Opinions on Order Options, Function vs Value
Lead Driver
Joined: Feb 2022
Posts: 7,999
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That is my understanding as well. If the tow vehicle > 80" wide (example: DRW pickup), the tow vehicle needs the roof clearance lights. If the trailer is >80" wide, the trailer needs the clearance lighting. If the trailer is >80" wide but the tow vehicle is not (ex: SRW pickup), then the tow vehicle does not require the clearance lights but only the trailer does.
I hope @Scott0700 can get the citation because this is far from the first time I have seen people say the truck has to have roof top identification lights if the trailer is over 80 inches wide, and I have yet see any citation of it, usually the people who says so just go radio silent afterward.
The Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration (FMCSA) regulations, specifically 49 CFR Part 393 Subpart B, require specific lighting for commercial motor vehicles (CMVs) based on their width and length. Cab marker lights, more formally known as identification lamps, are required for vehicles that are 80 inches (2032 mm) wide or wider. These identification lamps are required on both the front and rear of such vehicles. The requirement for these identification lamps applies to vehicles classified as B, C, D, G, and H under the FMCSA's vehicle classification system. It is important to note that while the FMCSA mandates these lights, the specific design and certification of the lighting products themselves are governed by the Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standard 108 (FMVSS 108), which requires manufacturers to certify their products as compliant.
https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/49/393.11
https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg/...-sec393-11.pdf
https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-4...section-393.11
Logistics Pro
Joined: May 2021
Posts: 4,076
Likes: 2,363
The Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration (FMCSA) regulations, specifically 49 CFR Part 393 Subpart B, require specific lighting for commercial motor vehicles (CMVs) based on their width and length. Cab marker lights, more formally known as identification lamps, are required for vehicles that are 80 inches (2032 mm) wide or wider. These identification lamps are required on both the front and rear of such vehicles. The requirement for these identification lamps applies to vehicles classified as B, C, D, G, and H under the FMCSA's vehicle classification system. It is important to note that while the FMCSA mandates these lights, the specific design and certification of the lighting products themselves are governed by the Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standard 108 (FMVSS 108), which requires manufacturers to certify their products as compliant.
https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/49/393.11
https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg/...-sec393-11.pdf
https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-4...section-393.11
https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/49/393.11
https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg/...-sec393-11.pdf
https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-4...section-393.11
And btw your third link, I already linked to it and explained in post #52 of this thread, where it is clear the identification lamp requirement applies to the tow vehicle only if the tow vehicle itself is over 80 inches wide.
I eagerly await @Scott0700jumping in and giving us his sources that back up his assertion that a pickup with width under 80" needing identification lamps, any minute now.
Last edited by twobelugas; Oct 29, 2025 at 12:22 PM.
Lead Driver
Joined: Feb 2022
Posts: 7,999
Likes: 4,065
Your citation adds zero clarity to the question. So the vehicle has to have identification lamps if it's over 80 inches wide. I'm glad we all agree on that point. What about the actual use case in question where the trailer is over 80inches but the tow vehicle is not, does the tow vehicle need clearance lamps?
And btw your third link, I already linked to it and explained in post #52 of this thread, where it is clear the identification lamp requirement applies to the tow vehicle only if the tow vehicle itself is over 80 inches wide.
I eagerly await @Scott0700jumping in and giving us his sources that back up his assertion that a pickup with width under 80" needing identification lamps, any minute now.
And btw your third link, I already linked to it and explained in post #52 of this thread, where it is clear the identification lamp requirement applies to the tow vehicle only if the tow vehicle itself is over 80 inches wide.
I eagerly await @Scott0700jumping in and giving us his sources that back up his assertion that a pickup with width under 80" needing identification lamps, any minute now.
Is a pickup towing a trailer considered separate entities
Yes, a pickup truck towing a trailer is generally considered separate entities under transportation regulations and vehicle definitions. The trailer is defined as a vehicle without motive power designed to carry property or passengers, wholly supported by its own structure and drawn by a motor vehicle.The pickup truck, classified as a motor vehicle, is responsible for providing the motive power and control. This distinction is fundamental in both federal and state regulations, where the towing vehicle and the trailer are treated as distinct units for purposes of safety, equipment requirements, and legal compliance.For example, safety chains and brakes are required on the trailer, and specific hitch types must be used to ensure secure connection and prevent separation.Furthermore, in commercial contexts, the trailer is considered a separate unit in combinations such as B-trains or triple trailers, where the trailer's weight and control are governed by specific rules
Logistics Pro
Joined: May 2021
Posts: 4,076
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A pickup truck and a Trailer are considered separate entities, each has their own rules according to the DOT. Which means if the tow vehicle is under 80"s but the trailer is over 80", only the vehicle OVER 80" is required to have clearance lights.
Is a pickup towing a trailer considered separate entities
Is a pickup towing a trailer considered separate entities
Fleet Mechanic
Joined: Aug 2022
Posts: 1,592
Likes: 1,119
[QUOTE=acdii;21688007]The Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration (FMCSA) regulations, specifically 49 CFR Part 393 Subpart B, require specific lighting for commercial motor vehicles (CMVs) based on their width and length. Cab marker lights, more formally known as identification lamps, are required for vehicles that are 80 inches (2032 mm) wide or wider. These identification lamps are required on both the front and rear of such vehicles. [/QUOTE]
Interesting, the tailgate on my 2003 Ram 3500 DRW has lights on it but my 2022 F350 DRW does not....I wonder if the cab mount brake light counts.
Dave
Interesting, the tailgate on my 2003 Ram 3500 DRW has lights on it but my 2022 F350 DRW does not....I wonder if the cab mount brake light counts.
Dave
Hotshot
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 12,360
Likes: 4,394
From: SW VA
No, it does not. The trailer needs the clearance lamps (three center lamps in the rear, just like the ones between the bumper and tailgate on a dually)
Etrailer has a nice guide:
https://www.etrailer.com/faq-trailer...gulations.aspx
Lead Driver
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 5,703
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From: Near Yosemite CA
Hopefully I can get time over winter to get my 302 in my new to me 62 *****, for the same type of release
or I can drive my 66 F100, inline 300, T18, factory radio delete, nothin but pure old driving enjoyment!
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Logistics Pro
Joined: May 2021
Posts: 4,076
Likes: 2,363
No, it does not. The trailer needs the clearance lamps (three center lamps in the rear, just like the ones between the bumper and tailgate on a dually)
Etrailer has a nice guide:
https://www.etrailer.com/faq-trailer...gulations.aspx
Etrailer has a nice guide:
https://www.etrailer.com/faq-trailer...gulations.aspx
Fleet Mechanic
Joined: Aug 2022
Posts: 1,592
Likes: 1,119
I had to go out and look; I've never noticed those lights above the bumper before!
Dave
Thread Starter
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Fleet Mechanic
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 1,772
Likes: 405
From: Logan, Utah
Even on my business vehicles I get Lariats for all of them. I used to pay 8-10k to drive a truck 30k mi. Now I pay $10k to have 5 work trucks that each go 10k mi. Simply by only buying the profitable option.
I always order clearance lights.
The 450s still produce profit with 10k mi.
I always order clearance lights.
The 450s still produce profit with 10k mi.
Last edited by brandon4; Nov 1, 2025 at 06:53 PM.
Thread Starter
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Fleet Mechanic
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 1,772
Likes: 405
From: Logan, Utah
Whiteface Ford did a video on how the best value is in Lariat non Ultimates.
This has been my experience. I believe it is because so many people are willing to pay top dollar for Plats and King Ranches. On the used market it pulls the Lariat prices up.
Is it really worth 10-16 grand to massage your hiney? If you want the leather smell, just put a baseball mit under the seat on a hot day.
This has been my experience. I believe it is because so many people are willing to pay top dollar for Plats and King Ranches. On the used market it pulls the Lariat prices up.
Is it really worth 10-16 grand to massage your hiney? If you want the leather smell, just put a baseball mit under the seat on a hot day.
Cargo Master
Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 2,418
Likes: 1,126
Whiteface Ford did a video on how the best value is in Lariat non Ultimates.
This has been my experience. I believe it is because so many people are willing to pay top dollar for Plats and King Ranches. On the used market it pulls the Lariat prices up.
Is it really worth 10-16 grand to massage your hiney? If you want the leather smell, just put a baseball mit under the seat on a hot day.
This has been my experience. I believe it is because so many people are willing to pay top dollar for Plats and King Ranches. On the used market it pulls the Lariat prices up.
Is it really worth 10-16 grand to massage your hiney? If you want the leather smell, just put a baseball mit under the seat on a hot day.
The highest trim level I order is XLT for our work trucks.
Laughing Gas
Joined: Mar 2024
Posts: 752
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From: SE Vermont, South Jersey
To me, value means nothing if the function I WANT isn't there.
Lead Driver
Joined: Feb 2022
Posts: 7,999
Likes: 4,065
I had Platinum before that, and other than the better leather, leather on the dash and doors, and the massage seats, the Lariat is the same damned truck. In fact the massage seats in the F450 were no where near as good as the ones in the 2018 F150 I had before it. I regret having to give up that truck to have a superduty, but the F150 can't tow a 5th wheel thats 43' long. After having the F450 Platinum, and now have the 24 Lariat, I don't miss the Platinum at all. What I could never see is buying a Limited. now THAT is a waste of money.