For those that don't remember the original "Up From The Ashes" thread, In 2015 I had bought my 2000 Limited V10 *POST FIRE* and set out to get her back on the road. She had suffered the dreaded "cruise control fire" because the previous owner ignored the recall. Everything under the hood that could burn or melt, DID. In the thread, I documented an entire year of putting her back together, complete with some in-depth wiring conversations, as I had to pretty much build a new underhood harness from various partial harnesses. The thread covered a bunch of trial and error, a divorce, and TONS of help and encouragement from members of this site. Here's a link in case you are new, missed it, or want to check it out again...

Psyclopse's "Up From The Ashes" Build Thread

Basically, that thread went from dragging home what most would consider a parts buggy, listening to people tell me I was nuts (and they really aren't wrong there), and driving out the other end. Once it was on the road and reliable, the thread had pretty much run it's course. I've taken a number of camping trips, road trips, concert trips, pulled car trailers- you know- Excursion things. I've not really had to do much other than oil changes for nearly 30,000 miles.

Then it happened- the passenger side lower ball joint decided that the party was over. But was it? I figured she had played nicely in relatively stock form long enough. I had a bad ball joint, couldn't put my finger between the front spring and the bumpstop (as in singular- it shed the other one recently), and an innocent tire took the abuse that the ball joint gave it. She didn't deserve to go out like this...

Now is a good time to mention that I had already planned to play with her some. I had previously purchased a pair of Zone Offroad #F0202 mini-packs. I also had a pair of axles originally from an F250 (still a Dana 50, so don't get excited), and had been stripping down and cleaning up the front one. Rather than let everything sit and collect dust, I figured what the heck, let's get to work!

Going way back in the photo collection, here's how she sat shortly after I brought her home and removed the running boards and cladding...



Remember how some of you were amazed that I was willing to tackle such a work-heavy project? Well, get this- I made TRIPLE the work for myself with the front-end spring swap, just so I could post a series of measurements in the "Modded Suspension Call" thread! I measured what I started with, then added just the new springs and measured that, THEN added the Zone mini-pack and measured that. And that's all with the OLD axle still in place.

SIDE TANGENT- Now is a good time to give a shout out and a huge thanks to ATS Junior for his time and wisdom, and for helping me iron this out on the cheap (and knowing that I was going to use the mini-packs because I had them and I am a cheapskate!)

MEASUREMENTS (Center of hub to fender lip)
22.50- Initial stock measurement
25.25- "X-Code" 43-818 springs from ATS
28.25- Zone Offroad #F0202 mini-packs

That leaves me looking something like this...



(Yes, I STILL wear the scorched fender and hood. How else would people recognize me?)

So, in the next picture, I added some material under the rear wheels to make the the truck sit level-ish so I could try to determine how much I need to go up in the rear...



The angle I have it sitting in the shop throws it off some- it still looks low in the pic, but it is about right. 5.50 inches would level it, 6 would probably look better.

The springs that are on the truck now, I thought were completely stock. But after a discussion in another post, I don't know for sure- I have seven leafs, plus the slapper leaf, and apparently six plus the slapper is actually what came on these things. I'll post a picture tomorrow, as well as a picture of the new front setup.

I did take it for a slow and cautious ride, and it felt better to me (other than bottoming out the stock shocks), but pirate4x4 camo said:
It makes perfect sense, so I wonder if my "feels better" stems from 1) I'm not constantly on the bumpstops anymore, 2) I'm not remembering because I've been driving a POS Dakota for the past 3 months, 3) it's all psychological, or 4) a combination of these things. Either way, I hope he makes his way to this thread to discuss shocks and such.

So that's where I am at right now- I just have to figure out how to bring the rear up with the best combination of "cheap" and "safe." Questions will follow...

 

PRELIMINARY QUESTIONS-

1) The FRONT bolts for the front springs had thread locker on them, but the rear bolts (at the hanger) did not. Should I duplicate this, or ???
2) The new axle is stripped at the outers for cleaning/painting/new seals and ball joints. The alignment cams were in rough shape- what are people liking for replacements, and how should I set it up pre-alignment? (Note- Rock Auto if possible, due to discount code, haha)
3) Let's talk about front shocks...

 

 

 

The Zone mini pack has 5 leaves in the assembly. The bottom three have the center pin hole exactly in the center, while the top two have the hole offset to where there is more spring towards the rear. All springs in the pack measure fairly close to 0.4075 thick and are 3 inches wide.

In the spirit of my old thread, I bring you an el-cheapo rendition made in Paint...


As far as the main springs from ATS, their website provides the following:

3(W)X27-1/2(S.E.)X28-1/8(L.E.) 2 Lvs. Full Taper 2/.625 2,630 Lbs Capacity.

I thought I would include that, since the aftermarket X-codes aren't exactly the same as factory X-codes. Their leaves measure about 0.5725 thick.

** Thickness measurements are as close as I could get with the springs already installed, so they might not be absolutely spot-on, but they are close.

Here's a picture of the front as of right now...

 

Well, I did have the old shocks on there, but they were hitting their limits quite a bit, and have a blue million miles on them.

 

Okay, apparently, I MISCOUNTED the number of leaves in the rear suspension. I have EIGHT leaves, plus the slapper.



Sorry for the weird angle, but the Harbor Freight 4-ton jack decided it needed to go back to the harbor, I guess, so I had to take the pic with the wheel on.

Anyone have any ideas on these mystery springs?

The heaviest thing I have ever towed was a car trailer with my old ECLB Super Duty with only the short block intact- and it squatted a little. Didn't squat with a mid-70's 24-foot camper though. At any rate, I have to go from this to six inches higher (equaling or surpassing the towing capability I have now)- and relatively cheaply, as the front axle rebuild is rapidly draining my budget. Ideas welcome.

 

 

 

To use the spring rate calculator for the Zone pack, I remember you said I could probably ignore the bottom two leaves (the 6-inch and 10-inch ones). Do you think I should include/ignore the third from the bottom (the 14-inch leaf)? And does the fact that the top two leaves are not centered on the pin change anything?

The calculator gives me (rounding the .4075 up to .41 since the calc only allows 2 decimal places:
Just the top 2 leaves: 1995.82
The top 3 leaves: 8561.89

Just to clarify, this is for the REAR. Current measurement is 25.5. I wasn't looking at it as to what I wanted THAT measurement to be, but rather what it would take to give the entire vehicle about a 1-inch rake going from what I have just done to the front. In my mind, stacking material under the rear tires (with the front tires on the ground) until it sat how I wanted, then measuring how much material I put under the tires is how I determined how far I needed to go up. Was my thinking wrong?

 

Am I correct in assuming that leaving the rear springs in place, ditching the factory 2.5-inch block, and installing a PMF 8 or 8.5-inch block (that captures the U-bolts) will create more problems than what it is worth? That seems like the cheapest option for the rear, but the whole increased leverage thing has me somewhat worried. I know the Chebby guys around here like their tall blocks, but I figured it was so they can have more spare money for repairs.

Feel free to give me a when I am thinking out loud- the budget side of my brain is having a huge influence, especially knowing I still need to buy shocks and ball joints. Oh, and lug nuts, since my wheels (Craigslist specials) take conical lug nuts...

 

 

 

 

FRONT

I guess I am not understanding all this. The brand new "X-codes" measure the same thickness at the pin as the stock springs I removed (.5725). The F250 T-codes I played with before ordering the new springs came in a little thicker at .595. All the springs are 3 inches wide, and the stockers and the T-codes measured the same length if measured along the spring instead of straight-line eye-to-eye. What I am getting at is it seems the Zone pack used with ANY of these springs puts the numbers in the crazy spring rate category. The market these mini packs as "For 99-04 Super Duty and Excursion," but it seems like the numbers would be through the roof no matter what factory (or factory-ish) spring was used. But they sell a bunch of them, and people seem to like them for the lift they get, and I can't find anyone complaining about a bone-jarring ride with whatever shocks they are using. I only bought mine because a friend of mine has them on his 250, and I didn't mind the ride- and I know his cheap **** didn't pop for expensive shocks (If I know him, he used whatever "Oh Really" had in sale.

Don't misunderstand me as doubting you- far from it, as I know you know your stuff. It just seems like if they made the ride that bad, word of mouth would have sales away from them by now. So is this a case of "the ideal" way to go versus "what people will accept?" Or if it's going to be completely horrible, I can't afford to pull it all off and start over with 4 new springs, so as far as the front goes, I'm just going to have to live with it for at least a year, and figure out the best possible affordable shock to use in the meantime.

REAR

Taking your advice and not including a rake takes an inch out of the equation. I have the rear tires sitting on exactly 5 inches of material and it sits dead level right now. While I do have something unknown going on with my rear springs (2 more leaves than everyone else seems to have), I do have the short blocks. I was basing my measurements on those blocks being "2 inches" where they actually measure about 2.3 with my calipers (I also have a pair of the "4-inch" blocks on the bench that actually measure 3.6 inches). So even still, getting rid of the factory block and using a PMF block still puts me at a 7.5 block from them, so the math error still only saved me a half-inch of block, even taking the inch of rake out. Still a tall block though- a touch over 4 inches taller than the tall factory block.

So as I said before, the budget has me screwed pretty bad, after setting up a less-than-ideal front that I am going to have to live with for the time being. I need a cheap-ish way to bring the back up to match for now, and then start saving to do four springs later. Winter is the concern- my Dakota doesn't have heat and the rear body panels are so rusted that it wouldn't hold heat anyway. The Excursion has awesome heat. So, as backwards as it is, I need my "beater with a heater" back, even if I have to redo everything come spring...