My 2020 F350 Lariat CC 4x4 was recently rear ended while I was towing a trailer and stopped because of a zero-visibility dust storm. We were hit by a fully loaded semi traveling at (his words to the police) 45.
The trailer was destroyed, the hitch part of the trailer was destroyed and then the end of the trailer hit the right side where the hitch attaches to the frame. Frame is visibly bent and crumpled in multiple places, among other damage (bumper, hitch, entire bed, cab, etc.).

At the moment, the repair estimate is $21,000, not enough to total the truck. My issue is that the "repair" includes cutting the back half of the frame off and welding a new one on. Ford authorizes this and sells partial frames for this use. My life experience, and that I am a mechanical engineer, says that I should be worried both about the integrity of my truck to do what it's intended for (haluling/towing) and the resell value of the truck.

I've already ordered a '22 replacement as I'm not going to keep this regardless of how it is repaired. So, my question is, do any of you have personal experience with a '17 and up Super Duty having the frame partially replaced?

Thanks in advance.
Jim

 

Haven’t seen a Super Duty frame have any of the above done; but I have seen class 8 truck frames get lengthened, repaired, and whatever else.
Of course this all has to pass a DOT inspection also, and these inspections may have changed since I saw it done and not be allowed now.
I guess if a certified welder did it, it would probaby be OK, IDK.

On another note, They say $21,000 to repair, but are they figuring anything in for you for dimished value? I would definitely argue wuth them for that too. That *may* be enough for them to total the truck if added in the repair bill.

 

They, the insurance company, couldn't care less about diminished value. Arguing does zero good. There isn't a legal basis for arguing.

 

It would be better than new if welded properly. I wouldn't stress it. I too am an engineer, mechanical, and I've worked as a millwright and welder for a decade (life experience). I really wouldn't worry past finding a competent welder.

it's not like it will need a bunch of bondo in the body panels. Don't be ocd about this.

 

Desert Don is correct. Arizona law supports diminished value claims. There are lawyers and expert witnesses in this arena. A big part of diminished value is how the market perceives the issue. That has a real impact on your loss of value. I would push for them to total it out. They can repair it and sell themselves.

I bet from an engineering standpoint, you could replace the back half of the frame successfully. But I can certainly imagine where shortcuts or missteps could take place and lead to a host of problems.

I would not buy a truck that had the back half of the frame replaced, even at a huge discount (25% wouldn't tempt me in the least). How about you?

 

I'd give you 10 grand for it with a welded frame. Not interested.

 

Get it repared and dump it within 14 days, so the Carfox won't show....

 

There usually is a legal basis for being able to obtain multiple estimates.

I found the website of the Arizona State Department of Insurance and Financial Institutions to be convoluted and confusing, so I turned to an outside resource (State Collision Repair Laws) to find the following information, which I have not personally verified:

From the extensive damage you described, and the tremendous force that hit the vehicle, and the horrendous shortage of available new parts for high demand vehicles, and the outrageous cost associated with all goods and services in this runaway inflation period, and the estimated amount of necessary labor suggested by the extensive damage you described... it sounds like more than $21,000 in damages.

In today's pricing climate for new and used Super Duties, a revised estimate from another repair facility that you choose for comparison's sake may or may not rise to the level of totalling out the truck, but it may provide a more accurate window ahead of time, and also ferret out a formerly common practice of auto body shops under estimating damage to get the vehicle started in their shop, and then "finding" additional damage revealed once further dismantling has taken place. It is arguable that the additional damage could have already been anticipated by an experienced estimator, but a very experienced estimator would know what type of damage the shop could get away with "not seeing" until revealed, so that their bid would be competitive enough to get the work.

I recommend getting additional estimates. Since you were rear ended, the big rig who hit you should likely be found as the party at fault, and as such, this should be covered by the big rig's insurance company, not yours, right?

 

JD, the insurance companies can't side step the law. And Arizona allows diminished value claims. You are entitled to be made whole. If insurance repairs to a vehicle diminish its value, you are entitled to that amount. Cutting the back half of your truck off to fix it is one of the most egregious examples I have heard of, and it will be immediately apparent to any vehicle inspector worth a darn.

Many folks in AZ have made diminished value claims like this to significant success. You have suffered a significant financial loss. Make sure the insurance company makes you whole. Search 'diminished value laws in AZ', then pick whatever links you like.

Aside from going after diminished value, ask the insurance company via email who will be certifying that the truck meets all the factory safety requirements and crash standards given that it is being cut in half to be repaired. I know they will dodge that one, but you are in a war of attrition. Make it as inconvenient as possible for them not to total it, and they probably come around. I don't think you have all that far to go on this one.

 

Frankly I would try to avoid attorneys if you can get anywhere in the trade in range. I would actually have the dealer you ordered the new one at do the repairs and take it early. If they low ball you you will have an easy time with getting the value from insurance.



You would have to sign something if trading it in stating it never had structural damage. Kinda risky.

 

Perhaps not as egregious as it may sound, as Ford actually has an app for that...

 

Don't recall ever seeing those docs on any trade.

 

I just traded one in and had to sign that.

 

Yes, Y2K, I know guys that do these repairs. It's cool as all get out to see how they do it. But an enormous legal component to diminished value is perception. Most people perceive a frame-ectomy as a major issue. And with good reason. It is an intricate repair for a structural component of a heavy duty vehicle. It is perfectly reasonable to assume that someone buying a heavy duty vehicle would pass on it in lieu of an unrepared vehicle given comparable pricing. So, you have to discount as a result of the insurance company's motorist barreling into you with a semi at 40mph. They are damn lucky he didn't kill you. I would remind them of that as well.

And knowing what I know, I still wouldn't want that chopped up truck frame. The guys I know that do this type of work, mention there are as many hacks as artists. They note plenty of problems that can arise like shakes and vibrations, and that the repaired side usually flexes less and differently than the original side which can create odd ride qualities on rough roads especially under load. They also note, you can't ever completely recreate factory, and they would all choose un-repaired at even money.

The process for diminished value is you get documentation stating your estimated loss of value, and you submit it to the insurance company referencing your legal right to it. Then they give an amount. Tip: that amount is never zero because they know the courts never see it as zero either. When these do go to court, 15% is not at all uncommon on significantly damaged late model vehicles.

I've had the misfortune of being involved in numerous claims against other's motorists. If you sit back and let them call the shots, you will lose big. They know they have all the money, attorneys, and practice to beat you. But they also know the law generally favors the consumer, and courts are routinely unmerciful to them. If you go at them competently, professionally, and persistently, it simply is worth the pocket change to do right by you. They'll make it up on the next guy.

Expecting them to total this out to make it less painful for you to get into a truck that is only 2 model years newer is way inside the reasonable window.

 

Keokie... I don't disagree with the fact that a body shop rarely, if ever, rebuilds a car as good as the programmed robots and the well practiced factory workers who produce a Ford truck every 60 seconds.

The repaired truck will most likely not be as good as it was before, due to being held at the mercy of whoever is rebuilding it. How many have they built? How good are their welding skills? How conscientious and careful are they... or how rushed are they by the body shop's schedule and profit motive? How many 17 up Super Duties have the body shop employees rebuilt from frame section up? How fastidious were they in their cross measurements for squareness on a rear frame that tapers? How dutiful were they in the application of corrosion preventative procedures? How much do they give a darn... and are they paid to give a darn, or paid to get it done quickly?

I get it.

I just wanted the OP and others to see what Insurance companies know when it comes to frame repairs on the 17 up Ford Super Duty. Ford has procedures to section and replace portions of the frame, and Insurance will likely side with Ford over fear.