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I’m thinking of plumbing in a second tank C/w pump and need to know the flow rate of the stock units. I tried a thread search on the Tech sticky with 0 results. I could just go to the parts counter and get a unit but the McGiver in me says no can do, must scrounge the used market for one that somebody’s unloading after sitting new unused in the garage for a year, cuz they bought the wrong one. Like the 20 gal fuel tank from a 94 Wrangler for 30 bucks. New generic tanks run $200-600.
I might be calculating wrong... if so please correct me.
stock injectors ( based on cc flow rating/1000 cycles) should be around 10.2 gph at 100% demand at 3k rpm.
I might be calculating wrong... if so please correct me.
stock injectors ( based on cc flow rating/1000 cycles) should be around 10.2 gph at 100% demand at 3k rpm.
Again don't trust me as I could be way way off.
I asked Google Search just now too and the question was asked on DieselStop. A guy had a new one in the box and a paper said it was 30gph.
Stock pump is something like 95gal/hr. It is mounted on the frame.
What are you trying to do?
Youll also need to manage the return fuel if you use a 2nd tank. You could select the supply/tank by turning pumps on and off use and check valves to segregate them. But return will require a 3-port solenoid valve like Hydraforce manufacturers.
We’re gonna want to talk about in-tank and pre-pump mods and switch/ wiring for this.
I’ve used the 44gal Excursion Fuel tank behind the axle in F250/350’s for VO conversions.
I’d like to see more of that excursion tank mounting and the plumbing and wiring if possible.
Its for a veggie conversion. Completely redundant fuel system. Separate pump, filters, FPR, etc. When running on VO, Fuel is drawn from and returns to the 2nd tank. It’s also all heated with coolant... You don’t need this much complication
Heres more pics of tank mounting.
I can make some suggestions for plumbing, etc - but I have never done what you’re considering.
You’ll need to include check valves after each fuel pump to keep from transferring fuel from one tank to the other. You can buy OE-style quick connect fittings that connect to the factory pump outlets. You’ll go from there to a check valve and then a tee and back into the factory supply - maybe at the engine x-member where flex hose to engine joins the hard line on frame?
The stock pump flows no where near 95 gallons per hour. Not even close. Not even in free flow.
@Jimv8 is far closer to correct, in that the maximum flow rate of the frame mounted electric fuel pump for our trucks is about 30 gph.
Since pump flow is relational to pressure, rather than just post a number, I'll post a graph, so that the flow rate at various pressures for this pump can be easily seen.
The parameters of the graph are scaled to include 95 gph on the chart, so that it can be seen how off the chart 95 gph is for the rating of the Bosch 69136 fuel pump.
I’m considering fitting a 2nd small diesel tank, a pump, and a 6 port controlled valve to switch feed and return lines. The idea would be to get the engine hot on diesel then switch to bio and purge the engine with diesel on shut off. It’s a hypothetical exercise at this point but I did source all the bits and pieces online. Of course it’s a lot easier to just mix more diesel with the bio when it gets cold.
I think it was the FASS pump that is 95gal/hr. My brain is getting soft...
The stock pump is about 1/2gal per minute free flow - which puts it closer to the numbers posted above.
Originally Posted by Jimv8
I’m considering fitting a 2nd small diesel tank, a pump, and a 6 port controlled valve to switch feed and return lines. The idea would be to get the engine hot on diesel then switch to bio and purge the engine with diesel on shut off. It’s a hypothetical exercise at this point but I did source all the bits and pieces online. Of course it’s a lot easier to just mix more diesel with the bio when it gets cold.
The 6-port valves are problematic - especially on veggie-based fuels. You don’t want or need a 2nd Fuel pump with a 6-port valve.
If you share the factory filter with both fuels, you can NEVER ‘Purge’ effectively.
Are you making B100 or trying to blend vegetable oil and diesel??
If your B100 is too viscous to burn, you won’t pump it from the tank to the engine without heat the way we do straight VO conversions.
This is the Vegistroke VO kit. The manifold here has fuel pump, filters, FPR, temp and pressure sensors, purge valve, etc built in. I also add the RACOR PS120 as a prefilter. You can see the aux coolant pump that insures coolant flow through the VO loop.
From there, we send VO to the rear of the heads and diesel is routed through check valves to the front of the heads. The engine plumbing is SS hard lines and ptfe-lined SS braided hoses with JIC ends.
Your B100 will have a similar gel point to the feedstock you use. We made B100 that was SOLID at 70*F (chicken fat) and we made some that was liquid well below freezing (canola oil).
Really useful stuff, thanks. I wondered if a 2nd pump was necessary. The feedstock I’m collecting is canola and sunflower oil. I purposely avoid animal fats as those tend to be problematic for processing. The viscosity of bio is roughly double that of diesel and clouding becomes visible around 32f. The reason for purging is to get the thicker stuff out of the injectors so they won’t be gummy after sitting in the cold all night. I might be creating a problem where none exists and the high pressures involved overcomes any issues.
I just saw the sub forum,’ other fuels, bio diesel’ and I’m going to visit there to explore this further now the pump gph question is resolved.
The viscosity of B100 is not ‘double’ that of diesel... But, the cloud point will be significantly higher based on the feed stock. Your canola/sunflower oil B100 should be good to about as cold as any B100 can run. I’d guess 40-50*. You will be surprised at how much lower that temp is with just 10% diesel. These are all things you can experiment with using the refrigerator/freezer and samples of YOUR fuel.
Yes, you are making too much ado about purging. If the B100 is gumming up in the injectors, it won’t flow through the filters in the AM. The injectors are less of a problem. BUT, attempting to inject a more viscous (than D2) fuel will result in poor atomization and coking in the combustion chamber. You’ll want to avoid that if you want to do this for a long time.
The alt fuels sub-forum is a ghost town. But tag me or post a link to your thread here and I’ll contribute there if you’d like.
There are very few humans who have more experience with this topic than I do. My dogs have watched me do this stuff for years, so they know more than most people - but they don’t speak english....
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