If you have a non adjustable 302 valve train, what happens when the rockers are way out of torque?

Thanks
mjac

 

The amount of torque in the bolts will make no real difference. You'll just stretch the bolt more or less but you won't change the amount of preload that you're putting into the valvetrain. As long as you're in the travel range of the hydraulic lifter the performance will be the same.

 

That is what I mean. I understand if they are over torqued you are just stretching the bolt more and not changing the preload, which I think is what you are saying. What if over time, 60-70 thousand miles, the bolts are way under torqued, will that affect performance?

By the way, your one sentence, “ Hot Rod gaskets are too soft and wash out from being exposed to coolant, you use steel reinforced intake manifold gaskets,” saved me from making a huge mistake. I did not know, I thought the un-reinforced Edelbrock gasket was a step up but you read case after case where they wash out around the water jackets or split from expansion especially with aluminum intakes, sometimes within months. Brought the Edelbrock back, got a steel reinforced Fel Pro and am looking for a Cometic or Victor Reinz.

Thanks
mjac

 

If the bolts were way under torqued they would come loose and the rocker arm would fall off. If they aren't doing that then they are adequately tightened.

From my experience the unreinforced style gaskets just don't last very long whenever they are exposed to coolant. In a dry intake situation like on a 351C they seem to last just fine. The ones that have a metal core are much better, stock replacement gaskets are reinforced and if find the ones that fit your ports they will work just fine.

 

So, is there any need for me to pull the valve covers?

No matter what happens from this point forward, that one blurb about getting away from unreinforced intake manifold gaskets helped tremendously, I was all set to put in that Edelbrock Gasket and felt good about it and I would have been right back here again in a short or even a very short period of time.This is the third time changing that gasket, there would have been a fourth.

So, after the manifold is off, just pluck the rods and hydraulic lifters out one at a time, take a lookie look and put them back the exact same way?…Anything else. I am getting the right gaskets, I have got a thread chaser kit, got ARP bolts, rinky dink torque wrench, ACDelco Engine Sealent RTV, that is about it. I am getting different thoughts about the Engine Sealant. Do you let the engine sealant sit for awhile BEFORE torquing down the bolts, if so, for how long. Some people are saying they let it sit overnight, that does not sound right. I am glad I put this off, I would have made several mistakes.

Thanks
mjac

 

I glue the gaskets to the head surface. Weather-strip adhesive dries very quickly. Then I put just a smear of RTV around each of the water ports. The exhaust crossover port can get some too. I just use a small amount. Then I clean the end walls of the block with brake clean or lacquer thinner. Really anything so that there isn't any oil on those surfaces. Then put a nice thick bead of RTV across each end wall before setting the intake in place. Then tighten the bolts. If the RTV squishes out a little messy just leave it alone for a week or so and then trim it off with a utility knife.

I usually allow it sit for 1/2 a day or so before starting but I tighten the bolts right away before the sealer sets up.

Just loosen the rockers and take out the pushrods. Then use a magnet and take a look at each lifter one at a time while you have the engine apart.

 

I don’t want to wear you out but you put weatherstrip adhesive on all of the mating surfaces on the head to glue the gasket down? That doesn’t affect the seal? Why not glue it down with the RTV?

Then you smear a little RTV around the water ports and exhaust crossover on the top side of the gasket. (My manifold has an exhaust port for the EGR valve but my Edelbrock 500cfm Performer Carburetor does not have an EGR valve so I had to plug the exhaust port in the manifold, I found this out the hard way when gases started pumping out at the bottom of the carburetor when I changed risers, the first one covered it) Then it is a tall bead of RTV all the way across the ends and torque down right away. Some guys are letting the RTV set from 1/2 hour to overnight BEFORE torquing down. I don’t feel comfortable with that, it seems it would be uneven.

I think I am going to go all the way to get an idea of the condition of the engine and just a general exercise, compression tests, pull valve covers, inspect the valve train, watch valve train while spinning the motor, loosen the rockers, inspect the rods and lifters, torque everything back down, might not be doing anything but it would be a good exercise I guess.

Thanks
mjac

 

Usually I just go around all of the ports with the glue, along the areas in between too a little bit just so that the gasket sticks to the head and doesn't try to slide down as the intake manifold gets tightened. I would allow the glue to dry for a while, then apply the RTV, install the intake and tighten the bolts.

Inspecting will be easy once the intake is removed.

 

That yellow 3M Weatherstrip that I am familiar with dries hard as a rock. How can you get a seal with that? I see your idea now though, you are trying to keep the gasket from moving when the weight of the manifold goes on it.

I was not going to do it, but after talking to you I just might run the tests and inspect everything closely including the mating surfaces to get an idea about the engine. I mean, I spent two weeks learning valve adjustment techniques until Dave said, “Uhm…you ain’t got no adjustable valves.”

Thanks
mjac

 

Son, I just ordered me a Cometic Steel Core Intake Manifold Gasket with a high temperature coating that has chemical resistance to even nitrous and alcohol in high compression blown applications for $26.48 plus $8 shipping, IR-149060-HTS (High Temperature Steel) You ready for this, it is not one of there stock, production gaskets, it is not on their website or catalogue, he has to make it.

Thanks
mjac

 

My monster truck customer was sponsored by Cometic and they have some excellent gaskets. Not just their MLS head gaskets but also for other stuff. They have some kind of fiber intake gaskets that are very good. We used them on both wet and dry intake setups and I usually used them over at least once when I freshened the engines.

I still would glue them to the face of the cylinder head. On the A460 and EX 514 headed engines the intakes didn't have any coolant but the older Blue Thunder B engine with the CJ style ports in the Big Dawg truck put coolant through the manifold. It was never a problem with the reinforced gaskets.

 

C-5652-060 - All Fiber Gasket (says he sells a ton of them) - stock
IR-149060-AFM - Aluminum Reinforced Gasket Foam Coating - non-stock
IR-149060-HTS - Steel Reinforced Gasket High Temperature Coating - non-stock

 

The Fiber Gaskets are made of Aramid.

But the thing is, the HTS Gaskets are not stocked, he is going to make one. He is going to make one for $26.48. I still can’t believe it. Why would you use anything else.

Thanks
mjac

 

Who was the Monster Truck Customer, I will mention him to the person I am dealing with at Cometic.

Thanks
mjac

 

Doug Noelke. He had the Big Dawg and the Tailgator monster trucks. Big block Ford powered.