Hey everyone, I recently purchased a Sportsmobile converted 1989 E-150 with the 5.0L V8. The previous owner told me the Heater and AC don't work so upon inspection I've found a lot of interesting things that maybe someone with more knowledge could help me figure out. I'll start with the AC first:

When I turn on the AC I get air blowing from the vents, I can switch to Defrost and they change accordingly so that's nice. The air does not blow cold and the AC compressor does not seem to engage when I look under the hood while the engine is running and AC is on (I believe the wheel in front of the wheel running on the belt should be spinning as well, correct?). I'm considering refilling the refrigerant to see where that gets me but that leads me to another interesting question. My van has some type of second evaporator bolted under the driver's side door. It definitely does not look factory. The 2 hoses from that evaporator are ziptied across the bottom of the frame to the passenger side and head towards the engine bay and are not connected to anything. One hose is cut and taped off and the other has a metal fitting with a black o-ring. I also have another component near that evaporator that looks like some type of compressor or dryer and it has one hose that goes to the driver's side engine bay with a metal "T" fitting not connected to anything. Here's some photos (#1 is the evaporator and #2 is what looks like a compressor to me and, sorry if these aren't the correct terms, I don't know much about AC components. The rest of the photos show the hoses that go nowhere):




Seems like potentially the 2 evaporator hoses are supposed to connect to this T fitting? My van does not have a rear/auxilary AC unit or vents back there so I have no idea what these components are for. The AC on this van was originally manufactured with R22 refrigerant but there is a sticker under the hood stating its been updated with R134a.

Before I go ripping out these seemingly random AC components and recharging the stock ford AC components with R134a I wanted to get your opinion. Do you think its possible this R134a sticker is only referencing this weird aftermarket AC strapped under the van that's no longer connected to anything? If that's the case I assume the factory Ford AC might not be R134a compatible and I could do damage putting newer refrigerant in. I'm hoping I can just remove the unused components, fill the factory Unit with refrigerant and maybe the compressor will start working when the proper system pressure is met. I'd appreciate any advice or tips!

Next issue is the heater! Hopefully someones still reading this far! So when I turn the heater on I don't get any air flow from the vents. Changing to defrost and floors dont seem to change anything. The coolant lines leading to the heater core don't seem to feel hot or full of coolant when I squeeze them after the engine has been warmed up. Not sure if this is maybe trapped air? Wouldnt there still be air flowing out of the vents in this case? I also can't seem to find a heater control valve. I have three coolant lines that connect with just a "T" fitting which I assume is where I should be finding a heater control valve with a vacuum line connection but I might be wrong here. Here's a photos showing this "T" connection (#1 is the hose leading to the heater core beyond the firewall, #2 leads to what seems like the throttle body and #3 leads to the engine).

I'm wondering if maybe I have two problems here, There's supposed to be a heater valve connecting those hoses and I either have a clogged line/heater core or air trapped in the system. I'd really appreciate any advice and otherwise thanks so much for reading this far!

 

I don't think the stuff you found underneath are actually for the AC. I think there was a refrigerator installed once upon a time that is no longer there.

 

That's definitely a possibility! There is a working fridge inside already that is self contained and does not connect to any outside components. I assumed it was the original fridge as it matches all of the other pieces of the buildout but there is a possibility it was a later addition.

 

I found a helpful exchange on here between @annaleigh and @rohls about a broken A/C on a van extremely similar to mine. I noticed this photo from under the hood of the van in question (see photo below) and the heater hose connection looks just like mine. I'm assuming I can disregard my concern about a missing heater control valve in that location.

 

As to the heater hose! Mine is the same as yours. I have been wanting to replace those lines as they are factory originals. There is no factory heater control valve on our year vans. i want to install one on my van because i am not happy with the AC temperature. Down in the heater duct housing you have the evaporator coil as well as the heater core. When running the AC, hot water is still running through the heater core and does take away some of the efficiency.
If you one day plan to install a heater control valve then it should be on line #1 in the drawing below.
If I remember correctly, the vacuum line to connect to the control valve is the vacuum line that goes to the Fresh Air Inlet Door Vacuum Motor. The FAID is closed when the AC is set to MAX. So by installing a T in the vacuum line to the FAID Vacuum Motor, When the AC is set to MAX, the FAID and the HCV will both be closed at the same time.





As to your current AC issues, I don't know where to tell you to start! I would look to see just how much of the original system is still hooked up and if it can be hooked back up if it inst. R22 is/was used in refrigerators and window acs as well as home central AV systems. That part under your van looks like a compressor from a refridge of a window AC unit but it would probably require 110volts unless they somehow adapted a 12 volt RV compressor to it.
I am not a professional by no means but you can't just throw any type of freon into a system because the compressor has to be designed to work with it. i have never heard of a Ford Factory compressor that could operate on R22. Your van cam e out with a R12 system just like mine has. It sounds like it was later converted to R134A which the factory compressor can handle the pressures needed. I replaced my entire AC system with all new parts and went back with R12 like it came from the factory. Would i use R12 again? probably since i also have one more full recharge of R12 if I had to do a repair.

You need to decide what you want to do, front only or front and rear AC.. The Front only works great for people sitting in the front but on very hot sunny days the rear of the van will get quite hot. If you decide to go with a front and rear AC then you will need to source many parts and probably get a shop to build your AC lines that go to the rear unit.

 

This is a drawing for our vans with a single front AC. The red lines are the liquid/high pressure and the green lines are the low pressure/suction lines.
This

is how it should be connected for a front only system

 

@annaleigh I am honored to have you participating in this thread because I've seen you contribute a lot for others on the forum! I read your posts thoroughly when choosing new coil springs for my van since the originals were sagging badly. I actually decided to give the Moog 824's a shot despite reading about your positive camber issues because when I called up Moog they said since it was a heavy conversion van with AC they wouldn't go with anything less than the 824. I installed the springs and I think there might be a slight positive camber but seems fine especially if there's a chance the springs will settle at all.

Anyways thanks for the vacuum line info for installing a heater control valve. Since the connector for those 3 lines looks to be in poor shape I wouldn't mind replacing it with a control valve so I might go that route. I still haven't figured out why I'm not getting air out of my vents when I turn on the heater. I might have a vacuum issue for the heater alone. The air comes out of the vents fine when the selector is set to AC/cool.

As for the AC I'm not interested in building up the rear AC. Currently, the factory AC for the front seems to be completely intact. No idea if there is a leak as I just got the van and I haven't tried putting any refrigerant yet. When I turn on the AC the compressor clutch does not engage but Ive read that this is probably because there's no pressure in the system which I know for a fact there is none. Sorry for my confusion about the original refrigerant, you must be correct about the R12. I think with the input from you and the other user about the equipment under the van I feel safe to assume the ford AC system under the hood was updated to R134A given the sticker under the hood. There is no pressure in my refrigerant line (I checked the valve closest to the muffler). Judging by your thread I mentioned before I should probably vacuum the lines before adding refrigerant since the lines are empty and might have a lot of moisture inside? Also would you assume that since there's no pressure in the refrigerant lines that there must be a leak somewhere or is that not a safe assumption without knowing the van's history? Thanks!

 

Thank you fir the kind words ridetrains!
My springs didn't settle enough and the tires were wearing on the outer edge. I took my van on a couple of mountain trips across the north Ga mountains on rough gravel roads and that didn't help. Maybe with yours being a converted sports-mobile, the extra weight will settle them in. You should have PM'd me as I still have those 824's just hanging out down in the shop. If they don't settle down and cause tire wear problems, you can always reinstall your old springs and put a spacer under the bottom pad. Moog makes one similar to this


But it didn't hold up very long. It is made of rubber and the bottom of the coil spring cut its way through the rubber pad. Ford had a kit made of steel washers that went under the factory rubber pad to help adjust for sagging springs. The factory spring pad is about a 1/4" thick and appears to be made of a material more similar to the sidewall of a car tire with woven threads in it. Much stronger then what i got from Moog. I am not down on Moog all together as they do make some good replacement parts but I am upset that i have a set of useless springs and they refused to help out.... Actually not refused but rather just didn't respond to my emails abut the problem.
Well enough of that. Maybe Moog will reach out to me one day abut this.

There is a door inside the heat/AC duct work that controls the direction of the air flow. It is vacuum operated. The controls on the dash... The temperature control is a cable to a door that separates the heat from the from the ac air. basically it closes off the heat side. As you push the lever towards warm, it opens the door more and more till you are at max.. the other control slide with MAX AC, Normal, Vent, Floor, Mix, Defrost... That slide controls vacuum lines that go to the vacuum motors down on the ducting. That same slide switch controls power for the blower fan and AC clutch. most newer cars use a relay system but on our vans that slide control controls line voltage directly and the blower fan and AC pull a good bit of power.

I moved about a year ago and packed my Ford factory manuals up in a box somewhere and have yet to search for them. That is a good job for me while I am stuck at home for a while... If I can find them then I can give you some better detailed drawings on the Venting system.

This is a schematic from my 85 manual but I believe the 88 and 89 is the same..



In the schematic above the De-icing switch, also known as pressure switch, and ac clutch cycle switch. Notice that the wire goes from the pressure switch to the magnetic clutch field coil,,, IE compressor clutch!
The de-icing/pressure switch sits right on top of the accumulator and has a electrical connector that un plugs from the top of it.






If you unplug the clutch cycle pressure switch then you can use a jumper and in the harness connector and see if the AC clutch engages. Would be best to do it this way first. Turn the key to run but don't start the engine. Set the AC control lever control to MAX AC. Go outside and jumper out the harness connector from the pressure switch and see if the AC compressor clutch engages. That will tell you if the electrical part of the system is working.

Next the clutch on the compressor should look something like this below



In the bottom pic i am trying to pry the clutch loose from the compressor. My compressor was locked up and yo need to check to see if yours is too. Grab that front part of the clutch and try to turn it as it is connected directly to the compressor shaft. The part of the pulley with the grooves on it acts like an idler pulley when the clutch is not engaged. so it is that front plate that must be able to freely turn.If it has been sitting for along time then it could be frozen in place but might move with a little persuasion. When i bought a new Motorcraft compressor for my van it was frozen up. On the new one the lubricant they used putting the compressor together dries over time so itis common for a compressor that has sat for a long time to be stuck.
In your case though it could be something a bit worse. When I bought my van the AC pulley was bypassed completely because the compressor was locked up and so was the pulley bearing. All of the freon was out of my system and when i removed the AC hoses I found they had RUST inside the lines and that is why I replaced every part on my AC system. It only takes just a little contamination to blow out a new .compressor. Also replacing everything with new parts ensured a trouble free insulation that has lasted for several years now without needing serviced.

Things to think about.... If it had a leak before and someone just kept adding freon when it needed it, you can lock up a compressor that way because there is oil in the system and when ever there is a leak, you also loose part of the oil. Eventually the oil is too low and the compressor locks up or is badly damaged.

leaks... All of the fittings are quick connect fittings and have rubber O rings in them to seal the connection. If one is leaking right off of the bat then you can be sure that others are too, maybe just not as bad. So you should disconnect the lines and replace the O-rings and be sure and use a lubricant when doing so. Check inside the lines for signs of rust. To do the job properly you should flush the system, change the accumulator, remove and drain the oil out of the compressor. Refill the system with the proper amount of oil and then add 4, 14 ounce cans of freon. If memory serves me right it is 52 ounces of freon to fill a front ac system on our vans.


A bit more i found saved on my computer








the info above mentions mineral oil but you will need PAG oil for R134A The tag states NY-12B but i believe the new Motorcraft number is NY-12D but any PAG oil will work. The amounts should be the same regardless of pag oil or mineral oil....
I have heard that when charging with R134 in a system originally designed for R12, that you should leave it a bit low and it will cool better.

 

Thanks so much for the response. Youve laid out a good plan of action for me to do some tinkering today. I'll see if I can get the compressor clutch to activate. Is there a way to check the oil level of the compressor without removing it? I'm also planning on replacing the thermostat, coolant temperature sensor and a heater hose or two that look to be in bad shape. Maybe when I finish the job and top off my coolant it will find its way up into the heater core finally. I might try to get access to the heater core before to see if I can see anything irregular since I don't know the last time it was getting fed coolant.

 

Before going into it too deep there are some things you might want to think about. I always do a compression check to check the condition of the cylinders. I leak down test is better if you have access to a compressor and the parts store rents the tester.
If the van is running then I recommend doing a combustion block test. That checks for a blown head gasket, cracked cylinder, or cracked head. anything that might allow coolant into the cylinder.
This tool is a loaner tool from the parts stores.

Some tips on changing the thermostat... I broke a bolt off when trying to get mine loose. Hopefully yours will come right out.
I believe you have a 5.0 engine like mine? if so then the lower thermostat bolt is hard to access.
The bolt broke because it was corroded into the thermostat housing




once the bolt broke and i knew it was from corrosion, I went a head and just snapped the other side of the housing ear off without trying to loosen the bolt. If that second bolt had of broken off then I would have had to remove the water pump and timing cover in order to try to extract the broken bolt. Once i broke the housin gear and tapped it out from under the bolt head, the bolt came right out.










I used a Titan 16023 tool to extract the bolt which worked great.





When putting the thermostat back in on the 5.0, you need to be careful that it doesn't slip down out of the housing while you are trying to get it the housing and bolts in place. I used a rubber band looped through the thermostat and back out the end of the housing to hold the thermostat in place as well as the stick on gasket. The thermostat can slip out of place even with the stick on gasket in place and if it does, you will not see it till you see the leak.
Once fastened in place I simply removed the extension and extracted the rubber band




The lower bolt is a pain to get to and the distributor TFI module can sometimes be in the way. If you have to move the distributor then first score a line at the base of the distributor and on the lower intake so you can line it back up later. What i was able to do to get the bottom bolt in was to use a pair of angled long noise pliers and turn the bolt in little by little till I could use a wrench on it. I could only turn the bolt about a 1/8 turn each time and then swap to a different wrench for another 1/8 turn but finally got it





If by chance you do have a problem (hopefully you won't) here is the napa replacement housing if needed

 

So I checked on the compressor clutch to see if it moves freely and it definitely does. I jumped the clutch pressure switch harness to see if engages but the clutch didn't spin. Interesting enough the mysterious auxiliary evaporator fan under the van turned on. I noticed that the harness has a second wire spliced into the positive wire so I'm guessing that's how they wired in that second evaporator. That at least told me the harness is getting power but not sure why the compressor clutch isn't spinning.

Those thermostat housing bolts do look like a tight fit, makes me second guess wanting to tackle a new thermostat right now, I should do some tests to see if it's still working before I get in over my head.

I looked to see if my radiator has a drain plug and it looks like I found it and it looks to be in pretty nasty shape. I wonder if I can get a replacement plug somewhere?


I also found this little harness that just has a plastic piece plugged into it. Do you know what this is called and what it does?

 

The clutch will not attempt to spin unless the engine is running. What you were checking for was to make sure it engages when power is put to it and that clutch rotates freely. Is the serpentine belt around the AC compressor pulley now? I want to double check that you are in fact turning the compressor and not the compressor pulley.
In the pic below I am taking the nut loose that holds the compressor clutch to the compressor shaft. If you were to use a ratchet and socket on the nut like I have in the pic and try to tighten the nut, the compressor should turn as that nut is threaded directly onto the compressor shaft.




once I got the Nut off i then removed the clutch plate from the compressor shaft.





Now with the clutch plate removed you can see the compressor shaft with the washer left hanging on it. What is left on the compressor is just the AC pulley which acts as a idler pulley when the clutch is not engaged. That pulley is supposed to turn freely independent of the compressor. turn freely.





So it is the front clutch plate that you need to turn by hand or use a socket and ratchet.


I would;disconnect that second fan ASAP if it is on the factory AC circuit as the factory AC circuit is pretty much loaded up to start with. The fan speed switch es are know to go bad on our vans because of the load... You are going to need to separate all of what the other person added and get it back to factory.

As to the radiator drain. you may find one at a parts store in the help section or a radiator shop. yours looks like it might open. It screws inward, clock wise, to open and drain the coolant. Try an adjustable wrench across both tabs and it will probably open..


The connector you have circled is called a SPOUT connector. Plugged into the harness like it is allows the ECM to control the engine timing. If you need to check or set the timing, you unplug the SPOUT connector and while using a timing light, rotate the distributor until you have the timing marks set to spec. I may be mistaken but if my brain is working correctly, timing on our year 5.0's is 10degrees before top dead center TDC.

That looks like a new distributor cap along with plug wires. Also looks like the thermostat has been out before so you may not have problems getting the bolts loose like I did. Mine had never been changed so the bolts hadn't been moved in 30 years! The reason i think the thermostat has been out before is that the hose clamps are not factory clamps and your thermostat housing has a screw in plug on the top of it. my factory housing did not have that plug and yours should not have had it either!

 

Yes the serpentine belt is currently around the AC compressor pulley. here is a photo where I highlighted the part I am spinning freely, it is in green.

I put my ratchet on the nut in your photo and its spinning the same part I highlighted in green in the photo.
I'll disconnect that auxiliary fan under the van now.

 

Ok great! There should be just a slight resistance on the compressor though...
BTW how does the van run? What are your plans with it?

Starting back at the top again!
1- that should be a condenser coil and fan
2- looks like a refrigeration compressor
Have you found any wiring to that compressor? Any name plates with a voltage on it?

The second pick down
Hard to tell what that line is with all the tape,

The third and forth pics are defiantly ac lines with quick connect connectors.
Was the van ever a conversion van? I am starting to wonder if the van originally had front and rear AC. I need to see more pictures of the AC lines and how they are routed around the fire wall. Normally if the van had rear ac then the suction and liquid line will drop down somewhere between the left side fo the engine and the brake booster and head back under the van.

Good news (maybe) is I believe it is the same compressor and condenser for single front unit or one with both.

 

Yeah, the compressor does give some resistance when I turn it, feels how I imagine it should feel.

The van runs well besides while it's first warming up, the idle is a little sporadic. It goes high then low almost to where it stalls then goes high again and low again for a couple of times until it finds its pace. I cleaned the throttle body out with some throttle body cleaner and a toothbrush and did what I could to clean the Idle Air Control valve because I hear that's the first place to look when diagnosing my symptoms. I also noticed that the diaphragm on my Fuel Pressure Regulator must have gone bad because gas leaks into the vacuum line connected to it. I've ordered a new regulator, waiting for it to arrive in the mail. My next plan of action is to look for vacuum leaks as that's also a likely cause of the sporadic idle apparently. Besides that, it seems to run well.

The previous owner warned me to not overfill the rear fuel rank because it will overflow. He said he put new fuel pumps in both tanks trying to fix the problem but it would still overflow from somewhere on top of the rear tank and he now thinks its a bad vent valve or possibly the vent valve bushing.

Also there is some steering play, feels like something needs to be tightened up somewhere under the van, the bushings look a little worse for wear down there but I couldnt find the right parts for some of the bushings. Mainly these two circled in red.



The van is a conversion van. It was sent straight to Sportsmobile from the Ford factory and converted to an RV/camper. It has a pop top, fridge, sink with grey water resevoir, rail mounted propane tank, stove, propane heater, awning etc..

My plan for it is to road trip and camp with it. I'm in San Diego, California so I'm hoping to take it to Baja and around the southwest this year. The work I've done to it so far is replaced all the shocks, new coil springs up front, new air filter, fuel filter, oil and filter change, PCV valve, plugs and wires, cap and rotor, crankcase breather element and wipers. Besides working on the problems I've brought up in this thread I figured I might do some preventative maintenance like new power steering fluid, drain transmission fluid in the pan and put a new filter in and top it off with fresh transmission fluid, new differential oil, new brake fluid. Down the line I'll probably address my valve cover gasket leak and a slight leak in the transmission oiler cooler line. The van has 140k miles, do you think any of my maintanence is unecessary? The fluids I've seen so far look good and healthy so I think the previous owner took decent care of it. Unfortunately, I'm going to get a lot of rain this next week here so I won't be outside tinkering as much. I'll try to take photos of the AC lines you mentioned.