As some of you may recall, I posted about a blue puff once in a while out the exhaust of my V10. Others have posted about this in the past, a "few" people have had the same thing.

Some background first:

Start the truck cold, move it a few feet, shutdown within a minute or two. Startup the next day, blue PUFF out the exhaust. Looks just like oil smoke, "medium blue" I'd call it.

Originally, I had been changing the oil and filling up to the FULL mark, unlike Ford's directions that say "6 qts", period. Thought it might be overfilled, started putting in only 6 qts. I thought I had it licked, because it hadn't happened for a LONG time, almost a year, even though the conditions were perfect many times.

It's back, the other day I did the exact same thing, next morning, blue puff... oh well.

I know some people think it's too much fuel, but I have done things like revved it up just after starting, move it, then rev it a few more times, idle 10 seconds, then shutdown. Same thing this last time, but still got the blue puff.

I have just turned over 14K miles (on a truck manufactured 10/00), but others here have reported that it happens later in life too. I use 5w30 Castrol GTX.

It bugs me, that's all, but sometimes, it's fouled the plugs, and have to really get on it to clean it out. Not a good thing.

Any ideas anyone? Is it as simple as the pan is not deep enough and the crank sits in a pool of oil, and when you start it, it throws the oil everywhere, but because of the 10-cylinder's worth of valve-train, the crank is not sitting in oil after it's running a while? The cylinders are coated with oil, then, if you don't keep the motor running, it doesn't burn it off slowly but pools in the cylinders? is this why I have no piston slap on startup?

PVC system sucking it back in? One thing - if the V10 needs a balance shaft because the pistons moving up and down don't cancel each other, balance-wise, then the crankcase pressure is not going to remain static either - it will go vacuum, then pressure, then vacuum (or some other complicated wave, but you get the idea). Could it be just random chance (if first crank is a pressure wave in the crankcase) , with the IAC wide-open (engine was cold when shutdown, so IAC will begin at wide-open or close) that it'll push/pull oil into the throttle body through the crankcase breather?

 

I think it has to do with the PCM data not being able to stabilize the fuel/air mixture due to the engine not warming up enough. IMHO – The fuel/air system is “naked” or “blind” at first start-up and has to be told how much needs to enter the engine. This may take as long as 30 minutes, I can’t say for sure. But, it only makes sense to me (mine does the same thing at almost 90K) because after only a few minutes of run-time and then it’s shutoff, the next startup stumbles and misses for awhile. I can’t smell oil at all, more like pre-detonation fuel odor and a bluish smoke. Remember how the old 429’s would smell early of a morning with that cheap leaded gas back in the early-70’s? That’s what it reminds me of. So many things have to come into play: O2 sensors, MAF sensors, IAC, Injectors, Plugs, etc. and have to work in unison.

It just doesn’t seem like there’s sufficient time for this all to take place in under 30 minutes.

 

Does it happen on the 5.4's ?

 

Mine's done it since new and it still does it at 55K. When new the dealer said don't worry but keep an eye on the oil consumption. At 55k it uses less than 1/4 quart between 5000 mile changes.

The odd thing is, it will only do it after I start it, move it a few feet, and leave it in the cold all night (a real cold night here is below 40). I do the same routine now except I move it from the driveway to the garage at night. The garage stays in the 60's or better all night. I check it every morning and I can't get it to puff and I can't miss it because I have a keyless remote start and I can watch for it. Several weeks ago I had to leave it in the side yard overnight, and poof!, first time I saw it in months.

 

The fuel/air system is “naked” or “blind” at first start-up
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Sorry I had to copy that lol it's called open loop, the ecm goes into open loop untill it has time to get the proper readings, probally still not the problem of the blue smoke.

 

Krewat,

My 2001 V-10 with 32,000 miles has done the "blue puff of smoke on startup" thing from time to time with no rhyme or reason.

Currently, all is well... I split my daily drive between 2 vehicles, so my Super Duty sometimes sits for several days between uses. It is normally parked in my driveway which has a slight nose up grade. Not sure if this contributes to the "phenomena".

Will report back if the blue puff returns...

Edmo

 

Now that we (or at least I) have lost our signatures, my truck is:

2001 F250 XLT V10 SC SB 3.73LS auto

Gee, another waste of storage space...

 

I always try to keep it simple. Some appreciate it, some don't. As far as "not the problem", I haven't heard a better one yet.

Krewat,
I have not heard of the 5.4 doing this.

 

If open-loop was a problem, you'd see it in the 4.6 and 5.4, at the very least, as well as every other vehicle with a computer.

If the 5.4 isn't doing it, I'm starting to think it's the static crankcase pressure/vacuum pulsating, and the correct circumstatnces, oil in the breather, etc, pulling oil into the intake.

Anyone work on the throttle body of their V10 and find oil in or near it?

art k.
--
'01 F250 SD SB SC XLT V10 3.73LS auto
'74 F250 highboy FE390

 

I'm still not convinced that it's oil, krewat. While the engine is still in "Cold Cranking" mode it is literally flooding the cylinders with gas...then you kill it. Where is that fuel going? I believe it stays there until the next startup and the engine has to clear the cylinders before it straightens out.

Just don't really know, but have not heard of even one instance with the 5.4 and my dad and son both have those engines.

Got to be something in the V10 setup.

 

I smell burning oil - I use Castrol dino oil, and the smell is unmistakably oil. And the smoke is BLUE. Sorta a "light blue", but looks just like oil smoke I've seen thousands of times...

This thing is not like a carb, where when you shut it down, the intake is flooded with gas. The injector sprays enough in to fire and run, and if it was running SO rich on startup as to leave unburned fuel in the cylinders, it would blow black at startup, wouldn't it?

If it is raw fuel, like you say, maybe it's a leaky fuel injector bleeding off pressure? I understand gas washing off oil, so it's still possible to get blue smoke in that condition. But I think it would crop up at other times, like leaving it off for 8 hours, and when restarting, it doesn't skip a beat, which a flooded cylinder would certainly do.

One other thing, when I get the blue puff, most of the time, there is a "funny noise" (funny as that sounds), kinda a loud "harumph", sounds like intake noise to me. Quite an upsurge in idle too, at the same time.

One of these spring days, I'm going to take the throttle body off and check it, and the IAC, for fresh oil

Gee, you think I should take it to the dealer? (laughing to myself as I say this)...

 

I get that oily/gas odor, but have not narrowed down to just oil. Maybe a mixture?
I think it can still get "flooded". But not because of a leaky injector, because this (it seems) is limited to the V10 and never happens to the 5.4 (that I know of).

Exactly...more of a growl? I get that, also.

I was told a few days ago by a Ford tech that Ford is gathering all the engineers and all "the best" master mechanics together and have a parley over new problems arising in the maintenance of the V10 and 6.0 PSD engines. Maybe I should email him and let him pose this problem for the bunch?

BTW - if you have the same problem as I do, not many mechanics know as much about our engines as we do.

 

Yeah, a growl, but only on the blue-puff and sometimes I get the blue puff without the growl. But the growl is only at startup on a blue-puff start.

PLEASE ask that tech to pose this question...

Meanwhile, I probably should go to the dealer, there is a slim possibility that they could help. At least it's still under the 3/36 warranty. But I understand your mechanic reference

 

I wish we (FTE) had a Direct-to-Ford-Engineering hotline so that the mods or Ken could send questions like this. It seems to puzzle the technicians or you might get a “I think…” response. If it makes the engine buck then something is wrong somewhere.

I will send that email and see what happens. Maybe there is someone, somewhere that has figured it out and it’s just not made its rounds yet.

Around here when you say "V10", you get that Smegal look followed by, "What? What did you say?"

 

That's why I should really go to the dealer with it, and complain. Get it logged, then, if later they find a reason for it and we hear about it, I stand a better chance of getting it fixed.

I would look at it like an emissions issue - which is sure to get at least SOME response. Or is cold startup excluded from the regs?

I've had it make a cylinder misfire for about 10 seconds, and then clear up slowly until I could really gun it and clean off the plugs. Seemed like oil - gas would have burned off quicker (but may have left a lot of carbon, shorting out the plug causing the same effect)...

Funny thing is, after that long, the check-engine light should have come on, according to OBD II. Didn't. Maybe having 9 cylinders still firing kept the computer from detecting the delta in crankshaft speed...

Ah yes, the Smeagol looks.. utter revulsion, complete fear, or open greed?