starter problems & Update
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starter problems
I've got a '78 1/2 ton 4x4 with a newer 400. After it has been running, it turns over harder than heck, to the point where it won't start sometimes. Let it cool down, and it starts just fine. I know the first reaction is to say the starter is bad, but I bought this truck from a friend, who sold it to me because after he put the new motor in, it was going through starters like crazy. So, it has a newer starter on it already. I have a spare starter laying around I'm going to throw on just for the heck of it, but does anybody have any ideas of what it could be if that one does the same thing?
Postmaster
Joined: Feb 2003
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From: Kentucky
My 79 351m was doing that, I was told the starter was too close to the exhaust header pipe causing the starter to get too hot. It did the slow , battery almost dead type cranking start thing, a lot worse in slow city driving. But on cold or cool starts the same day, it would do great,
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Joined: Jan 2004
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From: Franklin, GA
It can be caused by heat from the exhaust, especially if you have headers. A heat shield, the kind that has the insulation attached, might help.
Another consideration that I have experienced, is to check all your battery cable ends at the battery and where they attach at the block (ground) and the solenoid. Make sure all connection points are clean and tight. Heat will magnify resistence enough to cause slow hot cranking as a result of corosion at connections.
Have the battery load tested just to rule that out.
Last, smaller battery and starter cables tend to get weak and produce more resistence when heated. If you have stock or small guage cables, consider replacing them with larger diameter ones that will provide more current. Some have even used welding cables to make their own battery and starter cables.
Another consideration that I have experienced, is to check all your battery cable ends at the battery and where they attach at the block (ground) and the solenoid. Make sure all connection points are clean and tight. Heat will magnify resistence enough to cause slow hot cranking as a result of corosion at connections.
Have the battery load tested just to rule that out.
Last, smaller battery and starter cables tend to get weak and produce more resistence when heated. If you have stock or small guage cables, consider replacing them with larger diameter ones that will provide more current. Some have even used welding cables to make their own battery and starter cables.
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thank you,
do they sell heat sheilds at most autoparts stores? I thought about that but didn't know if there was such a thing. The cables look fairly old as well, so I'll try replacing them also. I'm pretty sure its heat related since it doesn't act up near as much in the winter.
do they sell heat sheilds at most autoparts stores? I thought about that but didn't know if there was such a thing. The cables look fairly old as well, so I'll try replacing them also. I'm pretty sure its heat related since it doesn't act up near as much in the winter.
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Joined: Jan 2004
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From: Franklin, GA
I've seen the heat "blanket" shields in chain stores and I've seen home made shields made from muffler and catalytic converter heat shields. Both seemed to have solved the problems associated with the vehicles they were used on.
If you upgrade the cables, be sure to wire brush the block where the ground cable attaches.
If you upgrade the cables, be sure to wire brush the block where the ground cable attaches.
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From: Brentwood,CA
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starter problem Updated
I'm still having problems.
I've got a '78 4x4, 400 with auto tranny.
the thing is eating up starters like mad. Before, I thought it was a heat related problem because it would turn over hard and sometimes not even start, but only after it had been running and it would only happpen in the summer.
Now its the dead of winter, and its turning over fine, but it sounds like its stripping out the "drive gear". The starter will sound like its grinding. At first I thought my flywheel was shot, but it looks fine. So anyway, the starter will start to make this horrible grinding noise, till eventually the starter just spins without engageing the flywheel. When I took one starter back, the guy told me it looks like oil is leaking onto the starter, and that might be recking them.
Any ideas.
I've got a '78 4x4, 400 with auto tranny.
the thing is eating up starters like mad. Before, I thought it was a heat related problem because it would turn over hard and sometimes not even start, but only after it had been running and it would only happpen in the summer.
Now its the dead of winter, and its turning over fine, but it sounds like its stripping out the "drive gear". The starter will sound like its grinding. At first I thought my flywheel was shot, but it looks fine. So anyway, the starter will start to make this horrible grinding noise, till eventually the starter just spins without engageing the flywheel. When I took one starter back, the guy told me it looks like oil is leaking onto the starter, and that might be recking them.
Any ideas.
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Elder User
Joined: Jul 2002
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From: BC, Canada
Are you sure the starters are seated all the way into the cover plate? It the hole in the plate is damaged or not round for some reason the starter will not go all the way in and then the bendix gear won't engage the ring gear properly. This will prematurely wear out the bendix gear.
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Joined: Sep 2003
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From: Hartland, MI
One thought that may not be related to the grinding is a good ground. I have seen many times that people paint their parts prior to installing them. This paint between the engine/trans/trans plate and starter inhibits a good ground for the starter (grounds through the starter body to bellhousing connection). This has been the cause of many slow crankers in the past.
Zac
Zac
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Joined: Dec 2001
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From: b.c. canada
Man its the dead of winter right now and my 85 f150 300 i6 is doing the exact same thing, tho i havent been replacing starters my starter is acting the same way, i havent pulled it yet to look at the ring gear or starter gear... It seems much much worse when its cold, if I plug the truck in all is well, any other time and i have problems....
i cant really shed any light but ill be monitering this site for ideas for myself..
-gbm-
i cant really shed any light but ill be monitering this site for ideas for myself..
-gbm-
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From: okc
Originally Posted by ford390gashog
it sounds like your timing is way too advanced you need to retard it or use a high torque starter
i second that...... too much advance will make the motor work against itself when starting, ive seen it too many times.....as far as oil getting on the starter, definitly a possibility, check the valve cover gaskets and replace if neccesary......
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From: ct.
What kind of starters are you buying? I actually had the auto parts store give me the wrong starter on an old truck I had. It would work fine for a short time then the thing would stop engaging correctly. Once I got the correct one the problem dissapeared. Go directly to Ford and match up the nose cone with a starter they give you to see if it is the same?
The oil is another issue. If you rear main seal is leaking that bad and ruining the starter that should be fixed. It has nothing to do with the grinding or engaging though.
Have you checked your flywheel for broken or missing teeth?
The oil is another issue. If you rear main seal is leaking that bad and ruining the starter that should be fixed. It has nothing to do with the grinding or engaging though.
Have you checked your flywheel for broken or missing teeth?
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Thanks for the help.
I'm thinking it could either be timing, or the starter not fitting exactly right.
I don't think its the flywheel, that was my first thought, but it looks good from what I can see.
I've been paying really close attention lately. It seems to make a funny noise when the starter DISengages the flywheel. I don't know how to describe it, it just sounds funny. kind of sounds like hitting two pieces of metal together.
I'm going try to nurse it along and keep adding starters till ice fishing season is over, then I'll see what I can figure out. I'll post it if I find out what it is.
I'm thinking it could either be timing, or the starter not fitting exactly right.
I don't think its the flywheel, that was my first thought, but it looks good from what I can see.
I've been paying really close attention lately. It seems to make a funny noise when the starter DISengages the flywheel. I don't know how to describe it, it just sounds funny. kind of sounds like hitting two pieces of metal together.
I'm going try to nurse it along and keep adding starters till ice fishing season is over, then I'll see what I can figure out. I'll post it if I find out what it is.