at the upper end of the markings. I am one of those at the upper end of the markings. Being a retired jet engine mechanic, I just don’t like to go around with over 13% of my oil missing, yes 2 quarts out of 15 quarts is a little over 13%.

The purpose of this discussion group is to pass along information, ask questions, and gain knowledge. If only one answer worked for all of us, what a wonderful place this earth would be, but as the oil level question shows, that is not going to happen.

Tim, my oil level is almost to the top of the hash marks on the dipstick, just below where the dipstick goes from flat back to round. This is for all purposes the top of the hash mark area. The most I have ever put back in has been 14.5 quarts and I have done that amount 3 of the 5 times I changed it. On two occasions, I put in 14 and when checked, it was where it has always been so I did not add the ½ quart. When I change my oil, I always put in 14 and check it, add what is necessary to put it at the top of the hash marks, and never had a problem. Guess this goes against the bulletin referred to here since the level is initially in the middle of the hash marks, but I do what works for me. I don’t think Ford will complain since I am one happy camper. This is an awsome engine, and my Excursion is one great vehicle.

Also use Chevron Delo 15W-40 year round. No romps, no smoke, no leaks, no problem. We could get started again on which oil is best and worst for the 6.0 but that is old news. I live in Virginia Beach, VA where the winters are mild so with that in mind, remember what works for some doesn’t work for all as this engine has proven.

My advise to anyone who has questions about how much, what to use, etc is to read all you can, make an informed decision and try it. Educate yourself, evaluate what you learned, apply it and learn from your mistakes. Pass along your new knowledge (when applicable) so others can learn, this is called life.

 

I am coming up on my first oil change. From the info I learned here I already purchased a Fumoto and have a 5 gallon bucket ready to go.

To satisfy my curiosity I will graduate the bucket with premeasured quantities of water at 13, 13.5, 14 and 15 qts to see how much is drained and how much remains.

This will serve as a benchmark to the minimum amount or oil required and then I can add from there.

I'll let you know how it goes.

 

Please do let us know.
I would like to have this info.
TIA.