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91 f250 efi....Smoking starter relay on fenderr

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  #16  
Old 05-12-2017, 10:06 PM
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Originally Posted by Erika
We tested the power going to the solenoid with the key in the "on" position. My son used some small tester. There is power going to the solenoid post to the battery, the post going to the starter has no power. We held the screwdriver down and get a "clunk" type noise. There is a clicking sound coming from the solenoid when we bypass it.
oh, the starter could be damaged internally? okay. We were hitting the starter with a hammer while bypassing the solenoid...this led my son to believe the starter is good because he heard something and he believes it is the solenoid that got fried due to a short? Do you recommend a Ford starter or aftermarket Remanufactured ones are okay? Checking on price for a Ford solenoid. And have the starter to test now.

Tried a second solenoid, the third total, get smoke from the post going to the battery.
Can't be sure what you mean here.

One of them means you connected the post that goes to the battery to the post that goes to the starter? Got a big spark? Held it long enough for the starter to run if was going to?
 
  #17  
Old 05-13-2017, 02:00 AM
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You need to test the relay with the key in the START position (it is the starter relay, after all). Still, everything you describe points to either a bad starter or a locked engine. Have you hand turned it yet?
 
  #18  
Old 05-13-2017, 10:39 AM
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Originally Posted by Erika
We tested the power going to the solenoid with the key in the "on" position. My son used some small tester. There is power going to the solenoid post to the battery, the post going to the starter has no power. We held the screwdriver down and get a "clunk" type noise. There is a clicking sound coming from the solenoid when we bypass it.
You have to test power out of the solenoid with the key held in start, not run.

Originally Posted by Erika
oh, the starter could be damaged internally? okay. We were hitting the starter with a hammer while bypassing the solenoid...this led my son to believe the starter is good because he heard something and he believes it is the solenoid that got fried due to a short?

...

Tried a second solenoid, the third total, get smoke from the post going to the battery.
Where you see smoke, there is heat. And heat is caused either by overcurrent or a loose or corroded connection. Check to make sure the battery cables are clean and tight. And assuming your engine is not locked up, you will continue to destroy solenoids until you replace that starter. It's shot, especially if you were hitting it with a hammer. That is an old trick that DOES work under certain conditions (if you have a dead spot on the commutator or the brushes are worn, but it will NOT help a starter that's been overheated) but it can also damage the starter more, so it's only to be used when your starter is already on it's way out due to the above conditions. Yours is now past any help except a rebuild or replacement.

Check to see if your engine rotates freely before proceeding any further and doing more damage to the electrical system components.
 
  #19  
Old 05-13-2017, 10:47 AM
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Yes to all your questions HardScrabble.
Have not been able to hand turn the engine yet madpogue.
Working on hand cranking the engine Dixie460
 
  #20  
Old 05-13-2017, 11:23 AM
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When you get the starter off you should be able to prove to yourself that engine is not locked up. Reach up in the hole and move the ring gear the same way the starter turns it. If you can move the gear then engine is not locked. The ring gear turns the engine. It will take a prybar or a big sturdy screwdriver.

Unhook your battery before you remove the starter.

Replacement starters and solenoids are both suspect. Test them before you install them.
 
  #21  
Old 05-16-2017, 05:06 PM
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Got back to working on the problem, replaced the starter, no start. The only sound is a click from the solenoid.
 
  #22  
Old 05-16-2017, 06:32 PM
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And the result of attempting to turn the engine by hand is........
 
  #23  
Old 05-16-2017, 09:17 PM
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The engine turns by hand.
 
  #24  
Old 05-17-2017, 06:57 AM
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Wire from the relay to the starter is in good shape?
 
  #25  
Old 05-17-2017, 07:28 AM
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Originally Posted by madpogue
Wire from the relay to the starter is in good shape?
Perhaps the starter cable is chafed and grounding to the block, frame, or the retaining clip by the motor mount?
 
  #26  
Old 05-17-2017, 07:43 AM
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Originally Posted by HardScrabble
When you get the starter off you should be able to prove to yourself that engine is not locked up. Reach up in the hole and move the ring gear the same way the starter turns it. If you can move the gear then engine is not locked. The ring gear turns the engine. It will take a prybar or a big sturdy screwdriver.

Unhook your battery before you remove the starter.

Replacement starters and solenoids are both suspect. Test them before you install them.
Did you test the starter before you installed it?

Is voltage getting to the starter when the solenoid clicks?
 
  #27  
Old 05-17-2017, 06:46 PM
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Woo Hoo..she is RUNNING!!!! Not sure exactly what finally did it. for the hell of it I got another solenoid (fourth solenoid...the cheapest at Advanced) and She STARTED!!! Woo Hoo..
We tested the starter before installing it. Right now she has a new starter and solenoid, the connections have been cleaned, made sure cables and wires tight, engine turns my hand. We are perplexed why she started with this solenoid and not the others. My son did find a bare wire he replaced, but this was nowhere near the solenoid. It was in a cluster of wires coming out of the firewall on the other side of the steering wheel/driver side. No idea if it had anything to do with starting issue. As of now, I have a starter and solenoid on order from Ford.
Thank you ALL for your help!!!
 
  #28  
Old 05-19-2017, 06:03 AM
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The bad starter was probably drawing so much current that it welded the contacts in your solenoids. Replacement solenoids are cheap and crappy anyway so they are easy to kill.

Checking the water and charging up the battery overnight would be a nice thing to do for your truck after all of this.
 
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